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Subject: I'm not a Euro Games Geek rss

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Loris GIANADDA
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After a few months there, reading comments, posting some geeklists, I discover that I'm not much of a EuroGames geek.

I prefer wargames (I mean old, big, hex&counters, not Memoir'44) or monstergames, or anything than Catan.
I don't know why. For Catan, there is too much luck in it. It is not that I don't like game-based luck, but in Catan, if you have some bad luck on the two or three firsts turns, you have lost the game but have to play until the end. Torture.

Maybe it is not enough dripping with theme for me, or the theme don't really interest me...
Really, I don't know.

Give me a big spankin Twilight Imperium 3, but I feel like I'm going to sell Catan.

Two weeks ago I told my games dealer (Jeux du Monde in Toulouse, France) that I was not interested by Eurogames such as Puerto Rico. He asked me: "Don't you fear missing a good game, doing this?"
Well, I don't feel so. There are so much good non-eurogames that I want that I can miss the few eurogames I could like.

Well, I say that but what I put in Eurogames is really narrow, maybe lots of games in my geeklist are eurogames I rated high. Point them if you feel.

That's all, I just realized that a few weeks ago.

Non-flaming comments welcome and have a nice day ,
greuh.
 
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MK
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I don't know... I've always been able to battle back from a bad start in Catan. Not necessarily win, but get back into the game. Thus the fact that I didn't win is not because of my earlier bad luck, more likely because of game play after I've caught up, both mine and the other players.
 
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Loris GIANADDA
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Well, my original post miss the "I think that" before "Catan has too much luck in it".

Maybe the fact I don't really like the game makes I don't feel battling back after some bad turns.

greuh.
 
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David Tracy
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There is nothing wrong with just liking wargames. I don't think Eurogames are for everyone. For whatever it is worth, you will always be a geek in my book, just a different kind of geek.

 
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MK
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Ah yes... if trying to battle back in Catan is not your thing, then no, you won't enjoy it.
 
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Necessary Evil
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Games are games...

Euro-game/Wargame... its just a title. I am sure someday there will be a newkind of game that is all the rage.

Games are games play what you like with people you like and you can't go wrong.

-M
 
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Mark McEvoy
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if you have some bad luck on the two or three firsts turns, you have lost the game but have to play until the end. Torture.

Odd, in most wargames I've seen, the same basic fact is prevalent (a bad start leads to a torturous game where there's little chance for recovery). The diference being, in Catan it's over in under an hour, in most wargames your whole evening is shot while you watch the other players pick over your remains.
 
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Rod Spade
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If Catan is the only Euro you've tried, not liking it doesn't mean you won't enjoy other Euros. I'm a Euro fan, but I haven't bothered to buy Catan....

You should try PR and E&T before deciding you don't like Euros. If you can try them without spending money, all the better.

If you just don't like Euros, that's cool. But I don't think you should judge the genre based on your experience with Catan.
 
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Dane Peacock
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Loris, this is interesting. I know there are many in the USA that are heavy wargamers that do not care for the Euro games, but is it rare in France? What game did you play growing up? Just curious.
 
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Ava Jarvis
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I feel Catan is overrated in so many ways. I despise the game, actually. Other people feel differently.

Yet I am still a Eurogamer, though I don't think of myself as such, even though that is the majority of what I buy. There's a lot more out there than Catan---a heck of a lot more. Just as there's a heck of a lot more in wargames out there than ASL.

I like some of the smaller wargames too, I guess, if block games count, and I know to some people they don't, even though those can also take hours to play.
 
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Hey, I think you should be entitled to like what you like and to not like what you don't like...

As far as the comment about "Missing a good Euro-game"... well I say heck there are WAY too many games out there that I will never own to worry about missing a game... besides if it is really that good.. hanging out on the geek will make you aware of its existance and then you can decided if you want to try it.

But hey it is your money buy what YOU enjoy.

I would rather only own 3 games I really like than 100 games that were so-so on my list.
 
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Leonardo Gonzalez
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I am no longer a wargamer (really I was never a wargamer) however I am still interested on some especially from Columbia Games.
Then I didnt see any Columbia Games in your rated games, you should try them.


 
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Darren M
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Certainly there are a lot of different styles of games/gamers and Eurogames aren't for everyone. I generally like to keep an open mind and I think a best-of-both-worlds mentality is a good way to go as well.

Some of the good Euro/American style games like A Game of Thrones may appeal to you as well because you'e rated both Dune and Diplomacy highly.

Games like Struggle of Empires and 7 Ages may also have some appeal as they are good examples of games with good themes yet they have that Euro/crossover feel to them.

I guess my point is that Euro-games are evolving and there is a subset that are embracing the thematic richness of games of the past and blending them with the efficiency of the Eurogame genre...and keeping an eye on what is out there currently and what is coming in the pipeline should be interesting.


 
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J C Lawrence
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So where's the problem?
At the end of the day you have games you like, you play them with enjoyable people and have a good time. What else is actually important?

So there are some games you don't like. Big whoop. I don't like poker, so there. So there are some games you dislike that many other people do like? Big whoop. I still don't like poker. So there are some games that you like that other people dislike. Big whoop. I still like &pick-a-game;. So you're not a member of the super-elite club of people who only like the fashionable things because, well, they're fashionable? Big whoop. I wear jeans and T-shirts because I like them, not because some fashion magazine or abstract set of boardgaming geeks said I should.

You've got games. You're ahead right there. You've got games you like. Heck, you're way ahead. You've got people to play those game with. Umm, there's a problem here?
 
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Jonathan Tang
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Quote:
I discover that I'm not much of a EuroGames geek

wow
GASP!!!
Back, back, you fiend!

Quick, someone. Get the PR Holy Water!
We'll save this poor soul yet!
...
...
 
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Nate Sandall
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There's nothing wrong with preferring some game categories and not being the least interested in others. There's room on the geek here for everyone. Well, except maybe the LARPers!
 
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stephen broadbent
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Me Too
My group is also not much into euro games, PR was not a big hit, neither was T&E, or PoF, I recognize thse for the good games that they are but we love playing games like BANG, TI or Modern Art each to his own.
 
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Eric "Shippy McShipperson" Mowrer
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My problem is that I like both types of games, in addition to party games and computer games, and word games, and.... and.... and there aren't enough hours in the day!! cry
 
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Ludes
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well ...
Quote:
At the end of the day you have games you like, you play them with enjoyable people and have a good time. What else is actually important?

You've got games. You're ahead right there. You've got games you like. Heck, you're way ahead. You've got people to play those game with. Umm, there's a problem here?


Agreed - ultimately that's the bottom line.

But, there's always the desire to broaden not only one's horizons but others' horizons. I'd say your dealer is "guilty" of the latter. A somewhat extreme case (and it didn't involve me personally) ... one can't play 50 or 100 games of Titan without becoming just a bit jaded and looking for other options.

What defines a "Euro-game" anyway?

A lot of people will probably find Loris' categorical label of Euro-games as a limited view. Likewise, some of those same people view wargames in general as a limited gaming experience (myself included, alas; been there, probably never going back). Certainly there must be characteristics and criteria in both categories that allow for a greater similarity than may be otherwise obvious.

However, one play should not determine a game's quality in anyone's eyes. I at first was not very impressed with Puerto Rico. I felt overwhelmed by 1830 (but now know it well enough that I find 1835 quite inferior). I've only played El Grande (kind of liked) and Taj Mahal (disliked) once each, and should wait on judgements until I've had further experience. After a few plays, I also don't care much for Settlers; Princes of Florence has remained a very pleasant game, as much for its quickness and beautiful components as its sutble strategies. From the one game I've played, Die Macher seems to definitely be worth the effort.

As much as it comes down to playing what you like with whom you like ... in trying new games, there's an issue of how competent and proficient some of the other players are and their willingness to teach you a new game, and not just the rules. That can also make a world of difference.

Good luck, Loris, whichever course of action you take.

 
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Loris GIANADDA
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Global and local answers
Thanks to everyone. First of all, I'd like to thank everyone who answered my first post. BGGs, you ROCK!!


Hey, I won't ever turn down to play a game if I am proposed it. On the contrary, I'll even be really happy to try any game. For what I see, I'm thinking it's also something of a mood. At the moment, I'm craving to play ASL, Republic of Rome and Civilization (bought soon).
Maybe, in some months, I will comme back on my opinion. I'd love to try Puerto Rico and E&T, but there is another problem: I'm the guy who buys the games, around here. So I'm not motived for the moment in buying those.
Zendo, maybe, but he is waaaaaaaaaaay too expensive, here, in France (50Euros, that makes for around $65).


Quote:
Loris, this is interesting. I know there are many in the USA that are heavy wargamers that do not care for the Euro games, but is it rare in France? What game did you play growing up? Just curious.


I confirm you that it is rare in France. Gaming as always be seen as a childish activity in France, and this bad opinion is disappearing with EuroGames.
Wargamers had a big extinction movement in the 80-90's (mostly the 90's with Magic, but also the 80's with Warhammer and RPGs).

I'm rather young as I'm only 23 and some times I don't feel "right" with the gamers of my age, as I prefer longer, theme-dripping monster games. And the truth is that I mostly play with persons older than me.

The story of my gamerlife? Well, I began at 8 with roleplaying game (the Dark Eye). I played a few games with my older brother. Then I played Heroquest (MB&GW) with my friends. After that, I really began to play RPGs. Around 14-15, wargames seemed appealing, but I was not able to understand the rules (even if I was good in English at the time). Magic has been a big thing in my life between 93 and 98 (yep, I began when it was not even translated and I was 12): deck building, tournaments (never won at the time) and no spare time. After Magic, it was Warhamme40k, painting and stuff. But I did played RPGs at the same time.
Oh, and I "worked" (helped the guy who really worked) in the ludothèque ("games library" ?) of my hometown, who made me discover boardgames (mainly Ludodélire's ones: Full Métal Planète, Formule Dé, Terrain Vague). And since I love games.
It is just recently that I managed to play a wargame, after having bought the ASLSK. I liked big games (Civ, RoR), and the SK was a new try at wargames that ended well (the last one was with "Air Assault on Crete").
So I've just become a wargames fan (adding that to my -slowly fading- addiction to RPGs and my addiction to monstergames), learning full-scale ASL and dreaming to find people to play my World In Flames.
Here endth the scriptures

Thank you all.
Loris.
 
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