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Battlestar Galactica: The Board Game – Pegasus Expansion» Forums » General

Subject: Which items to use rss

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Joel Tamburo
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I have been looking into how best to get my group into the expansion. My current thinking is to add in Cylon Leaders, the new Sympathizer mechanic, the Pegasus board and the Treachery cards and new characters (excluding Cain).

Does anyone else have favored "mixes" of addons?
 
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Cameron McKenzie
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Joelist wrote:
I have been looking into how best to get my group into the expansion. My current thinking is to add in Cylon Leaders, the new Sympathizer mechanic, the Pegasus board and the Treachery cards and new characters (excluding Cain).

Does anyone else have favored "mixes" of addons?


None of them!
But if I have to pick, I will never use cylon leaders, sympathetic cylon, or New Caprica (at least not as written).
 
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Mark Thomason
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I would leave out the Cylon leaders and possibly New Caprica. Don't have enough experience with NC yet to say, but I would add in the new skill cards (including treachery) and the Pegasus board for starters and then new characters except cylon leaders.

I might consider cylon leaders with 4 or 6 or 7 players, but I think the real value in the expansion is entirely in the new characters and skill cards with Pegasus as a nice side.

I don't like Cain really either, but I just don't choose her because I don't like her. If she worries me too much I can always try and have her executed....
 
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Roberta Yang
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I would say to include:

1) The Cylon Leaders for 4/6-player games. And the Sympathetic Cylon for when nobody wants to be a Cylon Leader, though my group at least has never found that to be the case. They're a vital substitute for the awful Cylon Sympathizer mechanic; the only major problem is the Mutual Annihilation agenda card, which you should house-rule some way of circumventing so that someone doesn't play a Cylon leader, get stuck with it, and assume that Pegasus sucks.

2) The Cylon Locations overlay, along with associated rules like the new rule for passing Loyalty cards upon revealing.

3) Pegasus.

4) All the new Skill Cards, including Treachery and the revised Investigative Committees.

5) All the new regular Crisis Cards that do not involve Executions. Include all the new Quorum Cards, Destination Cards, and Super Crisis Cards.

6) All the new characters, except Helena Cain.

7) Those plastic Basestar models. Seriously, they're awesome.

Things to exclude:

1) New Caprica - that phase is complicated to explain, a jarring tonal shift, a severe alteration of the meaning of Population (Civilians don't matter, all other Population sources are vital), and general confusion. To ease people into Pegasus, keep New Caprica out and stick to the Kobol objective. Similarly, exclude the New Caprica Crisis deck.

2) Crisis Cards That Execute - the reason the execution mechanic, which provides an infallible Cylon Detector, is still balanced is that executing people via the Airlock is time-consuming, expensive, and unreliable. With the Crisis Cards that execute people, however, the execution is frequently presented as a penalty, and it is almost always worth choosing that option or deliberately failing the Skill Check to avoid spending other resources and to get the Cylon Detector effect. This makes it easy for a Crisis Card to randomly get a well-hidden Cylon executed, which is a good way to turn someone off Pegasus forever. (Execute Prisoner can be included or excluded depending on how you feel. At least, unlike the Crisis Cards, it costs a Quorum Card and an action, and it is directed at someone already brigged, not randomly assigned to someone unlucky.)

3) Helena Cain - she's broken. Or, objectively speaking, many people consider her broken and her OPG is extremely powerful, able to bypass ~20% of the game at the cost of a single Action and a couple of Civilians and get the humans out of a tight spot (like a Massive Assault).

4) The Mutual Annihilation Agenda - No, just no. A Cylon Leader with this agenda should be prepared for two and a half hours of boredom.

5) Cylon Leaders for 3/5-player games - A Cylon Leader aligned with the humans in such a scenario makes the game horribly unbalanced against the Cylons.

This should still provide a balanced game while avoiding dropping the expansion's more controversial elements immediately.
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I would go backwards and exclude Baltar. One of these games, I'm gonna choose Baltar again just so that some other lame-wad can't select him.
 
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Carl Bussema
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We play with everything except NC and only use Cylon leaders in a 6p game, but even then they're optional in favor of the Sympathetic Cylon (we never seem to have exactly 4 so I don't know what we'd do there). The agendas are a little lame and esp if you're getting yours halfway through, I strongly advocate draw 2 pick 1, because otherwise you may not have a chance at all.
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J Chav
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I was really worried about this expansion from all the negative feedback on here. When my group got this I was prepared for the worst.

My group just used everything except new cap the first time we played. We all loved it and will never use anything else ever again.

My absolute favorite is the new cylon locations. I like the treachery cards because I feel as a cylon I have more impact on the game.

I personally love the cylon leaders and haven't had any issues with what everyone else complains about. I've blown up pegasus with ease if need be. I've been able to send Cain into deep space.

I will have to look at Mutual card and see.

We still haven't used New Cap but that's tomorrow night.

edit: Also I agree Cylon Leaders should never be used with 5 players.
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Cameron McKenzie
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I wouldn't say that a lot of people have negative feedback for Pegasus.

It's just that those of us that do are very loud about it! The base game is phenomenal, so it's easy to be disappointed by an expansion that is merely mediocre.
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Gerry Smit
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MasterDinadan wrote:
I wouldn't say that a lot of people have negative feedback for Pegasus.

It's just that those of us that do are very loud about it! The base game is phenomenal, so it's easy to be disappointed by an expansion that is merely mediocre.


I think that's it. Base game was a home run, Peggy Sue is at best a double.
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Nate Owens
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It depends on how experienced you are with the original game, but I say just toss it all in there. I've found the BGG criticism of this expansion to be a touch hyperbolic. So I say, use the whole deal. Are we really that worried about unbalancing a game that was only won by the humans 20% of the time in the first place?

That's my two cents anyway. I think it's a great expansion. Use it all, dude.
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Gerry Smit
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There's a frequency of play thing too. If you're playing this twice a week, all the so called broken issues may float to the top, or you drop into ruts to exploit them.

If you're playing once a month or less, some of this just won't come up with your group. Enjoy the immersive experience.
 
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Carl Bussema
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Nate's got a great point... even with my experienced playgroup and Pegasus (without NC), the Cylons are still mopping up every game. We've had some close ones but it's been a long time since the humans have won. Partly that's due to experimenting with some variants to make the cylons a little stronger, and the last game was just horrible luck (literally -- we took about 8 actions to kill one boarding party because we never rolled high enough even with the bloody strat plan!), but I haven't felt like Pegasus is significantly lopsided toward the humans, just a little bit.
 
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Todd France
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How experienced are they with the base game at this point?

If it's getting to be somewhat rote to them, I'd go ahead and throw everything in.

If they're still learning nuances, I'd leave out the Cylon Leaders, New Caprica, and the Sympathetic Cylon (though if you can avoid that by playing 5 players, that's probably the best solution) for the first game.

Anything short of this is an unofficial variant which may or may not cause balance issues. You can't add Pegasus, the characters, the new Crisis cards, or the new Skill cards without also introducing the treachery deck, and once you've made the change with the treachery deck, you might as well throw those 3 in as well. Short of that, you could just add in the revised Cylon Locations and Investigative Committee. I suspect that should work o.k., though I still haven't had a chance to try.
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Nate Owens
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I haven't played nearly as much BSG with the expansion, although I love it. Out of maybe 25+ games of the original, humans won maybe 6-7 times. Of our 5 games of Pegasus, humans have won twice already. So it does shift it a little more towards the humans, but that's not a bad thing at all.

The only thing that really adds in rules weight is New Caprica, so when I explain the expansion I usually save the NC explanation until we actually get there. If your players are already familiar with the base game, all of the other elements will come fairly naturally.

I also feel like the expansion was meant to be played as a whole, with all of the elements in place. If you really want to make it modular though, just playing with Pegasus/treachery and the new characters will do fine.
 
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Cameron McKenzie
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I gave it a 4 ;-)
 
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J Chav
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Base game; we are, humans 2 cylon 10 (Note cylons won straight 8 games before the humans one).

Expansion; Humans 1 cylons 2.

edit: I gave it a 10.
 
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Nate Owens
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Danath wrote:
Base game; we are, humans 2 cylon 10 (Note cylons won straight 8 games before the humans one).


We went 15 before the humans finally won.

I give both the base game and the expansion a 10. BSG is my very favorite game, and I never play without the expansion if I can help it.
 
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J Chav
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BTW Nate... Team Jake!
 
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Cameron McKenzie
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For what it's worth, humans win probably 40-50% of the time in our group with the base game and I only remember humans losing with Pegasus a handful of times.
 
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Roberta Yang
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DCAnderson wrote:
Oh, and just because I was curious,

BGG rating for Battlestar Galactica: 7.88

BGG rating for Pegasus: 8.05

Yah, people obviously can't stand this expansion


It's standard expansion rating inflation. People who hate the entire concept and base mechanics gave the base game a low rating but didn't rate the expansion. The people who rated the expansion almost all liked the original, which gives it a significant advantage.
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Carl Bussema
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MasterDinadan wrote:
For what it's worth, humans win probably 40-50% of the time in our group with the base game and I only remember humans losing with Pegasus a handful of times.


Yeah, I think it's obvious (cf: Razor Cut) that you have a very strong group of human players, and/or your Cylons need to learn how to work together better and maybe be a little less human.

Before Pegasus we were starting to hit nearly 50-50 I'd say, but our group hasn't adjusted well to learning when and how to use the Pegasus locations... they still think that you should use pilots to go shoot things... silly, that's what Main Batteries are for!
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J Chav
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The main batteries slaughtered the humans in one of our games... what are the odds you would roll three 1's in a row???
 
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DCAnderson wrote:
Danath wrote:
The main batteries slaughtered the humans in one of our games... what are the odds you would roll three 1's in a row???


That's why you use them before the raiders make it to a space with civilians in it.
Yeah, always easier said than done
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Carl Bussema
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If the raiders have caught up with the civvies, just use comms and keep the raiders on a wild goose chase.
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David Goldfarb
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InfoCynic wrote:
If the raiders have caught up with the civvies, just use comms and keep the raiders on a wild goose chase.
Not always possible -- see for instance the current situation in PBF game #57.

BTW, someone above was worrying about a 4/6 Sympathetic Cylon getting Mutual Annihilation. But that's not possible, as MA is a Hostile Agenda, not a Sympathetic one.
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