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Subject: HeroClix VS HeroScape Vs BattleTech rss

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Tomas Syrovatka
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I have never played HeroClix but Battletech was the game that got me into boardgaming. It is more complex than Heroscape but I like it a lot, it can support almost any number of players and building your own mechs is fun. HS is simpler but it has an adorable terrain and the figures are very nicely painted. The downside is that a lot of the terrain is OOP and the eBay prices tend to be outrageous sometimes.

Verdict: If you are looking for a casual gaming, get HS. If you have enough time to play and build and customise your forces, try Battletech.

Ideal solution: Play BT on HS terrain
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J.
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OOP means out of print. Never played Battletech myself, but I have played each of the other two. HeroClix never clicked (hahaha) for me, mostly due to the collectability aspect of it, I think. The game plays just fine from what I remember but is nothing special, and I am not (in general) a fan of "pieces get gradually worse until they're killed" mechanics, or at least not to the extent that HC does it. I suppose it also helps to be a comic book fan familiar with the characters you're playing, as for me, there wasn't enough in the gameplay alone to keep me around. This is based on only the first few Marvel sets, however.

HeroScape, though, is a fantastic game. While HeroClix had a pretty boring map that you could add tokens to to add scenery (I think there was something else as well...), HS plays differently every time since the board is different every time (as long as you feel like changing it). Setup time and play time tend to be longer than HC as well, from what I remember. Given the choice, I'd play HS every day and not even think about HC (and I am a huge comic book fan).

Also, I can get my girlfriend to play HeroScape, so that's a huge plus.

HC:
HS:

Just my .02.
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Ian Engleback
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I played Battletech when it first came out (c.1985), with "cardboard hero" figures, I still have this version of the game. I wasn't impressed with the gameplay and I hated the paperwork, and the depth of play was limited. The RPG element seemed a bit weak compared to other systems. I've no idea how the game rules have progressed, what the figures are like and what expansions have developed, however, it is certainly a game I would get back off the shelf and play again.

I got into HeroClix some time back, it is a great game with enormous potential for strategic variance, the rules are simple but complex because each figure has its own set of powers. The biggest obstacle is cost, the game is "collectable" meaning you get vast numbers of figures you'll probably never use, and the "Rookie - Experienced - Veteran" format makes this worse, I amassed over 1,000 figures and still couldn't be called a serious collector. The Clix system is an excellent idea and reduces "playing area", although it is prone to breakage. The figure collection spans all comic themes; Marvel, DC and independent.

Heroscape is probably my favourite, the board set up is laborious but can be fun in itself and the results are amazing, check out some of the creations in the game gallery. The gameplay is excellent coming from a really simple set of rules. The only problem is the availability of figures, most are like hen's teeth to obtain, and thus are expensive, especially in the UK. Not as strategic as HeroClix but simpler to play. my only gripe on Heroscape is the size of the playing area, not only can the board get huge but the army cards take a lot of room.

As mentioned, the Heroscape board can be used for other games.
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sidney poitier
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Which do you prefer, superheroes, fantasy or mechs?

Clix is ok, and you can get hold of any heroes or villains you want. I think it is a better game using house rules rather than some of the official ones, though. The actual clix dial design is pretty cool, all of the stats/powers are on the dial.

Heroscape is a bit more streamlined than clix, and I think it plays a bit better because of it. The terrain and figures are very good. Characters have a few abilities each, whereas in clix they have several powers which change as you take damage. Both have a significant luck factor due to the dice based combat mechanics.

There is a Marvel Heroscape set, but there are no other expansions for it, so you would only have a limited set of figures to choose from. You could always use clix figures and convert them to heroscape rules (check out the custom section at Heroscapers.com).

I haven't played Battletech.

I'd give clix 3/5 and scape 4/5.
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Brenda Thorpe
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ive played all three. although ive not played heroscape very much (like maybe 3 times)

one thing i will say is that the 2 views on heroclix are from people that have not played the game in a while. the REV system is no longer really in use (tho the most recent set saw a slight return of it, it was for generic figures that players would want multiples of) also the steep drop off hasnt been a part of the game since john leithauser (sp) left as lead designer. i was never much of a fan of that either.

as far as the cost/collectible goes, heroclix can top out...if you MUST OWN EVER FIGURE zombie otherwise large collections (especially of older figures) can be had for very cheap. for that matter tho, the other games are gonna cost you as well. and im sure there are cheap and expensive options for both

the game is very versatile with a lot of strategic nuance. more than the other two id say. although again ive not played enough of heroscape to fully judge that. battletech does have some solid strategery, tho not as much as clix.

of course battletech lets you make your own mechs. its the most customizable. not that you cant make your own figures for the other games, but it at least requires some artistic finesse and at best you are making an educated guess at point values. i dont play battletech a lot (at least not as much as i did way back when in college) but we probably do at least once a year. and making your own mechs is stll always just as dang fun

i think they're all good games. heroscape seemd pretty cool the few times ive played it, and the terrain is very nice.

honestly i think the better question isn't "which game is better" but rather "which one will my friends actually play with me" or "which theme suits me more"
 
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I'm a Clix fan. Heroscape never did much for me. Never played the other one. IMO for Clix to work you probably need to be a comics fan. Else, it is a fairly average game. But if Playing Hulk v Supes amuses you it makes it a fun ride.
 
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Ryan Heac0ck
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One of these things are not like the others...... laugh

Heroscape: This game is a blast, simple and plays well with two or more. The characters are varied, taken from many differing genres. The terrian is great and it is all very durable. Setup and takedown can take awhile with only one person, but some believe that is part of the fun. There is also a thriving community with plenty of customization ideas. Also goes well with non-gamers and can provide an entry point to the wider world of wargaming. If you are interested in comic book heros check out the c3g project at www.heroscapers.com

Heroclix: HC still gets some play in my group. We forgo the maps and use tape measures ala MageKnight (its sister game). The power creep, revisions of the rules and CMG format pretty much drove me off. The play we get is with the earliest rule-set and minis. The variable powers and click gimmick help add depth to the battles. We have a good group of friends that handle rule ambiguities *fairly* well.

Battletech: This bad boy is another creature entirely (though I like to use my Heroscape terrian). BT is more complex than the others and has layers and leyers of technical options. It is consideralby older than the other two and has only suffered minor rule changes. The rich backdrop of the BT universe is fleshed out in countless rulebooks/scenario guides/novels/cartoons/online fiction/ etc. There are game-play options focusing on the individual soldier (Mechwarrior RPG) all the way to managing a planetary empire (Succession Wars) with literally every shade in-between. For me the sweet spot has always been lance-on-lance (4mech vs. 4mech) battles. It is a good combination of playability and managability. Be ready for loads of number-crunching, reference to tables and record-keeping. The Mechwarrior CMG removes some of the book-keeping and the expense of some "realism". Battletech has been my preferred game for over 15 years!

My suggestion would be to buy one or more of the Heroscape starter sets and download the intro rules for Battletech at www.classicbattletech.com This gives you two great games and terrain for a minor investment. You can use HS figures for BT mechs until you get a handle on whether or not you would like it.
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Ryan Heac0ck
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ian54 wrote:
I played Battletech ......the depth of play was limited.


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Ryan Heac0ck
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The latest BT boxed set does not have unit creation rules, but I believe that the older boxed sets did. Now there are so many options the rules for creation are found in a seperate volume. www.heavymetalpro.com sells the latest standard mech creation software, though free programs can be found.

The best collection of fan-made superheros/units are here

http://www.heroscapers.com/community/forumdisplay.php?f=20

This website hosts THE online Heroscape community. Colby aka ScreamingTruth aka Plaid Hat Games has nurtured an impressive collaboration of Heroscape fanatics whom provide better support than Ha$bro. Just use the search function, as they get a lil snarky with the newbs.......
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Gordon Berg
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More like design your mech, not literally build it. The look of the mech is strictly symbolic. You have rules to abide by in mech design. It can only weigh so many tons, have only so much room in each segment of your mech: the torso, arms, etc. What weapons will you choose and how many heatsinks? Do you like to snipe from long range or get up close and try to finish off your opponent in as few shots as possible? How much armor and where?

I haven't played this game in over twenty years and if I can get ahold of the introductory box set, I intend to start playing again. But the main appeal for me back then was the endless hours tweaking designs and then testing them out on the battlefield.

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Ryan Heac0ck
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LOL, a little clarification here. When us BTers talk of building mechs we are talking about designing mechs on paper (balancing weight, speed payload....etc). Any figures can be used as stand-ins for any mech and you will be fine with what comes in the intro set. As a matter of fact for getting started the Catalyst Games boxed set is a good way to get enough minis to start with. For serious modelling you will want metal minis from www.ironwindmetals.com or ebay, but you have what you need to get started. My only gripe in the intro set was the "quality" of the maps they provide. They do not want to lay flat and without care can be torn rather easily.
 
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Ryan Heac0ck
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That is WizKids now-defunct Mechwarrior: Dark Age I suppose the best bet for finding it is ebay. Keep in mind that it is a different scale than Classic Battletech minis and maps. I do believe some play Classic with these minis at a larger scale using 3d terrian and tape measures. After cutting my teeth on Classic, Mechwarrior seemed light years inferior...beautiful sculpts though!
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Mac Mcleod
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mrtech wrote:
Hi Which one would you recommend and what is the pros and cons of each plus can you give a rating out of 5 stars, 1 being worst, 5 being best.

Also how do you play each of these games?.

Thanks


I don't know about heroclix or battle tech but I really liked heroscape until the combo's came to dominate play. I don't have time or focus to work on all the combos so I preferred a simpler play style.

The basic rules are very solid tho it does feel like the combats take longer than that many pieces should (say 16 pieces- combat can take 3 hours) given the simplicity of the combat rules. It always felt quick while playing - just after a game, I'd think- wow that took "x hours".

 
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David C
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ian54 wrote:
I played Battletech when it first came out (c.1985), with "cardboard hero" figures, I still have this version of the game. I wasn't impressed with the gameplay and I hated the paperwork, and the depth of play was limited. The RPG element seemed a bit weak compared to other systems. I've no idea how the game rules have progressed, what the figures are like and what expansions have developed, however, it is certainly a game I would get back off the shelf and play again.

I got into HeroClix some time back, it is a great game with enormous potential for strategic variance, the rules are simple but complex because each figure has its own set of powers. The biggest obstacle is cost, the game is "collectable" meaning you get vast numbers of figures you'll probably never use, and the "Rookie - Experienced - Veteran" format makes this worse, I amassed over 1,000 figures and still couldn't be called a serious collector. The Clix system is an excellent idea and reduces "playing area", although it is prone to breakage. The figure collection spans all comic themes; Marvel, DC and independent.

Heroscape is probably my favourite, the board set up is laborious but can be fun in itself and the results are amazing, check out some of the creations in the game gallery. The gameplay is excellent coming from a really simple set of rules. The only problem is the availability of figures, most are like hen's teeth to obtain, and thus are expensive, especially in the UK. Not as strategic as HeroClix but simpler to play. my only gripe on Heroscape is the size of the playing area, not only can the board get huge but the army cards take a lot of room.

As mentioned, the Heroscape board can be used for other games.


You know, back in '95, battletech really was the only thing out there. That pretty much decided things for me.

While battletech was not a bad game, I liked the engineering, I liked the painting, but in the end it just wasn't worth it. So many tables, so much paperwork... and in the end, it really just slowed-down what could have otherwise been a very rich experience with rules and complications.

The one thing I do like about it more than heroscape though, was that line-of-sight was basically mathmatically determined.
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Heroscape is the one to go for. No blind buys.
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bippi wrote:

While battletech was not a bad game, I liked the engineering, I liked the painting, but in the end it just wasn't worth it. So many tables, so much paperwork... and in the end, it really just slowed-down what could have otherwise been a very rich experience with rules and complications.


For me, the rules and complications are part of what make the game such a rich experience. So much to keep track of. So much descriptive information. So many things that can happen, or, in my case, go wrong.
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Rick Koeppen
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I'm going to have to go with Sydney up there and say it depends on theme. They are all solid games in their genre. What I'm confused about is why this comparisson? Why not Mage Knight vs. HeroScape or Mechwarrior (clix) vs. BattleTech?

The original MechWarrior Dark Age line was well received and got pretty big to the point where you can still buy sealed cases on eBay. It is a lot easier to play (and in my opinion more fun) than BattleTech.

Mage Knight is the same way, and I prefer it to HeroScape, especially now that Wizards has taken them over.

Heroclix, well I am not a big fan of superheroes, so it all comes down to theme really. But on the plus side, they are still in production.
 
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Heroscape - It Rocks, easy to learn, yet very deep strategy, easy to customize, so much stuff out there for it already,

The Game I have waited My Whole Life For!
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Todd Pytel
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Several people stated that the Starter Box doesn't contain unit creation rules. That's not exactly accurate. The Starter Box does contain mech design rules, though they're limited to 3025-era tech. "3025-era" is the basic tech level for the game and lacks many of the later special rules, but many people (myself included) think it plays quite well without as much complication as the later tech eras introduced. In any event, you can build at least some mechs with the Starter Box. If you want the complete treatment (mechs plus vehicles, air units, infantry, etc. for every tech level), then you need (at least) the TechManual as well as Total Warfare (the core BT rules).

As far as BT vs. Scape vs. Clix goes, I haven't played Clix, so I can't comment much there. But BT and Scape are pretty much opposite ends of the gaming spectrum in terms of gameplay. Scape is a very light game. You could easily play the "Basic Game" (no special unit abilities) with a grade-school child. The full game (which is what people here would play) is still quite simple by gamers' standards - a typical battle would play out in an hour, and you pretty much never need to look up a rule once you've played a few times. That doesn't mean there's nothing to think about, but it's more of a game to play to relax and have fun than it is a game for which you prepare and study. Battletech, on the other hand, is much more involved, even at the simplest level. "Small" BT engagements will take several hours to play, and require lots of rule and chart lookups, constant calculations, etc. And then when you're not playing, you're probably painting figs, designing mechs or scenarios, reading background material, etc. I enjoy Battletech for its detail and sense of narrative, but it is - by today's standards - a rather sprawling and sloppy game. Clix, from what I understand, would be somewhere in the middle of the two - definitely a "gamer's game" with more significant rules and strategy than Scape, but also a much more modern, streamlined design compared to Battletech, at the expense of some of the mountains of detail that Battletech provides.

The Battletech Starter Box should be an excellent buy for you - I can't understand why people suggested you should have passed on it. You get the basic rules along with the mechs and maps you need to try a couple simple scenarios. There's certainly no cheaper way to try out Battletech short of finding some local players, as you'd otherwise be looking at $100+ at least for Total Warfare, maps, and minis.

I enjoy Heroscape a lot too, for completely different reasons than Battletech. But I will agree that getting it is going to be inconvenient, especially in Australia. Heroscape items are bulky and rarely found in the same place all at once. Even in the States, I feel like I'm getting reamed on shipping costs. If you decide to try Scape, you'll want to plan your orders carefully so that you don't end up wanting to buy another pack right away and have to pay more shipping. There are numerous threads in the Heroscape forums here that answer the "What should I buy first?" question. Please read those rather than ask that question again.

I have no idea what getting started in Clix entails. But you may want to do some research there. I suspect that it may suit your needs better than either Scape or BTech.
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Diz Hooper
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Heroscape all the way. No blind buys, so you know exactly what you're getting and you can build the army that you like to play pretty reasonably. Also, there's no paperwork or stats management, so non-gamers can get into it pretty easily (as long as you don't ask them to build their own army and then crush them).
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Michael Bowman
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The biggest problem with Marvel HeroScape is that it is unsupported. They released the one box with 8 figures, and they have no intention of releasing any expansions. Heroclix has literally thousands of characters to choose from.
As someone else said, WK is still making Heroclix, so that's a big plus. The first Marvel HeroScape expansion prototype was shown at Gencon over 3 years ago. It has never seen the light of day since. When I asked Hasbro at their booth the following year, they were snotty and rude and said that they have no intention of releasing it.

For that reason alone, I'd pick Heroclix.

Also, I've never been a Mechwarrior guy.
 
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There's a whole lot of HeroScape out there. Marvel didn't fly, but that's no reason to ignore the rest of it.
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Is it true that the characters in Marvel HeroScape have skewed points scales? As in, they don't fit into regular HS well? I've heard that, not sure about it.
 
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JBellor wrote:
Is it true that the characters in Marvel HeroScape have skewed points scales? As in, they don't fit into regular HS well? I've heard that, not sure about it.


People disagree about that. They are very powerful, but also have very high point values. There are also many non-Marvel figures that are considered either over- or under-valued.
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Todd Pytel
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jayg wrote:
There certainly is a cheaper way. If the intent is just to try it out you can download everything you need... for free.

Sure. If you don't mind printing everything out, taking time to assemble it all, and playing with a homemade set that will look like garbage. Personally, I'd rather pay the $30 (?) for the Starter even just to try it. If you don't like it, you can always pack it back up and resell it for $20. You can't resell a bunch of home-printed maps, rules, and standups, nor recover the time you spent making them.

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That's certainly cheaper and doesn't ultimately saddle you with a box set that will most likely wind up on the shelf collecting dust. Assuming you like the game and want to really get into it.

Even assuming that, you can go a decent ways with the Starter. Only the maps are total crap. Some of the Mech sculpts are decent, some are quite poor. But they're all usable enough while you take the time to purchase and assemble the metal figs you want. And the rules are also fine for as long as you're happy playing 3025 mech fights - there's nothing in TW or anything else that the basic rulebook lacks for those. Sure, you'll probably want to try more eventually, but at least there's no hurry to go buy a $40 hardcover.

I don't get the hate. It's a cheap starter, by design. No, you probably wouldn't keep anything from it in the long term if you get into the game. But it gets you started for a reasonable price, with everything you need in one place. You can build on it from there as your finances and interest see fit.

Also, if you're going to hate on the Starter, be sure to specify how much your first step costs once you move beyond the print-and-play stage. I'm tallying about $140 minimum ($30 TW + $80 minis + $20 maps + $10 record sheets).
 
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