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Subject: Looking for a new Collectible Card Game, HELP ugh! rss

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Benjamin Tharin
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I just played a game of magic: the gathering, after like 7/8 years of having a break from it, while i still love the game from back then for its mechanics i stopped due to some rulechanges and newer boosted cards that made all my old cards kind of obsolete and sticked to the cards that i had up to then...

However, now i'm in search for a new CCG and i'm completely puzzled on where to look i know the scene for CCG's is rather big but i have a hard time to find anything else than just M:TG YuGiOh and some WoW Spinoff as it seems.

Does anybody have a suggestion on what game could be interesting to start if i loved the old M:TG (doesnt have to be fantasy or whatnot) ? And before you ask, no i dont feel like giving M:TG another try and the reason i write in here is i could simply imagine that there must be alot of people like me that have the same "problem".

Is there anything rather new (like 1 - 2 years) CCG that looks promising for an old M:TG vet ?, i seem to be to stupid to find any info on the subject ?

Please help i'm losing my hair on this
 
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Chris Ferejohn
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Any CCG is going to have that problem. If you don't like old cards being obsoleted and a constantly morphing ruleset, I'm not sure that CCGs are for you. Have you considered LCGs and the like (Living Card Games). Expandable card games that don't hew to the randomized pack model. They are easier to break out when you are the only one who is invested (one problem with CCGs is that you really need a community collecting, buying, and building to play them).

I am really digging Summoner Wars in that vein. I'm sure some folks will recommend others.

Oh, I'll throw Dominion on the pile too. Not usually referred to as an LCG (for stylistic and, I think, copyright reasons), but a similar premise, and it is a game that some magic vets find very interesting (otoh, some magic vets find it dull as dishwater, so try before you buy there I think).

Good luck.
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Brad Miller
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Check out the LCGs from FFG. Warhammer: Invasion, Call of Cthulhu: The Card Game, and A Game of Thrones: The Card Game are all out now and good, and there's a Middle Earth LCG coming out pretty soon as well.
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Chris Benson
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Definitely look into non-collectible card games like the LCGs Fantasy Flight publishes. CCGs aren't designed to be balanced, they're designed to sell cards, so the people spending the most money have the best decks.

My personal favorite LCG is Call of Cthulhu, but they're all great.

Other games that are like CCGs without the bad parts are Heroes of Graxia, Guardians of Graxia, Summoner Wars, Blue Moon,Nature of the Beast, Arctic Scavenger, Yomi (also called Fantasy Strike), Dominion, Thunderstone, Ascension: Chronicle of the Godslayer, Myth: Pantheons, Arcana, Elemental Clash, Race for the Galaxy, and The HeroCard family.

Also there are games with CCG-like card mechanics plus a boardgame component like Day and Night, Pit Fighter, and Flash Duel.

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NaughtHere wrote:
Definitely look into non-collectible card games like the LCGs Fantasy Flight publishes. CCGs aren't designed to be balanced, they're designed to sell cards, so the people spending the most money have the best decks.

My personal favorite LCG is Call of Cthulhu, but they're all great.

Other games that are like CCGs without the bad parts are Heroes of Graxia, Guardians of Graxia, Summoner Wars, Blue Moon,Nature of the Beast, Arctic Scavenger, Yomi (also called Fantasy Strike), Dominion, Thunderstone, Ascension: Chronicle of the Godslayer, Myth: Pantheons, Arcana, Elemental Clash, Race for the Galaxy, and The HeroCard family.

Also there are games with CCG-like card mechanics plus a boardgame component like Day and Night, Pit Fighter, and Flash Duel.



I don't see how any card game could avoid either power creep, printing functional duplicates, or printing cards that are not as effective as cards already printed. Unless of course they stopped printing cards.
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Eric Etkin
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cferejohn wrote:
Any CCG is going to have that problem. If you don't like old cards being obsoleted and a constantly morphing ruleset, I'm not sure that CCGs are for you. Have you considered LCGs and the like (Living Card Games). Expandable card games that don't hew to the randomized pack model. They are easier to break out when you are the only one who is invested (one problem with CCGs is that you really need a community collecting, buying, and building to play them).

I am really digging Summoner Wars in that vein. I'm sure some folks will recommend others.

Oh, I'll throw Dominion on the pile too. Not usually referred to as an LCG (for stylistic and, I think, copyright reasons), but a similar premise, and it is a game that some magic vets find very interesting (otoh, some magic vets find it dull as dishwater, so try before you buy there I think).

Good luck.


I'll take this opportunity to shamelessly pimp TactDecks, which follows the LCG model (though I typically use "CCG" to describe it, since "LCG" doesn't have the same term awareness).

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/70740/tactdecks

http://www.tactdecks.com

On the non-self-serving side of things, my RPG group has been having a great time with Thunderstone on our off-nights.
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I'd humbly suggest that you try, Warhammer: Invasion, the LCG from Fantasy Flight Games. It's incredibly awesome.

Go here to read my early release review of the game from last fall:

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/443230/warhammer-invasio...

then you can read the follow-up article I wrote about the factions and such here:

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/444982/warhammer-invasio...
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Benjamin Tharin
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Bloody Hell my Wife is coming back in 30 minutes and i hope she gets stuck in Traffic Jam (TV evening, yay yuk) so I can read up on all that awesome stuff, you guys rock! Keep the suggestions coming, i'll read it all up =)
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cferejohn wrote:
Any CCG is going to have that problem. If you don't like old cards being obsoleted and a constantly morphing ruleset, I'm not sure that CCGs are for you.


There is one that doesn't have this problem: Vampire: The Eternal Struggle. I always introduce that game as "the CCG that does right all the stuff you've come to hate about M:TG", because:
- The old cards are just as playable as the new ones. You can take decks made from the first sets or the newest ones, and they'll be equally competetive, even in tournaments.
- There's a banned list of only 10 cards or so, and these are banned for good reason. All other cards are legal for play.
- There's no card limit in a deck, so no more "having the 5th of card X being useless right out of the pack".
- You don't need to buy much if you don't want to. Get 2 of the same starter and mesh them together, you got a 'good enough' deck. Buy some cheap bulk of old cards from eBay, you're just as good (see first point)
- There are no power rares. The commons are the cards you want plenty of in a deck, the rares are cards you want few of in a deck.
- No cards are ever designed as mere stronger versions of others.
- The rules have been updated over time, and some new stuff gets added, sure. But the core rules and mechanics have very much stayed the same since the very beginning. There is absolutely no "morphing ruleset". You can quit for years and come back with hardly any effort.
- Most of the time, cards that prove popular (and as such, become expensive online) get reprinted in starters, so everyone can get them. Most of the 'staple cards' get reprinted in base sets regularly, too.

Keep in mind though that V:TES is meant as a multiplayer game (although it's playable by two people) and it's a bit harder to learn for people not already familiar with the likes of M:TG. But I love it, it's great.
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Norman Brown, Jr

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I have to agree with John Doe. VTES is a fantastic game.

I also want to say that the rarity scheme matches the actually utility of the cards. The broadly useful cards are commons while the more specialized cards with a narrow application are rare.

It's got all the politics of the Louisiana Congress,
It's got the combat of that ranges from fire-breathing vampires to Gargoyles with RPG-launchers.
It's got the stealth of a moonless night and the vision of a crystal ball.
It's just a great, great game.
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Chris Benson
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frumpish wrote:
NaughtHere wrote:
Definitely look into non-collectible card games like the LCGs Fantasy Flight publishes. CCGs aren't designed to be balanced, they're designed to sell cards, so the people spending the most money have the best decks.

My personal favorite LCG is Call of Cthulhu, but they're all great.

Other games that are like CCGs without the bad parts are Heroes of Graxia, Guardians of Graxia, Summoner Wars, Blue Moon,Nature of the Beast, Arctic Scavenger, Yomi (also called Fantasy Strike), Dominion, Thunderstone, Ascension: Chronicle of the Godslayer, Myth: Pantheons, Arcana, Elemental Clash, Race for the Galaxy, and The HeroCard family.

Also there are games with CCG-like card mechanics plus a boardgame component like Day and Night, Pit Fighter, and Flash Duel.



I don't see how any card game could avoid either power creep, printing functional duplicates, or printing cards that are not as effective as cards already printed. Unless of course they stopped printing cards.


Didn't say they did. LCGs just have less because of the reasons I mentioned.
 
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It is older than a couple of years but try Netrunner. It is by the creator of M:tG.
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Robert Scythe
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It is older than a couple of years but try Netrunner. It is by the creator of M:tG.


Well, so is V:TES and it has a broader player base and is a great multiplayer game, though Netrunner has the dueling aspect. Really should try out V:TES for all the previous reasons given.
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Darkgalahad wrote:
Is there anything rather new (like 1 - 2 years) CCG that looks promising for an old M:TG vet ?

Not really. But why does it have to be new? Pick up a good defunct CCG you missed out on back in the day. There are a couple dandies that are going for pennies per pound, and you'll get many times the value than the silly LCG trend can offer.

Edit to comment on previous recommendations:

Netrunner is a fantastic game; try it if you can find it. It's not really a typical CCG, though, even though it was marketed as one. Deckbuilding actually makes this a considerably worse game than just playing out of the box.

Jyhad is a good one, too. Well worth a look.
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Benjamin Tharin
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After reading so much i decided to give Warhammer a try since i want to play with a buddy of mine and a later on for more players Vampire, Spoils is also on the Whishlist but i really have to read up more to know what I'm entitleing myself to.

Thank you so much guys. Awesome Warhammer Review Anthony, thank you!

Regards
 
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Carl Pilhatsch
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You should really try VTES. I for my part can say that I have enjoyed it for the last 16 years, and it's still great fun. I have played it continuously and I still haven't built all the decks I could ever imagine. :laugh:

I really like the social aspect of the game. It's just great to get together with a couple of friends and enjoy the company and the game. If you like strategy, tactics, politics, intrigue and violence, go for it! :D
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Max Maloney
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I bought a few of the early starters and boosters of V:TES right at the beginning when it was still Jyhad. I always want to get back into it and it always comes up in these CCG recommendation threads but...

Where can you buy it? The usual retailers I use, locally and online, for other games (board and CCG) do not carry this game. It's supposedly in print, right? In some form?
 
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Adrian Hague
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I would reccomend going with a zombie ccg (dead/ undead, i.e. OOP)

1) They are cheaper to collect (Potomac Distribution and Hill's Wholesale Gaming are two good/ cheap sites);
2) You know how finite the entire collection will be
3) There are plenty of established traders, forums and whatnot.

Good examples include: Star Treck (2nd Ed., Decipher), Middle-Earth CCG (ICE, NOT the Decipher one), Netrunner (WotC), and Hecatomb (or is it Hetacomb...)(WotC), of which I currently have a good few kilo's for sale...
 
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Mikko Karvonen
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Darkgalahad wrote:
some WoW Spinoff as it seems.


I don't know if you have some profound objections against World of Warcraft, but the CCG is actually very good. It has many similarities to Magic, but avoids its biggest pitfalls, while providing a lot of variety and different strategies and tactics.

It does have the usual challenge of keeping up with the new releases, but if that does not bother you, I'd suggest also checking it out.
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Bartosz Trzaskowski

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AdrianPHague wrote:
I would reccomend going with a zombie ccg (dead/ undead, i.e. OOP)

1) They are cheaper to collect (Potomac Distribution and Hill's Wholesale Gaming are two good/ cheap sites)
;
2) You know how finite the entire collection will be
3) There are plenty of established traders, forums and whatnot.

Good examples include: Star Trek (2nd Ed., Decipher), Middle-Earth CCG (ICE, NOT the Decipher one), Netrunner (WotC), and Hecatomb (or is it Hetacomb...)(WotC), of which I currently have a good few kilo's for sale...


OOP CCGs are a nice idea, but by no means is e.g. MECCG (ICE) cheap to collect or available on plenty websites.
 
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Adrian Hague
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MECCG prices: 10 Challenge Decks regularly for around $40 on Ebay. That's 1100 cards for forty bucks. No further collecting req'd.
 
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Race for the Galaxy started out as a CCG and incorporates many of the usual CCG meachanics, without actually being collectible. The current three expansions are the full first expansion arc, with another expansion arc (starting with the base game) is apparently planned for the future.

Have a look at that, I guess it's very similar to a M:TG cube or the likes, only designed with balance in mind from the start, by the designers themselves. And they gave their best to avoid power creep, too, by means of making the cards not the same and stronger or weaker, but different.

I haven't really played it yet though

I guess LCGs, the designers of which have the intention of selling more expansions in the future, are more prone to power creep than a closed system like this. In fact, I wouldn't have bought RftG if I hadn't read somewhere (and had it confirmed later by the designer) that no future expansions compatible to the current ones will come out.
 
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Bartosz Trzaskowski

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AdrianPHague wrote:
MECCG prices: 10 Challenge Decks regularly for around $40 on Ebay. That's 1100 cards for forty bucks. No further collecting req'd.


Are you sure? I'm checking ebay for MECCG quite regularly since a a while and the cheapest I saw was ~$12 per challenge deck a year ago. I haven't seen a full set of challenge decks on one auction for at least 6 months.


gwaihir, the only source that has it constantly in stock has single decks for 12.50 Euro.
 
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Not quite a CCG in its traditional meaning but still a very unique card game with drafting mechanics I would like to propose War for Edaðh

It's basically a battle between two armies that are drafted from various races and troops. It has a strong deduction element as well as rock/paper/scissor troop mechanics and terrain effects.

I got a few spare copies lying around if you ever want to try it!

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Dormammu wrote:
I bought a few of the early starters and boosters of V:TES right at the beginning when it was still Jyhad. I always want to get back into it and it always comes up in these CCG recommendation threads but...

Where can you buy it? The usual retailers I use, locally and online, for other games (board and CCG) do not carry this game. It's supposedly in print, right? In some form?


Sure:

Potomac Distribution
http://www.potomacdist.com/list.asp?code=1640
All Star Trading Cards
http://allstartradingcards.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWCATS...
Walch & Nusser
http://www.vtes.de/catalog/
The Lasombra
http://www.thelasombra.com/sales.htm
Amazon
http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_ss_0_15?url=search-alias%3Dap......
White Wolf
http://store.white-wolf.com/VTES-C15.aspx
Universal Cards
http://www.universalcards.net/servlet/the-Gaming-cln-Vampire......
CCG Armory
http://www.ccgarmory.com/vaetst.html


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