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Conflict of Heroes: Storms of Steel! – Kursk 1943» Forums » Rules

Subject: gun pits: infantry too? rss

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Pasta Batman
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From section 18.2:
Quote:
Gun pit emplacements add a blue frontal +3DM, no flank DM, and may be used by anti-tank guns, infantry guns, and artillery guns.

I assume there is an implied 'also' after 'may', to be inclusive of infantry.
 
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James Palmer
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pastabatman wrote:
From section 18.2:
Quote:
Gun pit emplacements add a blue frontal +3DM, no flank DM, and may be used by anti-tank guns, infantry guns, and artillery guns.

I assume there is an implied 'also' after 'may', to be inclusive of infantry.


Since infantry does not have blue frontal DM, the gun pit wouldn't provide any help to them anyway.
 
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Pasta Batman
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Felkor wrote:
Since infantry does not have blue frontal DM, the gun pit wouldn't provide any help to them anyway.

Why not? I assumed it would give them a blue frontal DM of 2 where they had none before.
 
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James Palmer
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pastabatman wrote:
Felkor wrote:
Since infantry does not have blue frontal DM, the gun pit wouldn't provide any help to them anyway.

Why not? I assumed it would give them a blue frontal DM of 2 where they had none before.


Nope. That would make it pretty crummy, too. That would mean they'd have a blue "2" defense, which would be easy to take out by any unit with a blue firepower. But no, units only have one colour of front defense and one colour of flank defense, and modifiers only affect it if they match the colour.
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Darin Helgeson
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I think James' point is that they don't have a blue defense value, only a red one. Therefore they are attacked using red attack values thus a Blue DM would not affect them.
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Pasta Batman
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Felkor wrote:
But no, units only have one colour of front defense and one colour of flank defense, and modifiers only affect it if they match the colour.

You are right, of course. I see now the shield would have been black if also applicable to infantry, like the frontal DM values on the bunker counters. Still, crummy or not, I don't see a thematic reason why a gun pit wouldn't give infantry some protection. But I concede it's a moot point for gameplay. But looking at the bunker counter now, I see that, although it's front/top DM is black, it's flank shield is red? I guess those bunker flank walls were pretty thin.
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John McLintock
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pastabatman wrote:
Felkor wrote:
But no, units only have one colour of front defense and one colour of flank defense, and modifiers only affect it if they match the colour.

You are right, of course. I see now the shield would have been black if also applicable to infantry, like the frontal DM values on the bunker counters. Still, crummy or not, I don't see a thematic reason why a gun pit wouldn't give infantry some protection. But I concede it's a moot point for gameplay. But looking at the bunker counter now, I see that, although it's front/top DM is black, it's flank shield is red? I guess those bunker flank walls were pretty thin.

I guess that gun pits don't protect infantry because they are too small to allow squads to deploy in fighting formation inside them. They are built to protect a gun and its small crew clustered around their field piece after all.

Bunkers can be occupied by all foot units including guns, but not by vehicles. Guns have blue front defence and red flank defence. So the bunker's front defence is black for guns' blue defence value and red for infantry and guns' red defence value.
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JMcL63 wrote:
Bunkers can be occupied by all foot units including guns, but not by vehicles. Guns have blue front defence and red flank defence. So the bunker's front defence is black for guns' blue defence value and red for infantry and guns' red defence value.

Not sure I follow. Black means it applies to both blue and red. From the rulebook:
Quote:
Bunkers have a black front defense rating which adds DMs against both blue and red direct frontal FP and all mortar/ artillery fire. The smaller secondary shield defense value is the bunker DM added to a unit’s defense for any direct fire (not mortar and artillery fire) originating from the bunker’s flank.
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John McLintock
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pastabatman wrote:
JMcL63 wrote:
Bunkers can be occupied by all foot units including guns, but not by vehicles. Guns have blue front defence and red flank defence. So the bunker's front defence is black for guns' blue defence value and red for infantry and guns' red defence value.

Not sure I follow. Black means it applies to both blue and red. From the rulebook:
Quote:
Bunkers have a black front defense rating which adds DMs against both blue and red direct frontal FP and all mortar/ artillery fire. The smaller secondary shield defense value is the bunker DM added to a unit’s defense for any direct fire (not mortar and artillery fire) originating from the bunker’s flank.

In reply to your comment about the bunker's flank shield being red I was trying to point out that the units which can occupy bunkers- infantry and guns, all have red Flank DRs. The black front DM is there because guns have a blue Front DR. I hope that makes sense.
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