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Subject: Glory to the Republic Retheme rss

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Bert Nerdsen
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Like other users as well, I felt the urge to modify the graphics of this amazing game. I found it quite hard to gather conistent images of the Roman Empire; so I remembered my wish (came up when playing RftG) to have a whole game set in the SW universe.

This led to a complete retheme of Glory to Rome with the results to be seen below (maybe it should rather be called Glory to the Republic). Colors and wording on the cards were changed. I had to change some game terms as well: since there were not enough SW buildings to fill the game with, I chose to let the players rather finish Projects than to complete Structures and exchanged the tangible Sites for abstract Agendas. Also Material became a Resource. You'll find the "translation" below the pictures.

Please feel free to improve this project by suggesting changes in visual design and concepts/wording.

Here come the images:


Yellow / Laborer / Rubble
= Yellow / Smuggler / Carbonite
Brown / Craftsman / Wood
= Mint Green / Scout / Hypermatter


Grey / Architect / Concrete
= Blue / Administrator / Durasteel


Red / Legionary / Brick
= Red / Bount Hunter / Crystals


Purple / Patron / Marble
= Purple / Senator / Holocrons


Turquoise / Merchant / Stone
= Orange / Guild Member / Spice


(Out of Town) Site = (Hidden) Agenda
Jack = Droid


Thinker = Jedi Master
Structure = Project
Material = Resource
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Scott Everts
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Wow, amazing work!!
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Sean
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Awesome.
 
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Boon Kai Keefe Pang
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You are a MACHINE!!!!

robotrobotrobotrobotrobot

Great Work!!!! I totally dig your designs.
 
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Another Star Wars retheme, how original

But yeah, it looks neat oeverall. Thanks for sharing!
 
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Just call me Erik
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Amazingly want! This looks superb.
 
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King of All Simians — Not a Mere Diplomat
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I'm not even all up into Star Wars, but this is drool worthy. A-frickin-mazing, dude.
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Jeremiah Lee
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Wow! That's really cool.
 
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Bert Nerdsen
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Phew, you guys make my day Thank you very much!

@ ackmondual: Since I love SW and boardgame redesigns in equal measure (with a slight tendency towards SW ) it would be great if you could send me the links to those designs. The only that I know of so far is (or better was) the brilliant Twilight Imperium retheme by v0lrath.
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Tim Seitz
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Great googly moogly! That's awesome.
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Ian McCarthy
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bert_nerdsen wrote:
Phew, you guys make my day Thank you very much!

@ ackmondual: Since I love SW and boardgame redesigns in equal measure (with a slight tendency towards SW ) it would be great if you could send me the links to those designs. The only that I know of so far is (or better was) the brilliant Twilight Imperium retheme by v0lrath.


There were Star Wars rethemes of For Sale and Jambo, just off the top of my head. Of course, Official Star Wars pictures have been plopped on top of everything from Risk and Stratego to Monopoly and Battleship. If it's popular, it's probably been Star Wars rethemed.

I think the design looks great, but what's the thematic connection between Scouts as Craftsmen and Administrators as Architects?

Sounds like this already tricky differentiation would become even more confusing in this retheme.

Still, the rest of it pretty much sense and it looks good and you've obviously done a lot of work, so thumbs up.
 
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Randall Bart
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KenToad wrote:
There were Star Wars rethemes of For Sale and Jambo, just off the top of my head. Of course, Official Star Wars pictures have been plopped on top of everything from Risk and Stratego to Monopoly and Battleship. If it's popular, it's probably been Star Wars rethemed.

We need a Simpsons re-theme. Glory to Springfield.
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Max Maloney
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Now if only you had done it with Trek instead of Wars!
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Bert Nerdsen
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KenToad wrote:
There were Star Wars rethemes of For Sale and Jambo, just off the top of my head. Of course, Official Star Wars pictures have been plopped on top of everything from Risk and Stratego to Monopoly and Battleship. If it's popular, it's probably been Star Wars rethemed.

I think the design looks great, but what's the thematic connection between Scouts as Craftsmen and Administrators as Architects?


Thanks for the info, I'll have a look at those two rethemes (I'm rather interested in bgg user made rethemes and less in the published ones)!

Concerning the roles: I didn't care so much to find a thematic connection between Scout and Craftsman but rather between Scout and the function of the role (same with Smuggler and Laborer).

I thought of the connection like this: both Administrator and Scout can bring a new Project to the table, either due to administrative effort or the gathering of new information. Once the project is on the table, the Administrator can forward Resources within the administrative machinery (i.e. from the Stockpile into the Project), while the Scout can directly bring in the resources from space exploration (from Hand). Grantzed, that's a little thin, but I found it to be acceptable, since the original connections between function and name were thin as well (difference between architect and craftsman as you mentioned, but same with the structures).
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Carl Johan Ragnarsson
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Any chance of a high-res version for printing?
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Bruce Murphy
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minismurf wrote:
Any chance of a high-res version for printing?


I imagine that CGF, the tiny company that actually produces the game, wouldn't thank people who deliver their game to people for free. In addition, the fonts are ugly.

B>
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Bert Nerdsen
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minismurf wrote:
Any chance of a high-res version for printing?


No, sorry. I mailed with Wakefield Carter prior to the upload. He responded promptly, said that he was cool with uploads of redesigns, but we both agreed on 100 dpi to avert piracy (pitily one cannot differ between downloaders who own the game and those who don't).
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Ed
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I've come across GtR a couple times in browsing this site, but have always passed over it soley because of its art style. But my positive impressions of Innovation and your wonderful redesign have gotten me to look a bit deeper, and I like what I see.

I'm a huge Star Wars geek, so this retheme definitely grabs my interest. I'm brand new to GtR, like I said, so my input maybe isn't that valuable, but I've been giving it a look anyway.

I'm pretty surpised how little I have to say, actually. Normally when people try to rework something with a Star Wars theme I have no shortage of critiques, but I'm quite satisfied with the job you've done here.

(I'll just point out now that since I'm not entirely familiar with GtR I'm not sure whether the images here show each type of card or just 8 examples from that color, so some of my comments may be made moot if there are other cards I don't know about.)

I'm not a huge fan of Jedi/Sith, but since your retheme seems to mostly apply to the Old or New Republics (or anything beyond, and not the Galactic Civil War, for instance) the fact that they get an entire color seems to fit.

I very much like that in most cases you've gone with generic examples instead of well-known characters/ships/events/etc. The story told in the films is good of course, but for me it's always been more of a jumping point for the greater universe it's set within, so I like that you don't get too specific. I probably would have gone a bit further by just calling it a probe droid and by titling the ship cards simply after the type of ship (freighter, scout, personal shuttle, etc.) for instance, but what you've done is good too, and much preferable to Millenium Falcon, Slave I, and so on.

I like your resource types, and the only one that I sort of have an issue with is the Holocrons, partly because of my anti-Force bias and partly because it (and spice) aren't actual raw materials for the projects in question (though spice sits better with me). However, I haven't been able to come up with a better one. Permacrete, perhaps? (EDIT: Just went back and looked at the purple cards and realized that not all of them are structures on Coruscant, so permacrete doesn't fit.)

I'm also not terribly fond of the card class name "Villainy," perhaps because I try to view the SW universe in a more ambiguous way, but it is of course an undeniably black-and-white, good-vs-evil fiction, and furthermore I haven't been able to think of a better name in this case either. The best I came up with was "Subversion," but that lacks thematicism, I think.

I'm 50/50 about "Droid" replacing the Jack. I like that droids play a significant role, since they do in the SW galaxy as well, and in one way it seems to fit thematically (robotic repetition and whatnot), but on the other hand I think it's a little more devious than what I would attribute to droids, and perhaps a bit too important. I was thinking perhaps it would be better as a "Spy" or "Informant," with perhaps an illustration of a Bothan or that Kubaz fellow Garindan from ANH.

I'm sure I could come up with some more things to nitpick if I tried, but overall I think it's a terrific conversion, and I wish I could buy a copy that looks like this! Great job!
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Bert Nerdsen
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Eric,

thank you very much for these helpful suggestions. Let me comment them

iWannaBeAMongoose wrote:
I'm not a huge fan of Jedi/Sith, but since your retheme seems to mostly apply to the Old or New Republics (or anything beyond, and not the Galactic Civil War, for instance) the fact that they get an entire color seems to fit.


I love the Dark Horse Comics and would have liked to include even more Sith Stuff. I tried to include Naga Sadow somehow, but only managed to get the Valley of the Dark Lords. While there is no direct "Dark Side" role and the Jedi Master is a rather passive one, I tried to balance Dark Side and Light Side projects to make the the Force more ambigious (maybe I'm a little KOTOR influenced). Still there are more Light Side Projects (7-4). As you said, a matter of taste some friends of mine already have complained that it's not set in the Rebel Era.

iWannaBeAMongoose wrote:
I very much like that in most cases you've gone with generic examples instead of well-known characters/ships/events/etc. The story told in the films is good of course, but for me it's always been more of a jumping point for the greater universe it's set within, so I like that you don't get too specific. I probably would have gone a bit further by just calling it a probe droid and by titling the ship cards simply after the type of ship (freighter, scout, personal shuttle, etc.) for instance, but what you've done is good too, and much preferable to Millenium Falcon, Slave I, and so on.


Hey, it's not a Probe Droid, it's a Viper Probe Droid. I had problems with this card as well and pondered between Asteroid Field (remember Ep. V - Han could hide, but not from Boba in Slave I) and Viper Probe Droid. I also was not that happy with including one Droid while having the Droids as Jacks. More suggestions are welcome.
Concerning the Ships: After all I'm unhappy with having used the singular form (e.g. Lambda Suttle instead of Shuttles). I think the ship class would have been the best solution (like Firespray Class), reflecting the player generating production facilities for this efficient ship type. What do you think?

iWannaBeAMongoose wrote:
I like your resource types, and the only one that I sort of have an issue with is the Holocrons, partly because of my anti-Force bias and partly because it (and spice) aren't actual raw materials for the projects in question (though spice sits better with me). However, I haven't been able to come up with a better one. Permacrete, perhaps? (EDIT: Just went back and looked at the purple cards and realized that not all of them are structures on Coruscant, so permacrete doesn't fit.)


I thought of the resources not (only) as building materials but as resources that indirectly benefit those projects. So with Spice you can deal with the black market, bribe, entertain the crowd, keep the whole Hutt Cartel running, etc. I considered Holocrons as data-material, information in general; not all Holocrons are force-sensitive (see http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Data_holocron).

iWannaBeAMongoose wrote:
I'm also not terribly fond of the card class name "Villainy," perhaps because I try to view the SW universe in a more ambiguous way, but it is of course an undeniably black-and-white, good-vs-evil fiction, and furthermore I haven't been able to think of a better name in this case either. The best I came up with was "Subversion," but that lacks thematicism, I think.


Me neither. Others that I thought of were Corruption, Hidden Agenda (became the synonym for Out of Town Sites instead) or Underworld. Please keep let them coming.

iWannaBeAMongoose wrote:
I'm 50/50 about "Droid" replacing the Jack. I like that droids play a significant role, since they do in the SW galaxy as well, and in one way it seems to fit thematically (robotic repetition and whatnot), but on the other hand I think it's a little more devious than what I would attribute to droids, and perhaps a bit too important. I was thinking perhaps it would be better as a "Spy" or "Informant," with perhaps an illustration of a Bothan or that Kubaz fellow Garindan from ANH.


I wanted the Droids to play an essential part in the game, so Jacks seemed to be the best position for them. I pondered somewhat with Clones (but am already not that happy with the Kaminoan Cloning Tech, since it situates the game a little to explicit in the timeline for my taste). Informant and Spy is a good one, and I must admit that it just didn't came to my mind. The ANH Kubaz spy would be a perfect candidate indeed. But again: Droids had to be important...

iWannaBeAMongoose wrote:
I'm sure I could come up with some more things to nitpick if I tried


Definitely no nitpicking, that's the kind of suggestions I hoped for, so please keep on! Thanks again for your thorough reply

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Wakefield Morys-Carter
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bert_nerdsen wrote:
iWannaBeAMongoose wrote:
I'm 50/50 about "Droid" replacing the Jack. I like that droids play a significant role, since they do in the SW galaxy as well, and in one way it seems to fit thematically (robotic repetition and whatnot), but on the other hand I think it's a little more devious than what I would attribute to droids, and perhaps a bit too important. I was thinking perhaps it would be better as a "Spy" or "Informant," with perhaps an illustration of a Bothan or that Kubaz fellow Garindan from ANH.


I wanted the Droids to play an essential part in the game, so Jacks seemed to be the best position for them. I pondered somewhat with Clones (but am already not that happy with the Kaminoan Cloning Tech, since it situates the game a little to explicit in the timeline for my taste). Informant and Spy is a good one, and I must admit that it just didn't came to my mind. The ANH Kubaz spy would be a perfect candidate indeed. But again: Droids had to be important...


I think droids are perfect as Jacks. If you don't have the skills to do a particular job, you can program a droid to to it instead.
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Ed
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That's an excellent point.

With that in mind, I think a better droid for the illustration might be an ASP droid, which were sort of general labor droids, as opposed to the current protocol droid.
 
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Wakefield Morys-Carter
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iWannaBeAMongoose wrote:
That's an excellent point.

With that in mind, I think a better droid for the illustration might be an ASP droid, which were sort of general labor droids, as opposed to the current protocol droid.


Your link says that "the ASPs were strictly working droids and nothing more."

A protocol droid might be better equiped for the necessary tasks: smuggler, scout, administrator, bounty hunter, senator, guild member. Talking is more important than heavy lifting for just about all of those.
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Ed
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Yes, you're probably right. I suppose I was thinking more of your phrasing (and perhaps the jobs from the original game) than the actual jobs in the retheme. Though of course it's hard to think of any type of droid that can fill all those diverse roles.

A much better candidate would probably be an LE repair droid like Dash Rendar's co-pilot Leebo from Shadows of the Empire. LE droids were designed as a meeting point between the utility of an astromech and the sentient interface ability of a protocol. I still can't imagine them doing the job of a senator, but then I wouldn't have imagined Jar Jar Binks doing it either, so anything is possible I guess.
 
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Bert Nerdsen
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Also keep in mind that an image with an appropiate resolution had to be found. This image also had to have a background and painting were preferred over movie stills.

I was very happy with the Mos Espa C-3PO, since it not only met those requirements but also depicted a Droid "under construction" which represents the aspect Wakefield has mentioned quite good. Moreover, C3PO and R2D2 are so iconic, that I liked them both to be included in some way (or at least the respective models to keep it generic).

A question to the image styles: I'm unhappy with "Outer Rim Agenda" A (Agendas) and "Commerce Guild" (Orange Order cards), since both are rather drawings than paintings. Would you agree that those seem quite odd next to the others or do you think thye're fine?
 
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Robert
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Cool. Star Wars is a tough one to work with in Glory to Rome, what with no one ever really building anything, so good job trying to make it work. My wife goes for Star Wars, so it'd be great to see you succeed! Since you asked for critiques/suggestions...

I'd seriously recommend fixing the ill-considered "max hand size" references. Just say "hand size" or "target hand size" or something. Having it say "max" *always* throws people and requires repeated correction/teaching. There's absolutely nothing good about saying "maximum" about something that is not a maximum in any sense. I'm seriously about to take a marker to my mats/cards and strike out all the "max"s.

"Jedi Master" really doesn't work for me, both just as a title for the action and as a thematic element (since it's so strictly Light Side, but everyone will have to do it all the time). You don't really need to change it from "Thinking", really, since that still applies perfectly well. I'd suggest something more along the same lines, like "Planning" (which works well with the "agendas" and "projects") or "Meditating" (which works well with the Force element and the "thinking" idea). I'd probably like seeing one of those over "thinking" because it's a tiresome double meaning: people like to be able to just say they are thinking when they are thinking. Also, remember that it's a thinking action, not a role, so you don't need (or actually want) a personage/title associated with it, like the other Role-oriented cards.

Seems to me like Spaceport and Secret Compartments are conceptually backwards. Secret Compartments would make sense adding more vault space, but it certainly doesn't add clientele, unless you freeze them in carbonite between turns... Spaceport is workable for either bonus (well, as workable as "Market" was for +2 Vault Size -- Secret Compartments seems way more fitting for that). An Insula is basically an apartment building, BTW. Might consider going with Compartments=Market, Spaceport=Aqueduct, and Lambda Shuttle=Insula.

"Allure of the Dark Side" is a bit much... Maybe "Advance Bribe" or something else that conveys "already working for you when revealed as a client"? Or "Bothan Politics" for a different angle.

"Viper Probe Droid" could be "Blockade", something scanning oriented, or something that protects by concealing instead of shielding...

"Scout" ... I just don't see any conceptual connection between "going to look" and taking known materials from hand and adding them to an agenda. It's always going to be a mental bump for people, I think. There has to be something better suited, even if it's something weak like "Automated Construction" or "Engineer". Actually, it might work to use "Senator" there instead of for "Patron", then you keep a parallel with "Administrator". I can't say I see how well "Senator" works for gathering clients anyway... Maybe something like "Negotiator," "Diplomat", "Ambassador", or someone that does a lot of bribing/subversion/coercion? You could use Bounty Hunter there, which is kind of fun, then Smuggler would probably make sense as Legionary, and oooh, Laborer ought to be Senator or Administrator. That makes sense for gathering resources for agendas...

So maybe something like: Bounty Hunter=Patron, Administrator=Laborer, Senator=Architect, Engineer/Admiral?=Craftsman, Admiral/Smuggler?=Legionary, Smuggler/Guild/Trader=Merchant.

"Villainy" might work/sound better as "Underworld".

Your player mat reorg works, but lacks the role names, which I'd really suggest you have there so people can stare at all the words they need to play the game, rather than have to go by pictures. Helps with teaching too.

Droids seem fine as Jacks. Leave it vague, just like "Jack"...

BTW, Spice? For the Guild? Isn't that Dune?
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