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Subject: New RSPer of week or so - Mondainai rss

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Bojan Ramadanovic
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Ladies and gentlemen, I present to you, from the (almost) Ultima Thule, our own Harald Enoksson.

I am not "in opposition" to Harald on any core principle. In fact, I think that if he were able to create a society out of the whole cloth it would be reasonably pleasant place to live.

On the other hand, if he were a candidate in the actual political process I was engaged in I would campaign vociferously against him. This I think qualifies him for being my "opposite" for the purposes of this thread selection.

Few initial questions from me (and I certainly reserve the right to jump in with more over the following days):

Why do you believe in the significant danger associated with AGW ? Did you actually study the models involved or are you relying on argument-from-authority ?

Would you still feel the same if the solving global warming somehow necessitated the reduction of the state involvement in the economy and increase of income inequality within societies ?

You often rail against particular EU policies, do you nevertheless think that EU was a good idea overall ?

Is there a need for EU to be anything more then a free-trade and free-labor-movement zone ?

You come off as well traveled - which places other then Sweden do you claim to know intimately ?

What is it you do for the living (if you care to share ?)
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True Blue Jon
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First pick in a while that wasn't on the list.

Harald, can you tell us more about the psychology experiments you particiapted in?
 
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Thanks I just got stuck in bed with the cold from hell, going from one fever dream to the next, so this could be interesting...

bramadan wrote:
I am not "in opposition" to Harald on any core principle.
Well, you place drug liberalisation at the top or almost the top of your priority list. Not because you enjoy a buzz of whatever, but because you feel people's rights are violated when they aren't allowed to chew/inject/inhale what they want. The fact that you care more about that than war, peace, poverty and starvation makes you a mad dog libertarian in my eyes, so I do feel you're antagonist enough. Not to mention the many kind words for old dictator-cuddling Thatcher.

bramadan wrote:
Why do you believe in the significant danger associated with AGW ? Did you actually study the models involved or are you relying on argument-from-authority ?
100% authority. Every scientific body of any standing in this whole world find it likely that human activity has a significant effect on global warming. I also wish it wasn't so. I also wish I could fly, eat beef and burn gas. But I can't, now that I know it's most likely murder to do so.

bramadan wrote:
Would you still feel the same if the solving global warming somehow necessitated the reduction of the state involvement in the economy and increase of income inequality within societies ?
The AGW as Communist conspiracy theory? State involvement is no end in itself, so yes. Income equality is, but that affects only this generation and perhaps a few more, while environmental degradation can affect humans thousands of years from now. So yes, Green issues overrides Red issues.

bramadan wrote:
You often rail against particular EU policies, do you nevertheless think that EU was a good idea overall ?
Yes, it's a wonderful idea. A lot of issues demand supranational decisions. EU is such a beautiful phenomenon, growing as it is with states joining voluntarily. My first wish is that we can get rid of the veto thing, and have a more straightforward government, that is, all power to the parliament. My second wish is that it grows to encompass a lot of our muslim neighbors. That'd be a beautiful symbol for world peace.

bramadan wrote:
Is there a need for EU to be anything more then a free-trade and free-labor-movement zone ?
Yes, we need baseline rules on the environmental area for one thing. Today a rise in German gas taxes results in more trucks tanking in Luxembourg. I also like the whole democracy part. It's virtually impossible for a member to suddenly turn autocratic and/or starting executing people.

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You come off as well traveled - which places other then Sweden do you claim to know intimately ?
I lived one year in the Netherlands, one in Taiwan and in total 3 in Japan. Add to that three months in China and in total half a year of hitchhiking Europe.

Quote:
What is it you do for the living (if you care to share ?)
I translate video games from English to Swedish, and have been in that trade for 3 years. Before that I've taught math, English and Swedish, sold toys, sold insurances, sold union memberships, taken care of exchange students, dropped my clothes off for art students and chewed experimental medicine. I'm an economist by education and spent one year in an economic research institute, but the lack of real-world action grew on me. I do want to get my PhD one day though ...
But of course, my main aim in life is to make it big with immortally avantgardist board games cool
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quozl wrote:
First pick in a while that wasn't on the list.

Harald, can you tell us more about the psychology experiments you particiapted in?
Are you thinking of sth in particular, or just in general if I participated in some psychological experiments?
 
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Mondainai wrote:
quozl wrote:
First pick in a while that wasn't on the list.

Harald, can you tell us more about the psychology experiments you particiapted in?
Are you thinking of sth in particular, or just in general if I participated in some psychological experiments?


You made an offhand remark a while back that you particiapted in some, including testing a psychological drug. Anyway, just wondering if you could share the details.
 
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quozl wrote:
Mondainai wrote:
quozl wrote:
First pick in a while that wasn't on the list.

Harald, can you tell us more about the psychology experiments you particiapted in?
Are you thinking of sth in particular, or just in general if I participated in some psychological experiments?


You made an offhand remark a while back that you particiapted in some, including testing a psychological drug. Anyway, just wondering if you could share the details.
Ok! Well, that was psycho-pharmaceuticals, anti-psychosis, anti-depression, anti-manic stuff. And they tested how well our bodies handled it, the psychological effect wasn't studied, just the side-effects. Once the drugs were deemed fit for humans, they'd go on and test them on sick patients on the kind that would need such drugs.
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bjlillo wrote:
You are quite extreme in your anti-religionism. Do you attribute that to the molestation you suffered as a young boy at the hands of a priest or are there some other factors at work there?
Wow, what if it was? I don't know what I have would have written...

But indirectly, something similar might have happened. My grandpa's dad was a priest, and my grandpa said that his dad tried to beat God into him and his brother with a stick. In addition, where he lived, the other local priest was a Nazi (there were quite some Nazis here in the 30s). While I don't recall any hatespeech, I think all my paternal relatives inherited some disregard towards church.

Furthermore, there are very few believers here. I can only recall some immigrants, my maternal grandma, one college classmate and the odd witness. The church of Sweden (the world's largest lutheran) is largely agnostic and has totally accepted homosexuality and female priesthood etc. They have teamed up with the unions to establish the Swedish branch of the Fairtrade organization. Conservative fundamentalists feel mistreated and wonders whether to change to the Catholic or Orthodox church. I quite like the church of Sweden. But internationally, I see Christians consistently fighting on the wrongs sides.

Except for his divine claims, I like Jesus. I even have a kitschy Jesus figure in my window from Costa Rica. But I can't see that the majority of Christians follow Jesus in any way. In almost every country, the Christian parties constitute the right wing of the political spectrum. They're on average more nationalist and with lower regard for other countries and culture. They're on average more negative to immigration. They're on average more negative to female emancipation, gender equality, homosexuals' rights to live their own lives with love. In countries with right-wing dictatorships, they've on average been more supportive of the regimes. They revere stem cells but grown and kill animals in painful ways. They're on average more negative to environmental concerns. In particular, they're on average much more hostile to the whole concept of a welfare state, fighting against taxes, public services, public health care etc. My heart is with the poor. Jesus' heart was too. But the majority of Christians' hearts isn't. They sure like to give a fraction to charity, but no Christian nation has ever reach the heights of security provided by secular welfare states.

So, it isn't just that it's all bullshit to begin with. The practitioners are also inconsistent and hypocritical, and have lost the love message centuries ago. On close to all political scales, the "Christians" are the bad guys, depriving the poor of decent living, polluting the planet, restricting love rights and via their "aid organizations" force third world mothers to keep spawning children that help impoverishing them. Finally, through upholding the silly notions of divine powers, mainstream religion lends ideological support to all the thousands of cults that command and prey on millions of people's lives, time, money, self esteem and sexual integrity. So I find it hard to not be "extremely anti-religious".

But of course there are "good Christians" who genuinely does good in this world. Who don't support imperialist wars, who advocate policies that are good for the poor, who respect life even when it has four legs and no arms, who care for our planet and who understand that some stuff is in the Bible just because it was written in more intolerant times and hence should be disregarded. There are several "good Christians" here on RSP, and they've helped moderate and nuance my views somewhat. If you were all a bit more like Jesus, you wouldn't hear shit from me on religion.
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Fresh meat! beef, if you will.

Ah Harald, a Swede who has lived in Holland and a die hard lefty, we should agree on almost everything.... and yet....

Why do you love the free market so much?

Your take on Nationalism if you will, evil or not?

Please describe your best gaming experience.? A play of a game counts, which game it was is unimprtant, I am rather interested in the most memorable experience.

What games do you design? Why should I look into them?

What are the differences between Sweden and Holland, which is a better place to live?

Do you see any discrepancy in your stance on travel (which I admire) and your pengant for eating foods from poor countries which by nature must have traveled quite a distance to your table?

 
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Mondainai wrote:
why he *disklikes* religion


You should talk with BGG user Lajos, he has a more extreme view on religion than you! Besides he designs games and lives in Japan (he's a Dutchy though) so you have a lot in common.
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Venga2 wrote:
You should talk with BGG user Lajos, he has a more extreme view on religion than you! Besides he designs games and lives in Japan (he's a Dutchy though) so you have a lot in common.
We played together in Leiden, met in Essen and played together in Tokyo, so we go waaay back cool We never played his games though, which is a pity, as they seem very interesting (the economic games that is). I also never heard him speak of religion. But in my experience, Dutchies are more "actively atheist" than Swedes. In Sweden, you don't see much of religion, while you have the Catholics down south, the bible belt and Germany nearby, making "atheist" a statement that actually means something. It could also just be that you're less afraid of making statements altogether, whatever they are.
 
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A so you must have known him before I started playing games with him. Interesting.

I admit we also never talked about religion, but he posted about it vociforously and aggresivly on the geek, something many fellow geeks berated him for. I believe the creation of the RSP forum is partly founded on some of the heated religous discussion featuring Lajos.

As for the Dutch being more actively atheist, perhaps Lajos is best not seen as representative. I never notice anyone 'preaching atheism' except for when the Calvinists want to forbid something again. The Catholics dow south are mostly as agnostic as you Lutherans I think.
 
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We met in 2007. My experience of Dutch Atheism is not about preaching, but just hearing people state in conversations that they're not Christian, in a way I seldom hear it in Sweden, where most people seem to not think about it at all. But that's just me talking to people, we're not talking about a controlled sample of 1000 respondents from each country here ; )
 
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Mondainai wrote:
We met in 2007. My experience of Dutch Atheism is not about preaching, but just hearing people state in conversations that they're not Christian, in a way I seldom hear it in Sweden, where most people seem to not think about it at all. But that's just me talking to people, we're not talking about a controlled sample of 1000 respondents from each country here ; )


really? So we must have just missed each other then, I was gaming with Lajos at the time I believe.

Anyways, are you going to answer my questions or not? Get to it man!
 
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Venga2 wrote:
really? So we must have just missed each other then, I was gaming with Lajos at the time I believe.
I'm not sure, but it could be that we only played once in Leiden, and that was MegaCiv, an AdvCiv variant for 20 people.

Venga2 wrote:
Anyways, are you going to answer my questions or not? Get to it man!
Sorry, I didn't see them, they were hidden behind you quoting my whole religion rant
 
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Mondainai wrote:
Venga2 wrote:
really? So we must have just missed each other then, I was gaming with Lajos at the time I believe.
I'm not sure, but it could be that we only played once in Leiden, and that was MegaCiv, an AdvCiv variant for 20 people.


Ok I remember he talked about that. I couldnt make it though. Now get to answering those questions and stop blaming others for that failure
 
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Venga2 wrote:
Ah Harald, a Swede who has lived in Holland and a die hard lefty, we should agree on almost everything.... and yet....
Die hard lefty? I believe in a more or less unregulated capitalism with high taxation spent on citizen's wage and subsidies to basic services such as health and education. Where government intervention needs to be motivated and not just there by default.

Venga2 wrote:
Why do you love the free market so much?
In the long run, a free market with competition makes for the highest internal production using the least private resources. Now, there is no such market that is totally competitive, has no externalities, and uses only private resources, but that can be addressed with taxes and laws. I call it "Frame Economy". Govt builds the frame, companies paint the painting.
Quote:

Your take on Nationalism if you will, evil or not?
Short answer: Evil. Positive forces labeling themselves Nationalist have been the many independence movements in the colonies. But now that the colonies are free, that positive use of the word is gone. I don't support the many rebel groups around the world that wants to carve out a niche for their own ethnicity/religion, even if they were forcefully conquered decades/centuries ago. Because if they succeed, they will harbor minorities of their own, and so on and so forth. The whole one people = one nation think just have to go, it leads to atrocities and racism.
Quote:

Please describe your best gaming experience.? A play of a game counts, which game it was is unimprtant, I am rather interested in the most memorable experience.
I must say it's my MegaCiv in Holland. 20 players, and I won whistle


Quote:
What games do you design? Why should I look into them?
In my first game, you build armies of Japanese phonetic characters, and you can combine these to form the pronunciation of Japanese(Chinese) ideograms, which acts as the technology in the game.
My second game was an ambitious modeling of the powers at work in a fast-growing city in a developing country, which boiled down to a brain-burning, yet luck-flawed RoboRally-ripoff with character selection a la Citadels/Puerto Rico.
My third game was a take on Railway Rivals, but with a nifty auction mechanic for who gets to own what track. The theme is that you chase nice weather, and in doing so ironically alter the weather with your greenhouse gases.
My fourth game is a Viking-themed trading/plunder game. What's novel about it is a brilliant mechanism for demand and supply and city growth and decay, and the rest is just an amerieurotrash hybrid. It's the most successful game by most measures, and also the one I feel is the most complete. The first three games need more tinkering.
My forthcoming game is a model for the Swedish election of 2010 (and the x years leading up to it). You choose a party, make a coalition with some of the other parties and then play cards to position yourself along 10 political scales, trying to cover as much "voter space" as possible, while still maintaining the image of a coherent and unified coalition. 32 voters representing 2-4 votes each then choose between the 10 parties based on their gender, age, education, location and employment status. To win, your coalition needs to win, and you need to gain more than your coalition partners. So it's cooperative/competitive.

You should look into Longships, as it's the only one game currently available In Essen you should check out 2010, maybe you could make a Dutch bootleg of it since your system is similar.

Quote:
What are the differences between Sweden and Holland, which is a better place to live?
I think the countries are very similar in many respects, so if you like one of them, you'll like the other.
Sweden +: More nature. less people and nicer healthcare system.

Netherlands +: Lower taxes and easier to make friends; more strangers will talk to you without being drunk, mentally ill or religious.Much cheaper food.

The starkly different rules for alcohol, narcotics and prostitution might also be pluses and minuses in either direction.
I think both places have rather tricky housing markets. As for the weather I don't know what to prefer zombie I also have a feeling Swedish salaries are higher, but that's probably offset by the tax difference.

Quote:
Do you see any discrepancy in your stance on travel (which I admire) and your pengant for eating foods from poor countries which by nature must have traveled quite a distance to your table?
I certainly do! Here's my take: Each person can emit 2 tons of CO2 per year. With sound travel and food habits and green electricity, I'm hovering at 1.2-1.4, depending on if I take car or train to Essen. That gives me room for some CO2 luxury. So I'm treating myself to long hot showers and foreign food. I also don't feel bad to have the PS3 on all day, even if I just play a level an hour.
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Moshe Callen
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ἄνδρα μοι ἔννεπε, μοῦσα, πολύτροπον, ὃς μάλα πολλὰ/ πλάγχθη, ἐπεὶ Τροίης ἱερὸν πτολίεθρον ἔπερσεν./...
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Venga2 wrote:

You should talk with BGG user Lajos, he has a more extreme view on religion than you! Besides he designs games and lives in Japan (he's a Dutchy though) so you have a lot in common.

True but Lajos is nonetheless polite.
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whac3 wrote:
Venga2 wrote:

You should talk with BGG user Lajos, he has a more extreme view on religion than you! Besides he designs games and lives in Japan (he's a Dutchy though) so you have a lot in common.

True but Lajos is nonetheless polite.


Where did I say he wasn't?
 
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ἄνδρα μοι ἔννεπε, μοῦσα, πολύτροπον, ὃς μάλα πολλὰ/ πλάγχθη, ἐπεὶ Τροίης ἱερὸν πτολίεθρον ἔπερσεν./...
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μῆνιν ἄειδε θεὰ Πηληϊάδεω Ἀχιλῆος/ οὐλομένην, ἣ μυρί᾽ Ἀχαιοῖς ἄλγε᾽ ἔθηκε,/...
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Venga2 wrote:
whac3 wrote:
Venga2 wrote:

You should talk with BGG user Lajos, he has a more extreme view on religion than you! Besides he designs games and lives in Japan (he's a Dutchy though) so you have a lot in common.

True but Lajos is nonetheless polite.


Where did I say he wasn't?

You said he was worse than our RSPer du jour.
 
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Mondainai wrote:
Die hard lefty? I believe in a more or less unregulated capitalism with high taxation spent on citizen's wage and subsidies to basic services such as health and education. Where government intervention needs to be motivated and not just there by default.


Mondainai wrote:
In the long run, a free market with competition makes for the highest internal production using the least private resources. Now, there is no such market that is totally competitive, has no externalities, and uses only private resources, but that can be addressed with taxes and laws. I call it "Frame Economy". Govt builds the frame, companies paint the painting.


So you believe in unregulated capitalism as longs as its stays within a higly regulated framework? Sounds like a lefty to me.

EDIT: I dont believe in spelling
 
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whac3 wrote:
Venga2 wrote:
whac3 wrote:
Venga2 wrote:

You should talk with BGG user Lajos, he has a more extreme view on religion than you! Besides he designs games and lives in Japan (he's a Dutchy though) so you have a lot in common.

True but Lajos is nonetheless polite.


Where did I say he wasn't?

You said he was worse than our RSPer du jour.


I think in my qoute above I say that he holds more extreme views than our RSP victim of the time being. I did not mean that to be interpreted as 'worse'.
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Venga2 wrote:
So you belive in unregulated capitalism as longs as its stays withing a higly regulated framework? Sounds like a lefty to me.
Protectionism/Free trade is one area where I feel "the left" gets it wrong more often. You know, the whole "protect our jobs" discussion. Or for that matter, "protect our farmers". But that's not left, just stupid.

Another area is the labor market. I think companies should be allowed to hire and fire at will.

I also resent the whole skepticism towards "profiteering" that goes through much left rhetorics.

But on average, ok, I accept the label
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whac3 wrote:
Venga2 wrote:

You should talk with BGG user Lajos, he has a more extreme view on religion than you! Besides he designs games and lives in Japan (he's a Dutchy though) so you have a lot in common.

True but Lajos is nonetheless polite.
Sorry for pointing out that you're a deluded occupant.
 
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Mondainai wrote:
whac3 wrote:
Venga2 wrote:

You should talk with BGG user Lajos, he has a more extreme view on religion than you! Besides he designs games and lives in Japan (he's a Dutchy though) so you have a lot in common.

True but Lajos is nonetheless polite.
Sorry for pointing out that you're a deluded occupant.

Uh-huh.
 
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bjlillo wrote:
Why do you think Sweden has been able to avoid war since 1809, longer than any other country?
Sanity, weakness and cowardice.

Sweden had been on the decline since early 1700s, but like an addicted gambler repeatedly tried to attack Russia to get back "what was ours", each time losing a bit more of territory. The events surrounding the Napoleon Wars set an end to this, as Sweden accepted status quo on the Russian front and got Norway for helping the allies, which acted like a bit of compensation.

Sweden had no power to get colonies like the big Europeans, in fact, it was almost on the colonial side of the economic equations; settlers streamed up north to plow the land and harvest the endless forests, exporting raw materials to Britain, having railroads and mines built with British capital. Sanity or Weakness?

The three Scandinavian kings met and promised each other support in case of foreign invasion. But when Bismarck marched into Denmark, Sweden was nowhere to be seen, as they wouldn't stand a chance. Weakness.

In 1905, Norway declared independence. The armies eyed each other. Stockholm called the war off, realising that in the long run, you only suffer from trying to hold another country down. Sanity.

None of the Scandinavians joined any pre-WWI alliances, and were thus not involved when the alliance system activated in all-out war. Sanity. (And one example I use when advocating us staying outside NATO and EU defense. Which doesn't mean we can't participate in Afghanistan, Kosovo, Israel etc)

In WWII, it wasn't just imperialist alliances against each other. There was the NAZIs marching to conquer the world. They took 3 days to conquer Denmark and one month to conquer Norway. Sure they would have taken Sweden in less than a month, and we would have endured the same dark occupation as our neighbors. But resistance would have shortened the war with several months, according to some historians. That would have meant hundreds of thousands of saved lives. And to speak probabilities, it would have meant a less % chance that Adolf Hitler became the first world czar. But Sweden chose to cooperate and sold the Nazis all iron from the mine up in Kiruna, not just 1% of the world's iron deposits, but iron so pure as is chemically possible to find in nature. They also let German soldiers travel to and from Norway on Swedish trains, if they promised to check in their weapons in the luggage car. Cowardice

After WWII, most wars have been colonial in nature, and we didn't have any colonies. There's been Swedish soldiers under UN flag in many countries though, in Africa, former Yugoslavia, outside Somalia, in Afghanistan (which is one talking point in this year's election). Soldiers die in Afghanistan, but maybe that still is "avoiding war"?
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