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Subject: 2-player setup rss

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David Bohnenberger
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We recently played two-player and it seemed to us that we each needed to buy a LOT of level-1 heroes before we could get to those higher-level heroes. It seems there are no special setup rules to discard some cards from the hero decks when playing with fewer players. Have other people experimented with such rules? Am I missing something?
 
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Ryan Metzler
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Dweeb wrote:
We recently played two-player and it seemed to us that we each needed to buy a LOT of level-1 heroes before we could get to those higher-level heroes. It seems there are no special setup rules to discard some cards from the hero decks when playing with fewer players. Have other people experimented with such rules? Am I missing something?


You aren't meant to buy in to them fast, you are meant to level in to them.
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William Smith
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Dweeb wrote:
We recently played two-player and it seemed to us that we each needed to buy a LOT of level-1 heroes before we could get to those higher-level heroes. It seems there are no special setup rules to discard some cards from the hero decks when playing with fewer players. Have other people experimented with such rules? Am I missing something?

Well, Ryan hit on what you are missing. To be clear, you want to spend your XP to level up your heroes(Level 1 to Level 2, Level 2 to Level 3) etc. When the game ends, I do tend to wind up with some only moderately useful Level 1 heroes, but I try to level as many as I have the opportunity to because only the "heavy hitters" are going to take down the toughest enemies. That being said, a Level 1 Dwarf, Outlands or Thryyian with a strong weapon isn't shabby in his own right(especially if he's hopped up with Feast or Battle Fury). The need to efficiently level and spend your hard-earned XP wisely is an inherent and thoughtful mechanic in this game.
 
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David Bohnenberger
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I do understand the leveling-up mechanic, and I suppose I should have said "acquire" a lot of them instead of "buy". What I am asking is merely this:

Do you think there should be fewer heroes in the deck when only two players are playing?
 
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William Smith
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By fewer heroes in the deck I assume you mean in your deck(not available in the village). To that my answers is "no". I think a good deck will always have a nice assortment of leveled heroes, quality items, spells, etc. for it to be a monster-killer. In my opinion that 'good' deck is going to look the same for a one, two, three or more player game.

Do you mind if I ask, have you played this game a lot or are you fairly new to it?
 
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Ryan Metzler
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slaqr wrote:
[q="PKDuke"]By fewer heroes in the deck I assume you mean in your deck(not available in the village). To that my answers is "no". I think a good deck will always have a nice assortment of leveled heroes, quality items, spells, etc. for it to be a monster-killer. In my opinion that 'good' deck is going to look the same for a one, two, three or more player game.

Do you mind if I ask, have you played this game a lot or are you fairly new to it?


What he actually meant is do you think that each individual village hero deck should have fewer heroes in it (less level 1 heroes), so as to make getting higher level heroes easier.

I'm not really sure how its any harder, however, to get higher level heroes in a 2 player game. With 2 players, you have the same chance of finding a monster in the dungeon you can kill for experience. This doesn't change at all with more players, same number of monsters, same number of available XP. The only difference becomes the availability to BUY the level 2 heroes, which although a nice fallback if you cant manage the XP, is not the main way you are meant to acquire level 2 heroes.
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Cameron Chien
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No, it doesn't need tweaking. If you want a level 2 hero, then you use some xp on your level 1 heros to bypass the level 1 heros.

Cameron
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David Bohnenberger
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No, I have not played a lot, and also it seems I am having a really hard time making myself understood. blush

By "Deck", I meant the pile of hero cards that are available for purchase/level acquisition in the village.

It just seems odd to me that there is no rule specifying that some of the level 1 heroes should be tossed out at game start. There are certainly a LOT of games that specify that board size/cards/pieces are modified depending on the number of players.

So, in a four player game, each player can only get a few before the level 2 heroes become available. In a two-player game, each player gets a pile.
 
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Ryan Metzler
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Dweeb wrote:
No, I have not played a lot, and also it seems I am having a really hard time making myself understood. blush

By "Deck", I meant the pile of hero cards that are available for purchase/level acquisition in the village.

It just seems odd to me that there is no rule specifying that some of the level 1 heroes should be tossed out at game start. There are certainly a LOT of games that specify that board size/cards/pieces are modified depending on the number of players.

So, in a four player game, each player can only get a few before the level 2 heroes become available. In a two-player game, each player gets a pile.


What you are missing is that the level 2 heroes are ALWAYS available, you just have to level them when they aren't on top rather than buy them. So instead of buying level 2 heroes like you might be able to in a 3-4 player game, you are forced to level your bought level 1 heroes up in order to get them earlier.

For example:

If there is a level 1 hero on top of a stack from which you already have a level 1 hero in your hand, you may spend the appropriate experience (2exp to level from level 1 to level 2), destroy the level 1 hero from your hand, and search through the appropriate hero pile for the level 2 hero of the same type. This hero then goes to your discard pile.

In this manner, you may always get level 2 heroes as long as you have the appropriate level 1 and enough experience. You may not be able to BUY them, but you can certainly ACQUIRE them.
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David Bohnenberger
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slaqr wrote:
What you are missing is that the level 2 heroes are ALWAYS available, you just have to level them when they aren't on top rather than buy them.


Excellent. That is indeed what we were missing. Thank you, sir!

edit: Seems Cameron explained it too, but I was too thick to understand. Again, thanks.
 
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William Smith
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I have to admit, when I play solo I do allow myself to buy level 2 and 3 heroes(if I have the cash) because it's just too many level 1's to buy through as a single player. Yes, I know you can level up, but when you have high level dragons, the Archduke of Pain and magic attack only elementals and abyssals you've got to give yourself a fighting chance!
(just my take on it)
 
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Guy Riessen
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Sometimes you have to make a futile attack to clear the tough guys to the bottom of the monster deck. It costs you a turn, and you'll likely not see those VPs, but it doesn't have any other costs, except any Battle Effects.
 
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