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Subject: New refined request thread for me and my girlie. rss

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Peter Rovaniemi
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Well,
after my last thread, that soon bacame filled with helpfull advise, some time chacking in stores, us playing a bit more multiplayer CIV 4 on the pc and a lot more time spent on this amazing website: I now post a new refined request for recommendations. This time with preferences that this time have more substance to them.

Hope you all dont mind going another round with me here *DING DING DING*

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Ok here we go:

Me and my girlfriend are looking for a boardgame to survive these damn rainy days here in Brussels.
Here follows some mechanics and features that appeal to us:

- Conquest!

- A world map to move around on: Area movement/control game i guess it is called.

- Plastic models for troops and such things, or something similar. Well in general good production values like that, so it feels you payed for something "real". So no pure card games.

- Combined arms. Use of multiple unit types to enhance your tactical advantage in battles.

- Use of dices (preferably special ones with images on them, she really likes that) to resolve fighting etc.

- Use of cards to get a strategic upper hand etc. Event cards.

- Fantasy is not a stopper, but we prefer that if it is to be fantasy, it should lean more to the medieval times then orcs and elfs. Still theme is not THAT important.

- We will 90% of the time play this game with only the 2 of us. So the game should be OK with only 2 players.

- Timespan of 1-4 hours from start to finish.

- Good player to player interaction

- Not to hard to learn, but deep and replayable. We will buy ONE game for now so it would be nice to have it around AND beingfn for a while.With "not to hard" i just mean it should not be to sluggishly complex, we both grasp strategy games on the PC good etc so we are not to alien to these concepts.

- Different ways to victory: War might be a strong part but still other means to reach a victory is welcome. This expands on the fun and replayability a lot. To be able to chose different paths to glory is always welcome.

- Ways of coming back from suffering heavy losses etc, rise up and in the end eaven win the game!

- Assymetrical factions adds a lot of flavour.

- Some evolution of your empire, from tech trees or/and building up buildings in regions to enhance your empire.

- Would be nice to get the game for less then 70€ delivered to us here in brussels



So the above preferences are just that, preferences. Feel free to recomend games that just fill a few or you thinbk just would fit us.

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Here are some games we looked into that seems to fit in:

- Age of Conan

- Warrior knights: Although no dice and bad for 2 players if i got my facts straight.

- Conquest of the Empire

- Magnifico: My girl really liked the art and the theme of this

- Rune wars: Seems a bit to fantasy heavy and EXPENSIVE at least around here.

- Dust: This seems like a RISK variant that has mor etactical depth to it.

- War of the Ring



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PC games we like:

- Civilization 4

- The total war series: Has a nice mix of being focused on battle but still has some politics etc in the mix to get the upper hand.

- Panzer genral/Advance wars: For the use of different units in a rock papers scissors manner.

- RTS games focused on the fighting but still having some bas building (Company of heroes)

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Boardgames we checked out that could have fitted but we for some reason dont feel like getting... phew :

- Smallworld: Fealt to silly

- RISK: To little to it

- Axies and allies: Dont know, just dont feel like it. I played it and i dont think it fits us. Other games that are similar might, this just does not.



So what do you guys and gals say?

Also, can anyone recommend online stores that has low prices and realatively low shipping rates? Getting games here from WITHIN brussels to good prices seems a bit hard.

Cheers.
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You mentioned that it was something you looked at and I would say War of the Ring (First Edition) ticks most of the boxes on your list.

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Brian Gee
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One game that seems to match many of your criteria is Battlelore. It has plastic units, combined arms, use of cards, and has dice with special symbols to resolve conflicts. And although it is fantasy theme, it leans more towards the realistic medieval side of things. You don't really build up and produce troops though, you start with a starting scenario.

Another suggestion would be Nexus Ops. It also has plastic troops, combined arms, use of cards (secret missions and tactical cards), and also uses dice to resolve combat (no special symbols though). This game definitely reminds me of RTS computer games, it has exploration, resource mining, and troop production.

Based on your preferred game length and your interest in the civilization pc game, I'm thinking that you might be looking for a longer game that has more civ building aspects to it. As I tend to prefer games that are 2 hours or less, this is not my area of expertise, so hopefully others can provide recommendations that lean to the longer side.
 
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Gary Bacchus
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It's not classic "high" fantasy, but try Chaos in the Old World
 
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Ian Peters-Campbell
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Except for the Fantasy part War of the Ring sounds kind of perfect for you.
 
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Nacho Facello
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peXmo wrote:
- Smallworld: Fealt to silly


I take it that's because of the theme. In that case, you might want to take a look at Vinci. It's not supposed to be playable with less than 3 (although it has rules for 2 and solo play), but I think it's a very good game.
 
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Matthew O'Malley
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Check out the following:

Stronghold (good for 2 players, I haven't played it so don't know quite how many other of your requirements it fits, but it looks like it should fit a lot)
Advanced Civilization (great for most of your requirements, except for combined arms, and while I've enjoyed it with 2 players, it's more fun with more but can take a loooooong time to play. it uses chits rather than plastic models, but that's necessary because they represent your money on the flip side)
 
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Mike
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BattleLore sounds almost exactly like what you're looking for. Also Memoir '44 might be better if you prefer a game that isn't fantasy/medieval themed.

You might also want to look into one of the newer versions of Risk. Risk: Godstorm and Risk 2210 A.D. are two popular variations.

If you want a uniquely themed game like that than I would recommend Primordial Soup or Evo. Though both games technically require 3 people, I believe 2 player variants exist. Valley of the Mammoths is another uniquely themed game that you could look into.

I happen to really enjoy War on Terror. My girlfriend and I find it to be funny and rather enjoyable with just two. It's certainly not for everyone though...

Age of Empires III: The Age of Discovery actually sounds like a good fit as well. So does Mare Nostrum now that I think about it.

Good Luck!

- Mike


[Edit - added Mare Nostrum and Age of Empires)]
 
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Abraham Drucker
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Memoir '44 is much easier to find that Battlelore (although they are based on the same combat system) and is being fully supported by DoW while Battlelore is in a state of limbo.

I would also second Nexus Ops. It is out of print, but is still very easy to find.

Age of Empires III is a great game, but I'm not sure how it would play with two. I find it best with 5 or 6.

You should also check out Twilight Struggle. No dice, but it has area control, cards, asymetrical factions, ways to come back and win the game etc... You may be disappointed by the lack of plastic and dice though. (I think that there are random elements though, but it's been a while since I've played. It's little brother 1960 has some randomness).

You should also check out Space Hulk. It might be out of your price range ($100 USD), but it has a lot of plastic, a lot of dice and a lot of head to head action. It should also be relatively easy to find in Europe since it is Games Workshop.

To go once more down the wargame path, you might want to check out
Conflict of Heroes. I haven't played it, but it's gotten great reviews.
 
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Peter Rovaniemi
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Quote:
peXmo wrote:
- Smallworld: Fealt to silly


I take it that's because of the theme. In that case, you might want to take a look at Vinci. It's not supposed to be playable with less than 3 (although it has rules for 2 and solo play), but I think it's a very good game.


Yeah it is correct. The theme fealt for both of us a bit to silly. Saw Vinci in a store but didnt really check it out. Maybe should after this tip

Quote:


It's not classic "high" fantasy, but try Chaos in the Old World


From my searches around here my impression was that this game is not good as a 2 player game at all, or... does it play ok with 2??


Quote:
One game that seems to match many of your criteria is Battlelore. It has plastic units, combined arms, use of cards, and has dice with special symbols to resolve conflicts. And although it is fantasy theme, it leans more towards the realistic medieval side of things. You don't really build up and produce troops though, you start with a starting scenario.


Yeah, this was suggested to me before to. The only thing is the lack of a world map, yeah you have the hexagons there and some terrain tiles. But i might be able to pursuade past this fact One question i have is if there is anything that fixes the fact of "You don't really build up and produce troops though" - like a expansion that adds at least player bought or in some way player driven setups of units, some addition of presistance and such?

Quote:
Based on your preferred game length and your interest in the civilization pc game, I'm thinking that you might be looking for a longer game that has more civ building aspects to it. As I tend to prefer games that are 2 hours or less, this is not my area of expertise, so hopefully others can provide recommendations that lean to the longer side.


I do not prefer long games at all, just that we are ok with games that takes a bit longer too.


 
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Brian Gee
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peXmo wrote:
One question i have is if there is anything that fixes the fact of "You don't really build up and produce troops though" - like a expansion that adds at least player bought or in some way player driven setups of units, some addition of presistance and such?


Yes, I believe the expansion "Call to Arms" attempts something like this, but I haven't tried it out yet myself.

peXmo wrote:
I do not prefer long games at all, just that we are ok with games that takes a bit longer too.


Then I would even more strongly recommend Nexus Ops.
 
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Doug Acker
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You might enjoy Victory II http://www.boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/23950/viktory-ii

The "world" is different every game, the pieces are toy soldiers, cannon, sailing ships, houses. Combat is all about combined arms.
 
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Robert Washington

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I'm very familiar with CONQUEST OF THE EMPIRE, DUST, NEXUS OPS and BATTLELORE, and I'd say your assessments of the 1st 2 are pretty accurate, though I think they might be a bit dry 2 player, and I also think BATTLELORE and NEXUS OPS are maybe your best bets, though it both lack multiple paths to victory.

I too am a big fan of WAR ON TERROR, though I'm not sure I'd recommend it 2 player.

Outside of these, I'd also consider El Grande, Wallenstein (first edition), and it's 'sibling', Shogun, all of which have more flexible victory conditions and solid bits (though you'll have to get used to little wooden cubes for troops).

If you're feeling really gung-ho, definitely think about the out of print classics Ikusa, Blood Feud in New York, the slightly-flawed-but-well-wroth-considering-for-the-qualities-you're-looking-for Age of Mythology: The Boardgame, and Serenissima (first edition) - any/all are easily worth the effort on ebay.
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Peter Rovaniemi
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Quote:
I'm very familiar with CONQUEST OF THE EMPIRE, DUST, NEXUS OPS and BATTLELORE, and I'd say your assessments of the 1st 2 are pretty accurate, though I think they might be a bit dry 2 player, and I also think BATTLELORE and NEXUS OPS are maybe your best bets, though it both lack multiple paths to victory.


Care to elaborate on why Conquest of the Empire would be dry as a 2 player game? Is it because of the diplomacy side of thngs not working good with 2 players?

Quote:

Outside of these, I'd also consider El Grande, Wallenstein, and it's 'sibling', Shogun, all of which have more flexible victory conditions and solid bits (though you'll have to get used to little wooden cubes for troops)
.

Wallenstein and Shogun seems to run into the 2player problem. they state 3+ players here on the site, so i guess that is how it is. Grrr that we are only 2

Samurai Swords looks damn good - seems to have combined arms and all and is set within one of my favourite eras too. A pity it is OOP though.Anyone know how it fares as a 2 player game?

Still trying to sell the idea on BattleLore - The map, the limited pre developement before the tactical fight and a steep price (at least here, if anyone can point me to a place that is fairly cheap please do) is fighting a bit against ths game, still it seems like a good choise for us.
Nexus ops might bea nice game but the look n feel did not appeal at all here.

Conquest, Conan, War of the ring and battlelore is still being looked into - Any more advice on these games? Conan seem to totally lack combined arms, only flaw i see there. Conquest seems to have nice combat system etc but might be a bit to heavy on the diplomacy side to work with 2 players. Still i cant find that many more games with just a bit of "building houses and producing a well balanced force". Checked into the RISK variants. The godstorm seemed to get meh reviews here, and the SCI-FI one i tried and think was a quite ok game, but not sure how it would fare with only us 2 playing it.
Rune Wars was brought up by a friend, although pricy and maybe a bit to fantasy heavy. How do you guys/gals feel about that one as a 2 player game?

Thanks for all the nice advice so far people, hats off!



EDIT:
Does anyone know of video reviews for the suggested games in this thread? Also a simpler review/summary of battlelore then the one i found at board games with Scott?
 
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Ed Bradley
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jakal323 wrote:
It's not classic "high" fantasy, but try Chaos in the Old World


Yes! You'll need at least 3 and preferably 4 players but this game is a perfect match for most of your criteria.
 
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Peter Rovaniemi
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Yeah, it is a pity that Chaos in the old world is for 3 not for us 2, seems like a really smart game.

How does Tides of Iron fare, is it a heavy game when it comes to complexity? Seems to have a quite good game feel to it, over simulation - Reminds me of the way Company of heroes takes on ww2 wargaming on the PC.
 
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Robert Washington

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peXmo wrote:


Care to elaborate on why Conquest of the Empire would be dry as a 2 player game? Is it because of the diplomacy side of things not working good with 2 players?


Precisely so - in addition to the alliance auction being pointless, there's also the Senate Votes that become 2-sided struggles instead of the Diplomacy/Negotiating/Backstabbing Festivals they can be.

Quote:

Outside of these, I'd also consider El Grande, Wallenstein, and it's 'sibling', Shogun, all of which have more flexible victory conditions and solid bits (though you'll have to get used to little wooden cubes for troops)
.

peXmo wrote:

Wallenstein and Shogun seems to run into the 2player problem. they state 3+ players here on the site, so i guess that is how it is. Grrr that we are only 2

Samurai Swords looks damn good - seems to have combined arms and all and is set within one of my favourite eras too. A pity it is OOP though.Anyone know how it fares as a 2 player game?


Wasn't thinking hard enough about the 2-player preference - yes, it's a shame.

I've only played SWORDS multi-player and it's been awhile, but from what I recall it should work ok.

peXmo wrote:

Still trying to sell the idea on BattleLore - The map, the limited pre developement before the tactical fight and a steep price (at least here, if anyone can point me to a place that is fairly cheap please do) is fighting a bit against ths game, still it seems like a good choise for us.


The Campaign rules help a bit with that, and the CALL TO ARMS expansion allows you to structure your own setup quite a bit, but that's even more money isn't it?

peXmo wrote:

Nexus ops might bea nice game but the look n feel did not appeal at all here.


I can understand that - it is pretty cartoony-looking. It is surprisingly good stuff, though.

peXmo wrote:

Conquest, Conan, War of the ring and battlelore is still being looked into - Any more advice on these games?


I only know CONQUEST and BATTLELORE, but all I think of beyond what I've said is CONQUEST feels like a truly epic game - it's not just about winning battles or Diplomacy, you also need to gain (and keep) the upper hand in influence in a decent number of areas - keeping with the both your overall military power and influence feels really satisfyingly big somehow - of course, the 3 feet by 4 feet map and its 2-4 hour running time might help on that...

BATTLELORE can be very satisfying and has a lot of replayability, but I know many who feel the setup for this and all the C&C games can be a bit tedious.

EDIT: Actually, one thing more - BATTLELORE has many very cool elements, but all the C&C games are so very card-driven it often feels like it's not about who's doing the best job, but about who's got the right Movement cards coming up at the right time - it's not uncommon to get totally chewed up by an opponent for no other reason than

- you can't seem to come up with a Movement card that will lewt you move any units in/to the section you're getting hosed on or

- you can't seem to get a card that will let you move enough units on/to that section to make a difference

so in can sometimes feel kind of unsatisfying, likewise with MEMOIR '44, BATTLE CRY and C&C ANCIENTS.
 
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