Eric O. LEBIGOT
France
Versailles
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
The rulebook reads:
Quote:
Note: The Resistance must select the Mission Success card; Spies may select either the Mission Success or Mission Fail card.
Is this a rule that must always be followed, or simply a piece of advice? The fact that this point is only put in a note (and that I have yet to play the game) makes me wonder…

As soon as I have the answer to this questions and have enough people around and some time to play, I'll put Resistance on the table. Looking forward to it, as all the comments I've read are very positive!
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
D E
United States
San Francisco
California
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
It must be followed. Resistance members have no choice, they must succeed the mission. Spies can submit either. Resistance members are given both simply because otherwise you'd have to ask each member which side they were on.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Miguel [working on TENNISmind]
France
Caen
(from Valencia, Spain)
flag msg tools
designer
My best-rated game: TETRARCHIA, about the tetrarchy that saved Rome
badge
My latest game: Big*Bang, a simple abstract about the first minutes of the Universe
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
So, if you are a spy, make your choice before you are given the mission cards so that you don't take too long to give yours back, it will be suspicious...
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Sebastian Ross
Switzerland
Zurich
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mb
The rule should absolutely be followed.

I wasn't so precise when explaining the rules before a play. Promptly one of the Resistance decided to sabotage a mission "just because he felt like it". The game was pointless from that point on. Nothing anybody did or said made sense anymore and the spies won easily.

Next time I will be to the point when explaining the rules.
8 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jeff Mays
United States
Cincinnati
Ohio
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Since the entire objective of members of the Resistance is to successfully complete missions, and the objectives for the Spies are to sabotage missions (and trying to remain undetected while doing so), I cannot imagine a situation where it would ever be advantageous for a member of the Resistance to cause a mission to fail.

As Spies know one another, and 3 failed missions are all that is needed for the Spies to win, why would a member of the Resistance cause a mission to fail? I assume it is stated specifically in the rules so someone playing the first time wouldn't somehow out think themselves into doing something so utterly counter productive, but I wouldn't really call it a restraint.
6 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Eric O. LEBIGOT
France
Versailles
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
GrrBlarg wrote:
Since the entire objective of members of the Resistance is to successfully complete missions, and the objectives for the Spies are to sabotage missions (and trying to remain undetected while doing so), I cannot imagine a situation where it would ever be advantageous for a member of the Resistance to cause a mission to fail.

As Spies know one another, and 3 failed missions are all that is needed for the Spies to win, why would a member of the Resistance cause a mission to fail? I assume it is stated specifically in the rules so someone playing the first time wouldn't somehow out think themselves into doing something so utterly counter productive, but I wouldn't really call it a restraint.
Since I have not played the game, I was wondering, when reading the rules, whether a resistance player would want to pretend he was a spy early on in the game so as to try to make spies believe they're on their side: I was wondering whether this could be a way for the resistance member to be chosen more often by spy leaders.

Of course, I do not know anything about the dynamics of the game: that's why I needed expert advice about things that might look obvious to people who have already played the game.

I invited my family this week-end for a gaming birthday party, and I'll introduce Resistance.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ax Bits
Canada
Ottawa
Ontario
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
The spies already know who is a spy and who is a rebel. No amount of trickery is going to work on them.
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Eric O. LEBIGOT
France
Versailles
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Maxx_Pointy wrote:
The spies already know who is a spy and who is a rebel. No amount of trickery is going to work on them.
Good point. I had missed this, in the rules, to the point that we started playing without the spies knowing who was who! gulp
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Bruce Glassco
United States
Charlottesville
Virginia
flag msg tools
designer
Avatar
Re: "The Resistance must select the Mission Success card": is this a constraint, or only a piece of advice?
I agree that this point needs to be stressed, particularly when one is playing with certain groups. I've seen games of Saboteur ruined because a loyal dwarf decided it would be more fun to ignore the card he was dealt and play as a Saboteur, and I'm sure the same thing could easily happen in this game as well.
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Yee Keat Phuah
Malaysia
flag msg tools
BruceGee wrote:
I agree that this point needs to be stressed, particularly when one is playing with certain groups. I've seen games of Saboteur ruined because a loyal dwarf decided it would be more fun to ignore the card he was dealt and play as a Saboteur, and I'm sure the same thing could easily happen in this game as well.

Wow, I have the same experience with saboteur. I try not to play with the person next anymore in this type of games. Will try to stress this in my upcoming resistance session, thanks for the tip.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Tomi K
Finland
flag msg tools
GrrBlarg wrote:
I cannot imagine a situation where it would ever be advantageous for a member of the Resistance to cause a mission to fail.

-- why would a member of the Resistance cause a mission to fail?

3 go on a mission: me and 2 others. I assume both of them to be the 2 spies of the game.

Just before we turn mission cards I shout "I put a FAIL, so there's at least 2 FAILS!"

If there are 2 FAILS, I have proven that at least 1 of those 2 is a spy.
If there are 3 FAILS, I have won the game for the resistance.

That is why it is not permitted in the rules - the resistance would have an edge. UNLESS the spied would be quick to reach shouting also "I put a FAIL too!!" and bluffing to be resistance playing a FAIL. Probably would not happen the first time...

We played it once like that, and the resistance won. I was suspected at first to be a spy, but the resistance had enough turns to make sure I am not.

After my play there was about half an hour argument&shouting about the thing that I should have waited a bit longer to shout what I did. Meaning, just before the mission cards are shown. But I actually shouted it when I played my mission card to the table. I wasn't able to convince anyone that it didn't matter do I then tell I played FAIL, or just before the mission cards are shown (2 others had already chosen their mission cards). The word "unfair" popped up a lot. To tell what card I played after 2 had already chosen their cards, and had no chance to change their cards... So if someone else wants to try this, wait for the moment that all 3 mission cards are collecterd from the table. I don't see why it matters... I could have been the first to play my card. I would have played it the same - I don't see through cards. Maybe then I wouldn't have been called unfair?

I see those instances as:
a) I play a card, and 2 other players play cards that are Fail or Success
b) 2 other players play cards that are Fail or Success, I play a card

b = unfair
a = a pure gentleman
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Luis Carlos
Colombia
flag msg tools
sross wrote:
The rule should absolutely be followed.

I wasn't so precise when explaining the rules before a play. Promptly one of the Resistance decided to sabotage a mission "just because he felt like it". The game was pointless from that point on. Nothing anybody did or said made sense anymore and the spies won easily.

Next time I will be to the point when explaining the rules.

Yes, I understood why this rule is so important once I played as the commander. I could have gone to a mission with all the spies, then play the "failure" card (knowing that at least one of them would play it too) and then accuse them of being spies, with the help of my bodyguard! It would have unbalanced the game in favour of the resistance.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Janne
Finland
Tampere
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmb
luiscarlosqg wrote:
sross wrote:
The rule should absolutely be followed.

I wasn't so precise when explaining the rules before a play. Promptly one of the Resistance decided to sabotage a mission "just because he felt like it". The game was pointless from that point on. Nothing anybody did or said made sense anymore and the spies won easily.

Next time I will be to the point when explaining the rules.

Yes, I understood why this rule is so important once I played as the commander. I could have gone to a mission with all the spies, then play the "failure" card (knowing that at least one of them would play it too) and then accuse them of being spies, with the help of my bodyguard! It would have unbalanced the game in favour of the resistance.
Depending on how the previous missions went, you might have hard time convincing the rest of the resistance that you and your bodyguard are not the spies. Also, I think you forgot the assassin. Also, this thread is really old.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Luis Carlos
Colombia
flag msg tools
jhsa wrote:
luiscarlosqg wrote:
Depending on how the previous missions went, you might have hard time convincing the rest of the resistance that you and your bodyguard are not the spies. Also, I think you forgot the assassin. Also, this thread is really old.

The opportunity was PERFECT.

In the first round of the game I and two spies were selected for the mission and it passed . I (as the commander) knew my wife was the other spy. I happened to be the leader of the second mission, I could have chosen the three of us that went to the first mission + my wife (it would not have risen any suspicion from the assassin). Then play the failure card, that way at least 2 (luckily 3) failure cards would have been played! But I didn't do it, to avoid cheating

(The bodyguard wouldn't have gone to the mission, btw I didn't know who he was...).
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls