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Subject: Trying not to be a ratings police, but come on... rss

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Morgan Dontanville
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Look, I try to be liberal towards ratings, sure we all have differences of opinions on how and why things should be rated. That's all fine and good, but wingedpotato's ratings just rub me the wrong way.

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/viewcollection.php3?username=wi...

I don't understand why he has rated so many games that he hasn't played. This isn't a race. You don't get a prize for having the most ratings. Can we as a group email him and ask him to only rate the games that he has played.

Just eyeing it quickly I found 11 games that he rated that he says that he's never played. WHY MUST HE RATE THESE?

Grrrr. (ok, rant over)
 
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Phil Shepherd
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Sigh...
I know. I saw some obvious shill ratings for a new game that I'm really looking forward, but I don't think I want to stir up the inevitable flame wars and the "you can't tell people how to rate" or the the "now people who haven't played it are going rate it '1' to counterbalance it..." etc.
 
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Randy Cox
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I agree that when someone gives a game a rating (Vegas in this example--6) and writes "Never played; probably never will," you kinda have to scratch your head. But many of the others, could be legit ratings. "Beautiful game - 7" might be right. Maybe he's not played it, but giving it an initial response based on the product (not all, or even most, of the game experience is in the rules and strategy). It's not like he rated a bunch of games 0.1 or 10 without playing and owned stock in the publishing company.
 
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Morgan Dontanville
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But that kind of nonsense is different that this.

I just don't understand why he MUST rate games that he hasn't played.
 
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John O'Haver PhoDOGrapher
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Rubbed you the wrong way?
I guess so.laugh Must be a slow day at work, Morgan.

How'd you find this user? Is there a "rated but never played" filter button I've missed somewhere? laugh

Note to self: Keep using emoticons so folks'll know I'm not seriously bitching.

Let me tag team one of my pet peeves onto your post, though.

Folks who rate games never played irk me only a little bit. If they say never played in the comments, that's all I need to know, since I go by comments more than numbers.

SO keep your collections updated and ADD COMMENTS! A "luck ridden dicefest" with a average rating of 2 is more likely to interest me than a ten rated "best bidding/auction game ever."

 
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Morgan Dontanville
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Randy, I was talking strictly of those games that he says specifically. "I have not played this, but..." If you look through there, he just feels compelled to rate so the numbers are just arbitrary. This is worse in my opinion that shilling, as they can be obviously discounted.

I know that it isn't that big of a deal, but still, I just want to know why someone would need to do that.
 
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Joe Gola
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Aw, lighten up, Morgan. You know you can pretty much tell how good a game is going to be by looking at the box. Reef Encounter? 6! Karabik? 9.5! Boomtown? 10, baby! I mean, check out the rack on that little desperado honey! She can jump my claim anytime! Grrrr!

And so forth.
 
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Ray
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Why care?
Lots of gamers don't care any about mechanics. Lots of gamers only care about theme, presentation, and bits. For gamers such as this these actions are just fine (they can look at the bits and know if they like them).

With such different criteria for liking games it really doesn't make complete sense to create an average rating. Maybe a better way of saying that is don't give average ratings that much credit. Isn't the average rating just a popularity index (and not a good game index) anyway?

Personally, I've long reached the point where I just don't care about other peoples data. They can put all 1s and 10s for games they've never played and it has no effect on me. Geekbuddies and their average ratings is the way for me.
 
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Gary Webster
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I resemble your problem...
I have to fight the tendency to rate a game based on my rather odd habit of solo play. When I get a game intended for my game group, I always try to set it up solo and play a few games to try to understand the game and to prepare myself to explain the rules to my group. At that point, I really want to put the game into my "games owned" and "games rated" list with a description of the game as I have played it so far. I've thought very highly of games that just didn't go over so well with the group, and have been just so-so with others (Mystery of the Abbey comes to mind here; I don't have an immediate example of the first kind) that the group enjoyed immensely.

So, I am trying to NOT rate a game until the group plays it at least once. Since we get together once in a blue moon, I have quite a pile of unplayed (OK, solo-played) games that I'm dying to rate and describe (to help the new gamer, you know, not just to get my opinions on the 'Geek or anything like that...), but I'm waiting...
 
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Morgan Dontanville
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Joe,

You're right. I know that Coors Light is good beer because the commercials tell me so.

 
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Morgan Dontanville
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Gary,

You know that you can put in comments and games owned without rating it. You can just put in a tentative rating along with your comments. I think all of that is great, but when this guy just rates a game with no reason other than to just rate it, I get annoyed.
 
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Iain K
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I find myself agreeing with everything Morgan has said here . . . it's a bit frightening

And the funny part is, Coors Light isn't really beer at all !

But how can we get people to stop this sort of nonsense (being that by definition such people must not have sense) without some sort of police?

Perhaps a few gentile emails are the way, as Morgan suggests, but still the system has to be based on people using judgement.

Oh and Morgan, you didn't answer John's question . . . how did you find this user?
 
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MTG Ninja
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maybe he has OCD
 
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Shawn Christenson
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Attribut 9 Haven't played yet, but I think it will be getting the classic '10'...

Bang! - Dodge City Expansion 9 Excellent expansion, can't wait to try it out... -- What? How is it an excellent expansion if you havn't tried it out? That's like saying 'Temple of Doom is an awesome sequel. Can't wait to see it'.

What's It To Ya? 9 Haven't played yet, but I'm digging on the idea and the potential expand-ability.

^^^^^^^^^^^
Some of his Havn't played yet comments and ratings. Which I agree are a little much. However, it's not as if he hasn't rated and PLAYED only a few games in comparrison. He has played and rated quite a few games (albiet alot of high ratings, but thats okay). He's not really shilling in any way, and I don't see how this is worse. He's just someone who loves games, just like my cousin who loves movies (She loves almost every single movie she sees, she recomends movies she hasn't seen yet 'Oh yeah, you should rent Ed Wood, if you like that kind of movie'.
 
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John O'Haver PhoDOGrapher
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It was a joke. No need to answer me.
"how did you find this user?"
 
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Morgan Dontanville
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Well, I played Penguin Ultimatum last night and looked the game up to make sure my ratings were still up to snuff. I saw the "Portrait of the Artist as a Young Geek (the art of Scott Starkey)" geek list. I played Die Macher against Scott at Gen Con and quite enjoyed his company so I wanted to see what he was up to. Then I saw WHAT'S IT TO YA? When I was at Gen Con I saw this at his table and didn't remember to look it up, so I did.

I noticed it had a higher rating for an indie game and ran accross this: 9 - Haven't played yet, but I'm digging on the idea and the potential expand-ability. (wingedpotato)

So I looked him up annoyed that he gave a game a 9 after not even playing it only to discover that this was in fact a trend.

I don't want to give him a bad name, I just want him to realize that it is silly to rate games that he hasn't played. He should just leave the comments in without the ratings.

When I first got on the geek I fell into the stupid shillbuster trend (Cardchess, The Chick Game), but I realized that it was adding to the problem. The comments are just as effective without rating the game. That said I understand the excitement that comes with rating games and I just wanted to make sure that we took note of some of the silly ferver.
 
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Ken Shogren
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Not an endorsement, but...
I have no idea whether this is true or not, but perhaps wingedpotato's ratings are not actually ratings of the games per se, but reflect his interest level in a game (played or otherwise). He might rate games that look very good - high, and games that look boring - low. He could then grab all his highest interest games from his profile in order to determine his next order or what to play this weekend. The fact that he has bothered to spell out comments on nearly all the games rated leads me to suspect something less obvious might be at hand here.

[I'm not suggesting that this is an appropriate use of the ratings, but it is a possiblity. Personally, I like the idea of being able to assign an interest level to games on my wish/want lists. Not sure if it would be worth the trouble to add to BGG though.]
 
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Morgan Dontanville
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In an effort to understand this mentality you certainly have broken more ground than I have. That mind-set seems strange, but at least justifiable.
 
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I see where Ken is coming from. When I first came here I used to only rate games that I played more than a few times (to make sure I got it right), but at some point I decided to break from that personal rule and rate a game as soon as a played it once. I know full well that it probably isn't fair to the game (or the database), but I'm selfish: I want to see how my rating changes with each play (I'm pretty good about changing a rating if I feel it's necessary). Potato could just be using the rating system as his own personal database.

However, some of potato's comments are pretty contradictory. If Ken has it right, I agree that he should just make a "no rating" commment to express his enthusiasm.
 
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Come on, Morgan. For 11 games that has rated without playing, he rated tons of other games with well thought comments. Me too I have rated some games only on components/quality/ruleset/solo play... adding that the rating could change in the future (as I did). In few words: with ratings there are comments, so it is a good thing.
And, please, everyone stop this rating police trend, this geeklist police trend, etc. I think the majority of Geeks has grown very tired of this.
 
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Ray
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Ken,

Exactly. He's doing what the rating guide says he should do -- assign a number based on how much he wants to play a game.

It would be great if we could all consider the same elements of a game when rating but we don't. The two choices are to (1) realize others want to play a game because of sometimes vastly different reasons or (2) try to make others enjoy the same criteria in playing a game.

I don't think the second option is really viable because people value quite differently. (I know several folks that would rate Lord of the Rings Candyland a 10 if it was ever made.)



 
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Morgan Dontanville
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Luca,

No offense, dude, but why don't you take a step back and look at the reality of it. If I had a conversation about five movies with you and talked about what I liked about them, if you brought something up about one of those movies that you had seen and my response was, "Oh, I haven't seen that, but I read about it in Variety so I'm going to feel comfortable giving you commentary." Wouldn't you be a bit decieved over anything I said before and not believe a word I say from there on after. It is the same thing.

Also, I stated clearly in the title what this journal entry is about, why come on my journal and read it just to say that you are tired of the subject. If you are tired of it, don't read it.
 
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Morgan Dontanville
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Morgan,

That was amazing in just how horribly writen that was.

Mantra:
Next time, proofread.
 
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Shawn Christenson
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Thats a funny Mantra.

"Next time, proof read!'

"Next time, proof read!'

"Next time, proof read!'

"Next time, proof read!'

"Next time, proof read!'

Okay now my joke in my head is not so funny, but i'll submit this anyway.
 
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Necks thyme pruf reed!
 
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