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Spearpoint 1943» Forums » Rules

Subject: Target Declaration rss

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Andrew S. Fischer
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The (online) rules state: "Players verbally declare a single Legal Target for each attacking Unit," but do not say anything about the order of declaration, which certainly could matter.

I propose that the player with the initiative declares all his targets first.
 
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Mark Buetow
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Move! Advance! Fire! Rout! Recover! Artillery Denied! Artillery Request! Command Confusion...say what?!
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It says the phases are done simultaneously. And Initiative isn't determined until after the Target Declaration.
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Andrew S. Fischer
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I don't see how that can work if two players say simultaneously:

"I'll attack your Sherman with my panzerschreck, your rifle squad with my MG42, and your howitzer with my ME-109."

"I'll attack your panzerschreck with my rifle squad, your MG42 with my other rifle squad, and your ME-109 with my Sherman's 50 caliber MG."
 
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Jaret Morgan
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I actually asked that question and he said it is at the same time and a player could certainly change their mind after hearing what his/her opponent is going to do and then change their targets, and it could go on and on, back and forth, but would probably not get that out of hand I would think.
 
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Andrew S. Fischer
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Sheesh! I'll try it my way, and make up some chits marked A,A,B,B, etc. for both sides to mark their targets.
 
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Byron Collins
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It's meant to be simultaneous, but I have received this question several times. It's a good question.

Initiative is not rolled until targets are set. At that point, there's no adjustment. Rarely do players change their minds after their initial targeting and after seeing what their opponents are targeting--- it does happen-- but only once in a while and takes about 5 seconds to adjust. You're welcome to try it another way if you like, but it's really pretty easy without chits, etc.
 
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Jaret Morgan
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You know, I am thinking of a situation now that might be awkward. Let's say the US has 4 infantry units and the Germans have 1 tank unit (w/ crew).

Obviously the infantry units have to band 3 together for a close assault. The 4th unit has nothing to do.

The German player will want a shot at disrupting the close assault so then chooses one of the group of 3.

The US player then goes, "oh wait, this unit you are targeting is not part of the assault, this other unit is"

...and so on, and so forth....

In this case, I would probably just do a die roll to see who gets "last say", but if I am missing something or my logic is wrong let me know.
 
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Andrew S. Fischer
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Doing it my way -- rolling for initiative first -- solves this. If the "infantry" player goes first, the assault will happen. If the "tank" player goes first, the assault could be disrupted and the infantry player may choose to fire elsewhere instead of assaulting the tank.

This would make sense in real life, since it would seem quite risky to close assault a tank that's already spotted and fired at you. You'd need, ahem, the initiative to try it.
 
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Byron Collins
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In all of the games I've run, I've never had a case where two players cannot make up their minds what they want to do regarding attacks- it takes no more than 20 seconds to decide where to fire. Most players will go with this, declare targets, roll initiative, and start firing / alternating attacks.

If there is a case where two players cannot agree on who gets the 'last say', a die roll would suffice, then roll initiative.

In the case of the close assault example above-- all 4 of those infantry units would likely close assault- not just 3 - why just assault with 3 if you have another doing nothing? If the assault is a success, all 4 units roll 1D10 each for damage, ignoring DI's, then apply that to the target's defense and then endurance. The tank would likely target the strongest unit of the 4. If the tank player gets initiative, fires, and takes out 1 infantry unit, the close assault still occurs with the other 3- but of course if they miss, they all miss. The way the rule works, you have to have at least 3 for it to happen.

If close assaulting with the minimum from the onset, and the tank wins initiative, targets and destroys 1 of the 3 infantry in the group, the assault is broken up. There is a Command Card called Redirect Fire which could be used in this case- if played, it allows a player to re-select the target of a single unit before firing, but after initiative.
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Andrew S. Fischer
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I'll definitely try it your way first!
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Jaret Morgan
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frontlinegeneral wrote:
In the case of the close assault example above-- all 4 of those infantry units would likely close assault- not just 3 - why just assault with 3 if you have another doing nothing?


D'OH!! I read the rules that it was a fixed 3 units. Sorry!!!!
 
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leonardo balbi
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Thats a very good question , indeed. Im playing without any problems when choosing targets ...

But..but...I am using chits all the time . Its quite confusing when you have 4 vs 4 , 3 vs 5 battles. Me and my friends we just cant remember all the targets we previously had chosen .
I´ll try to post the image here with my chits . They have 2 sides . One side for "unused"unit and other side "used" unit. They are very handy when I have more than 3 units each side targeting each other ...

A great game , anyway...
 
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Byron Collins
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labalbi wrote:
Thats a very good question , indeed. Im playing without any problems when choosing targets ...

But..but...I am using chits all the time . Its quite confusing when you have 4 vs 4 , 3 vs 5 battles. Me and my friends we just cant remember all the targets we previously had chosen .
I´ll try to post the image here with my chits . They have 2 sides . One side for "unused"unit and other side "used" unit. They are very handy when I have more than 3 units each side targeting each other ...

A great game , anyway...


Leonardo, Agreed. Chits do have their place I think when battles get larger than say 4 on 4 or so. It's even more important in the expansion-- where the frontlines of each player are represented by a map with a grid and units can be all over the place. So in the expansion we include tracking counters like you describe- for attack tracking. There are 16 total, all numbered and paired up. 1 attacks 1, then is flipped when the attack resolves, 5 attacks 5, etc., (in any order), but it was definitely necessary for the expansion. Some people really prefer it in the base game as well--- so what's nice is that those chits can be used in the expansion and the base game as well. A bit of dual purpose there.

To see them, check out some of the expansion photos, available here:

http://frontlinegeneral.com/html/sp43_village_and_defensive_...


 
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Eddy del Rio
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Just reviewed the new pictures. Really nice product! Well done!

Let's keep those pre-orders coming folks cool
 
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