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Subject: How to make HeroQuest alittle more challenging? rss

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Josh Camper
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Hi everyone,

About a year ago I came across a 100% entact game of Heroquest at a flea market for 5.00 and bought it. I had some friends come over to play it. The guys enjoyed the game for the first 5-6 quests, but from quest 7-14 the group started to complain. As they equipped their characters with better equipment and armor it became easier for them to kill the monsters and complete the quests. They liked the concept of the game not knowing where things are and what is behind the doors, but they found the monsters and the "big bad" at the end of the quest booklet a bit lacking.

My question is: How can I make the game more challenging without destroying the balance? I have thought about adding more hit points to the monsters and providing them with equipment.

All comments are appreciated. Many Thanks!
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Ronster Zero
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I had the same problem. Eventually I just started "buffing" out the boss monster at the end. Give him extra health and maybe spells back. Also, double the minions just for good measure.

But basically the game does get unbalanced towards the end.
 
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Slev Sleddeddan
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What part of "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn" don't you understand?
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I upped the prices of equipment. I kept the lower-end items cheap, but made the high-end items cost considerably more. To keep the ballence, I then added a number of extra items. in the "gaps".

My project is here: http://www.freewebs.com/heroquestrevised/
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Simon Lundström
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Now who are these five?
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Don't worry that much about balance in Hero Quest. You can easily add some hit points to some of the monsters without tipping it; just look at the damage the heroes do. Adding some monsters to the rooms is also a good thing. If the heroes are familiar with the scenarios, switch some of the things, place monsters elsewhere, so they don't know what to expect in rooms.

Don't be afraid to fix things on the fly. If you realise the heroes have cut throught every monster, just raise the boss monster's stats a bit.

Once there, start making own cards with equipment. Or new traps.

Depends on, of course, if you play HeroQuest for the adventure or for the competition. I wouldn't recommend the latter if you're tweaking the rules. If you end up "winning", the heroes will whine that you OP:ed the game.
 
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Josh Camper
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Slev wrote:
I upped the prices of equipment. I kept the lower-end items cheap, but made the high-end items cost considerably more. To keep the ballence, I then added a number of extra items. in the "gaps".

My project is here: http://www.freewebs.com/heroquestrevised/



Did you create this?
 
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RedPlanet
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Even my 10yr old was cruising through!

i changed the monster defense to the hero defense, and gave the monsters Hit Points.

That made it a bit harder.

And the Dungeon Master = poetic license , make up enemy spells to destroy any weapon that's too powerful , or magic proof rooms etc , etc.....

 
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Simon Lundström
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Something in the difficulty must be different with the UK version… Some months ago, we had a joke "Let's do the basic HeroQuest". Perhaps because we were only 2 heroes, but we got absolutely mashed. The wizard searched a room, got a wandering monster, got insta-killed… happened even with the elf.
 
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Shoosh shoo
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Not sure if anyone still plays this regularly or will even read this post, but I have a possible suggestion: I always thought the dice were a major problem for the monsters. Monsters have a poor chance to defend due to there being only one black shield. What if you made dice that had 2 black shields, 2 white shields, and two skulls (as opposed to the original 3 skulls, 2 white shields, 1 black shield)? These dice could easily be made. I think there is a file on this board that is a sticker sheet which has all of the symbols for the dice. They can be printed out onto sticker paper and stuck to blank dice.
 
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Toco
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Quote:
My question is: How can I make the game more challenging without destroying the balance?


Have a go with "Allied HeroQuest". (Google it.) It combines all good elements from HQ, Advanced HeroQuest and Descent. The user reviews are very positive, so I hope you like it too. (Offcourse, you need 1 copy of Advanced HeroQuest too.)

Quote:
Monsters have a poor chance to defend due to there being only one black shield.


Yes, but there are way more monsters than heroes. And the monsters can pack-attack. For the heroes to stand any change of survival, I wouldn't tamper with the dice. Less skulls on the dice will only slow the game down, for fights will last longer.
 
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Baldwin Swanborn
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I'm currently working on a "timer" for each quest. After the time (ie number of turns) has passed, monsters start to sprawl from the staircase. Slowly at first, but at an increasing rate afterwards. This makes sure your players are not "coasting" it but keep the pace which forces them to take risks. It's also easy to incorporate from a storytelling perspective, as you can hear the footsteps of many reinforcements in the distance

I still need to do the math behind it, check how many turns it takes to complete each mission as quickly as possible, how much slack you're willing to allow your players and think about other metrics as well.

Advice is as usual appreciated!
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Patrick G.
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Always play with American rules. Gives the monsters more than one hit point.
Remember you can only attack with one weapon at a time. We messed this up for years. So the most a hero will usually roll is 3 or 4.

If you want a real challenge play the British expansions with American rules for monsters. Talk about terrifying.
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Steve Shockley
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Fompel wrote:
I'm currently working on a "timer" for each quest. After the time (ie number of turns) has passed, monsters start to sprawl from the staircase. Slowly at first, but at an increasing rate afterwards. This makes sure your players are not "coasting" it but keep the pace which forces them to take risks. It's also easy to incorporate from a storytelling perspective, as you can hear the footsteps of many reinforcements in the distance ;)

I still need to do the math behind it, check how many turns it takes to complete each mission as quickly as possible, how much slack you're willing to allow your players and think about other metrics as well.

Advice is as usual appreciated!


I like this idea.

One thing I do to address the problem of heroes assuming a leisurely pace is to roll a die at the end of any hero turn during which there are no monsters on the board; on a roll of 5 or 6, Zargon spawns 1d3 wandering monsters anywhere out of hero LOS. You can make it a roll of 6 to make it slightly easier.

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Patrick G.
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Magnus Maximus wrote:
Fompel wrote:
I'm currently working on a "timer" for each quest. After the time (ie number of turns) has passed, monsters start to sprawl from the staircase. Slowly at first, but at an increasing rate afterwards. This makes sure your players are not "coasting" it but keep the pace which forces them to take risks. It's also easy to incorporate from a storytelling perspective, as you can hear the footsteps of many reinforcements in the distance

I still need to do the math behind it, check how many turns it takes to complete each mission as quickly as possible, how much slack you're willing to allow your players and think about other metrics as well.

Advice is as usual appreciated!


I like this idea.

One thing I do to address the problem of heroes assuming a leisurely pace is to roll a die at the end of any hero turn during which there are no monsters on the board; on a roll of 5 or 6, Zargon spawns 1d3 wandering monsters anywhere out of hero LOS. You can make it a roll of 6 to make it slightly easier.


Oh yeah that would be good. Much like in Descent: Journeys in the Dark time is NOT your friend.
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Frank Clarke
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When you kill a monster without losing health, Zargon has a 1 in 3 chance of spawning a wandering monster 10 squares away from the dead monster.


This works for all sorts of games, a negative feedback loop on the player's success.
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Baldwin Swanborn
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Ok, so maybe I went just a liiiittle bit overboard with this, but here's what I came up with. (btw, this is for the EU versions of the game, not the US one)

-Set aside an extra copy of all monsters to be found in the quest in a reinforcements pool (don't show this to the players)
-Determine how much turns the quest should take. This is done by adding 3 numbers together:
1)Determine the minimum amount of turns it takes for 1 hero to complete the quest and return to the spiral staircase (using 7 as movement value)
2)Calculate the total monstervalue by using the table below

goblin:# * 0,25
skeleton:# * 0,5
zombie:# * 0,75
orc:# * 1
fimir:# * 1,25
mummy:# * 1,5
chaos warrior:# * 1,75
gargoyle:# * 2

3) multiply the number of secret doors by 3

Once you have this number, deduct one each time a player takes a turn, but add one for each turn played by Morcar/Zargon. The reason you need to add each time Morcar/Zargon plays his turn is to adopt this number to the number of players in the quest: the more players, the less turns Morcar/Zorgan has relatively. This results in less time for more players, as they have it easier with more bashing power on their side. (IN the unlikely event of only one hero, don't add anymore)
Once the counter reaches zero, announce to the players
you hear the sound of footsteps in the distance. Hurry my heroes, for reinforcements are coming!

As of then, at the start of each player turn, roll a dice. On a six, take the monster with the highest movement value from the reinforcements pool and put it on a spot next to the spiral staircase. Each time it's Morcar/Zargon's turn, deduct one from the number needed to be rolled, until you just put monsters at the end of every turn.

For The Trial, the calculations are: 10 (fastest possible) + 30 + 0 = 40
I tested this, and it felt like a really good timing.
Please let me know what you think, I already really appreciated your feedback.

What I personal went for with this approach is a focus on the exploring part of the game, and the quest emphasis. Although I'm confident that using the US rules, or adding more monsters def increases the difficulty, I'm a bit afraid it just turns the game in a slugfest.

Enjoy!
 
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