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Subject: How do you deal with dwarves on walls? rss

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LSU LSU
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My group just got the dwarves/goblins starter set - previously we'd only played with elves and orcs. The dwarves are awesome at taking down walls. My goblin opponent put out all three walls, and with two besiege walls (separated by several turns) one Gror quake and an engineer I took them all out. An obvious move would be to only put out one, or at most, two walls at a time. This has several drawbacks however.
1) you might have to hold a wall in your hand for several turns
2) if you're the goblins, having fewer summoning positions really sucks because you can't get your 0 cost units out.
3) can't use walls as defensive blocks.

On the whole the goblins seem quite tricky to use. You really have to time events correctly. The dwarves are a lot of fun. Well placed defenders are basically like extra walls to protect your summoner, or whoever else you might care about, and the extra die spearmen get is fabulous. I've just played this matchup once, but my goblin opponent's strategy of putting a lot of cheap commons out really just resulted in me having an enormous amount of magic. I hardly burned any units and had no magic problems at all. He didn't bring out the eater or mooks however, as he didn't think they were useful. I plan to use them heavily in a rematch.

Does Mook's power multiply? i.e., if there are 2 goblin units within three spaces of him, do you add 2 to his die, and 1 to each of theirs?
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Jason Cookingham
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LSUtigers wrote:
Does Mook's power multiply? i.e., if there are 2 goblin units within three spaces of him, do you add 2 to his die, and 1 to each of theirs?


Mook gives a cave goblin unit within 3 spaces of him +1 to their die results when they are attacking. The number of units has no bearing in the area has no bearing.

He doesn't affect himself.
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LSU LSU
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Forgot that it doesn't affect Mook. Thanks. Can it affect more than one goblin?

Also - if Blarf is killed with cards under him - do those cards go to the magic pile of the player that killed him, or are they discarded?
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Jason Cookingham
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To answer your general question, the game is generally about keeping on the offense.. or, at the very least, keep your opponent reacting to you. The goblins are the epitome of this. One strong initial wave can keep your opponent reeling for the rest of the game.

On the other hand, if they survive that initial wave well.. then the gobs tend to be the ones in trouble.

It is hard to offer advice without seeing games, but...

1) Don't grow attached to units outside the summoner. Get as many out as quick as possible and risk them in a big attack.

2) Don't grow attached to your hand. If you get three champions in your opening hand, then you are in bad shape (ok, Blarf is cheap.. but I am speaking generally here). You are much better off dumping an initially bad hand to have a lot of magic to play with a new hand.

3) In that sense, don't use your walls as a defensive barrier. Put one in the second row. Sneeks can handle himself quite well (and should be used early on), and can get out of trouble pretty quickly.

4) Don't concentrate your forces. Try to attack on the left, middle, and right. It protects the gobs from Gror, and it makes the defense of the dwarves weaker.

5) Don't be afraid to attack his walls. It serves three purposes:
a) it makes the most of all your attacks if you can't get to a target b) it blocks their potential summoning spots
c) it makes them have to worry about their own walls-- again, reacting to you

6) IMO, a berserker is worth two slingers.. dump the slingers and use them for magic
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Jason Cookingham
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LSUtigers wrote:
Forgot that it doesn't affect Mook. Thanks. Can it affect more than one goblin?


Yeah, each goblin within range gets +1 to all die results for their combat roll. If it is only one fighter, then it gets +1 to all its die results. If there are three fighters in range, then they all get +1 to their die results.

Quote:
Also - if Blarf is killed with cards under him - do those cards go to the magic pile of the player that killed him, or are they discarded?


They go to the magic pile of the person that killed Blarf. With that being said, remember that you can attack your own units. If Blarf is really hurt and has a lot of cards under him, then be sure you kill him during the gobs turn.

He should have put that silly helmet on his back.
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LSU LSU
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1) that was my opponent's strategy. They got slaughtered, giving me a ton of magic. He did however have really bad rolls on the first turn (no kills) and when he used the event card that gave three goblins an extra move. He had 5 attacks that turn and only managed 2 hits, including 2 misses on my summoner. Other than that however the rolls were fairly even.

The bigger problem for him was that 5 of his event cards were the last 6 cards in his deck. Since I killed his walls and summoner the turn after he finally drew them, he never got to use them.

2) we're pretty good about dumping away unplayable champs. If we get two out of three champs out, we've gone champion heavy.

3) Yeah, that may have been a holdover from our elf v orc games, where they elves really need to hide behind walls sometimes and the orcs can use grognack's ability.

4) he tried that. The board gets crowded in a hurry. I brought out every single defender I had, which really slowed him down. I also had a second wall out on the upper left front, so everytime he sent a unit around it I could summon a spearman or defender to kill it off.

5) He almost succeeded at blocking all summoning points one turn - goblin rush is really useful for that.

6) He brought a bunch of berserker's out, but I was careful to not let him get next to 2 of my guys. He did it once by summoning it next to 2 players, and once when my two guys failed to get 2 hits (out of 4 rolls). But other than that he never got two attacks from them.

It seems really difficult for orcs to get magic to bring champs out. They need magic to pull out berserkers. The slingers are not really useful. And if they do save up some magic the dwarves can magic drain them. Holding magic drain and reinforcements is awsome for the dwarves.

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James Sitz
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One thing your opponent can do is use Sneeks a little more aggressively.

Sneeks has a decent chance of taking out a defender on his own with his 3 AV, and even if he doesn't he can Sly away (switching doesn't count as movement).

It seems odd you're summoning every defender and still being able to use Magic Drain and Reinforcements.

No one needs to summon berserkers.
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Anh Khoa Nguyen
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Until yesterday we didn't really look at the Besieging Walls card carefully enough so we use it to damage only one of the opponent's wall, not all of them. And even with that we thought these wall destructors are dangerous...

One things, though, since the Orcs's Ice Wall is considered a Wall in every respect, that mean they fall prey to that "earthquake" too, right ?
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LSU LSU
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Yep, besiege the wall works on all the walls of one opponent, and is an auto kill for an ice wall.

We're still having trouble killing the dwarves off, and the goblins just got their first win (out of 5 or 6 games). Against any of the three original factions the dwarves are quite good. Reinforcements and magic drain counter the event cards of the elves and orcs. Their champs, especially Baldar - who's great against enemy champs, and gror, who's just epic against large enemy forces - are very tough.

Dwarves can either go for a big wall kill, or bluff and dump their engineers for magic. Either way, their opponent has to hold on to wall cards for a long time, just in case. If you bring out two walls at once, then 2 besiege the wall cards takes each down to 1/3 strength.

The elves should match up reasonably well, but I tried the other day and got crushed. A big part of that was that both my magic drains and two burns were in the bottom 5 cards of my deck, so I never got to them, but still, it's a tough matchup.
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