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EuroFront II» Forums » Rules

Subject: Straits and control rss

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God. I feel stupid to have played for so long and still have to come here for rules clarifications. anyway, here is my Monday problem:

I have tried to figure out the straits rules,

"10.22 Lines of Communication
A Line of Communications (LOC) is a rail/sea (not road) route passing through friendly or neutral controlled territory, seas and straits only.
A LOC cannot pass through enemy-controlled territory, seas or straits, or through engaged hexes. It can pass through engaged Regions but not engaged Districts (see 18.1)."

That seems pretty "strait" forward - LOC goes through friendly but not through enemy straits, BUT:
15.12 Sidebar: "A Straits is controlled if either adjacent land hex is friendly controlled (1.371). Two factions can both control a Strait."

Question: At the straits, if I own one side and the evil enemy the other side, it is in fact controlled by both sides? And here comes that LOC merchant chugging along. Can he pass because the straits are friendly controlled or is he stopped by the fact that it is enemy controlled?

As a side note, is there any difference in interpretation between a LoC and the National supply route, or are they two sides of the same coin?




Straits Hex controlblushSea Move/Supp/Inv/LoC
(Friendly, Neutral, Enemy)
F+F, F+NblushYes
N+N, E+N F+EblushLoC only
E+E F+EblushNo




 
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Filip W.
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The way I read it is that if the enemy controls at least one end of the straits you can only draw a LoC/National supply through them and not supply/invasion/supreme moves.

I assume that if the straits are partialy neutral (i.e. F+N or N+N) you treat them as friendly for supply/invasion/supreme but I could be wrong.

Practical example:

Axis control Somaliland, Allies control Aden. Axis control all ports in Med (including Gibraltar). Do Axis have control of the Middle Seaway?

15.12, sidebar: Two sides can control a strait.
15.81 Middle Seaway = Line of Communication between Atlantic and Indian oceans through Med.
15.81 wrote:

Seaways are traceable through friendly and neutral controlled seas (including those controlled by Cooperating neutrals). They are not traceable through enemy-controlled straits (15.12).


First sentence says that they are traceable through Friendly controlled straits (Straits of Aden are friendly controlled) thus yes, Axis control middle Seaway.

Second sentence says that they can not be traced through enemy controlled straits. Straits of Aden are enemy controlled thus, no, the Axis don't control the Middle Seaway.
 
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But had it been a National supply trying to trace LoC through that same strait, it would have been OK?

If Greece wanted to trace supply through here when the Germans attacked it would be OK even with an Axis unit in Somaliland, but if the UK own the Med and wants to claim Swy control it´s blocked by that same Somaliland unit.Seems a bit contradictory doesn´t it?
 
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Filip W.
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Very.
 
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Craig Besinque
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Gang,

I am in the process of doing another EuF2 rules update (v1.15).

One thing I had done already is clarify the straits control situation (which definitely needed it).

Here's how it reads now: (paraphrased):

A faction controlling one side of a straits (land hex) COMMANDS a Straits. All enemy naval operations (Sea supply, Sea Movement, Sea Invasions) are prohibited thru such a straits. National Supply/LOC (ie merchant traffic) is allowed to pass through.

A faction controlling BOTH sides of a straits (both adjacent land hexes) CONTROLS that straits. All enemy sea traffic, including National Supply/LOC, is blocked.

Neutral-controlled straits (Spain, Denmark) do not block any military or commercial traffic, with the exception of the 2 Turkish straits (fortified), which block naval operations but not National Supply/LOC. You could consider them "National" straits, as opposed to Gibraltar/ Denmark, which are "internationalized".

Does that work? Hope I have covered the contingencies correctly. If you see problems, please post here.

Craig
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Craig Besinque
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Gang,

I am in the process of doing another EuF2 rules update (v1.15).

One thing I had done already is clarify the straits control situation (which definitely needed it).

Here's how it reads now: (paraphrased):

A faction controlling one side of a straits (land hex) COMMANDS a Straits. All enemy naval operations (Sea supply, Sea Movement, Sea Invasions) are prohibited thru such a straits. National Supply/LOC (ie merchant traffic) is allowed to pass through.

A faction controlling BOTH sides of a straits (both adjacent land hexes) CONTROLS that straits. All enemy sea traffic, including National Supply/LOC, is blocked.

Neutral-controlled straits (Spain, Denmark) do not block any military or commercial traffic, with the exception of the 2 Turkish straits (fortified), which block naval operations but not National Supply/LOC. You could consider them "National" straits, as opposed to Gibraltar/ Denmark, which are "internationalized".

Does that work? Hope I have covered the contingencies correctly. If you see problems, please post here.

Craig
 
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Much clearer to me anyway. (Although I am a bit at odds with "enemy" merchants chugging through straits that have enemy guns on one side.) Still this rule seems unambigious.
 
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Juan de Marco
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That sounds like a logical solution. Thanks Craig!
 
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Paul Lags
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wingnut69 wrote:
Much clearer to me anyway. (Although I am a bit at odds with "enemy" merchants chugging through straits that have enemy guns on one side.) Still this rule seems unambigious.


indeed, i always thought u needed to control both sides. this will make Belgium slightly tougher, right?
 
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Michael Fdez-Peña Collis
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Hi! There is one question we have found playing a recently campaing with this rule. While Phony War was actived, allied player made a sea invasion over one germany coast hex near Danzig.This movement caused the end of phony war event, so Denmark DS was unabled to be played. Same problem with Wesser Surprise.

Is there something wrong we are playing? On 1.13 rules, sea invassions weren't aloved through neutral straits, so there was imposible for the allied player to put one unit in german territory, but now, with a 20pp cost, it is posible. If German player doesn't roll 1 or 2 in the sea interdiction table, the allied troop arrives and brakes phony war and begins the chain of bad events for the german player.

We think there is one problem with this rule. Thanks!
 
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Tomas Lidholm
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Sea movement through neutral straits are still not allowed, see 1.371 and sidebar on the same page
 
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José Luis Villarig
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Tomas, look the answer of Craig in this thread:

cbesinque wrote:


Neutral-controlled straits (Spain, Denmark) do not block any military or commercial traffic, with the exception of the 2 Turkish straits (fortified), which block naval operations but not National Supply/LOC. You could consider them "National" straits, as opposed to Gibraltar/ Denmark, which are "internationalized".

Craig
 
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