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Subject: Rule for eliminated race rss

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Pierre Rainville
Canada
Fort McMurray
Alberta
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What happen to a player whose race is totally wiped off the board? Does he/she have to go into decline, even though he has no remaining pieces on the board or does he/she get to skip decline and select a new race at his next turn?
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Omar Germino
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Schaumburg
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Take a look at this thread: What we know so far - Clarification of Rules

Quote:
All active units destroyed
If all your active units are destroyed in one turn you may:
1) Score points only with the in-decline race.
or 2) Go into decline and score 0 for that turn.
You may not take a new combo this turn

When it says "score 0" I assume it means "score 0 for that race" (in case you have one in decline).

Not sure if that's an official Days of Wonder ruling on the matter, or even if it's consensus of the players.
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Mats Blohmé
Sweden
Simlångsdalen
Halland
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If any race tokens were returned to the player they enter the board as if it were a new race.
Whether or not any tokens have been returned to the player, going into decline still takes one turn, so it is possible to get zero points.
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Dan Schaeffer
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ogermino wrote:
Take a look at this thread: What we know so far - Clarification of Rules

Quote:
All active units destroyed
If all your active units are destroyed in one turn you may:
1) Score points only with the in-decline race.
or 2) Go into decline and score 0 for that turn.
You may not take a new combo this turn

When it says "score 0" I assume it means "score 0 for that race" (in case you have one in decline).

Not sure if that's an official Days of Wonder ruling on the matter, or even if it's consensus of the players.


If you go into decline, any previously declined race (absent Spirit power) will vanish, so you will score 0 for that one and 0 for your now-declined token-less race.

If you have a declined race and you don't decline your active (token-less) race, then you still score for your declined race, plus 0 for your token-less active race.
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Omar Germino
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Schaumburg
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Golux13 wrote:
If you go into decline, any previously declined race (absent Spirit power) will vanish, so you will score 0 for that one and 0 for your now-declined token-less race.

If you have a declined race and you don't decline your active (token-less) race, then you still score for your declined race, plus 0 for your token-less active race.

Ah, you're right. Forgot about that.
 
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Matt Morgan
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Old Bridge
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So to clarify, you can still score with a Spirit race, even when you are declining your active race? Some groups I have played with interpret declining to mean you are passing on your entire turn, but I do not agree.
 
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Michael Rumaley
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gundabad wrote:
So to clarify, you can still score with a Spirit race, even when you are declining your active race? Some groups I have played with interpret declining to mean you are passing on your entire turn, but I do not agree.
It's you AND THE RULE BOOK vs. some groups.
p.6 of rules wrote:
The player can make no conquests during the turn his race goes into decline; his turn ends immediately after scoring! He gains 1 Victory coin for each Region his newly In Decline tokens occupy
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Jeff shiv Flynn
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ogermino wrote:
Take a look at this thread: What we know so far - Clarification of Rules

Quote:
All active units destroyed
If all your active units are destroyed in one turn you may:
1) Score points only with the in-decline race.
or 2) Go into decline and score 0 for that turn.
You may not take a new combo this turn

When it says "score 0" I assume it means "score 0 for that race" (in case you have one in decline).

Not sure if that's an official Days of Wonder ruling on the matter, or even if it's consensus of the players.


I'm looking confirmation of my understanding for 2 related situations.

Situation #1 - Active race eliminated from board but some tokens in hand.
Resolution Option #1: Tokens for active race remain in hand until start of player's next turn, at which point they choose to retain them as active, bringing tokens from hand onto the board as if they were a new race.
Resolution Option #2: Tokens for active race remain in hand until start of player's next turn, at which point they choose to put active race into decline. Active race and special power boards are flipped, tokens are returned to tray and tokens/board for prior in-decline race are removed from play. Player will score 0 for this turn.

Situation #2 - Active race is destroyed (completely eliminated from the game with no tokens in hand). On player's next turn, player again has two options: put active race into decline OR retain destroyed race as active...
Resolution Option #1: Player chooses to retain destroyed race as active, retaining existing in-decline race but scoring nothing for eliminated race. (This option would only make sense to choose in last round of the game in cases where in-decline race was scoring a decent number of points and/or no time was available to introduce new active race.)
Resolution Option #2: Player puts destroyed active race into decline by flipping active race board to in-decline and removing board&tokens for prior in-decline race. Player scores 0 for this turn and will select new race on next turn.

The debate in a game played this past weekend was whether a destroyed active race would have its board removed from play, thereby retaining current in-decline race and picking up new race at start of next turn, effectively skipping the "going into decline" turn. As interpreted by the scenarios/options above, the existence and status (active or in-decline) of a race is assigned by the boards, regardless of the presence or location (on-board or in-hand) of unit tokens.


Thanks for any input,
Jeff
Portland, OR
 
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Dan Schaeffer
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jtflynn wrote:
I'm looking confirmation of my understanding for 2 related situations.

Situation #1 - Active race eliminated from board but some tokens in hand.
Resolution Option #1: Tokens for active race remain in hand until start of player's next turn, at which point they choose to retain them as active, bringing tokens from hand onto the board as if they were a new race.
Resolution Option #2: Tokens for active race remain in hand until start of player's next turn, at which point they choose to put active race into decline. Active race and special power boards are flipped, tokens are returned to tray and tokens/board for prior in-decline race are removed from play. Player will score 0 for this turn.


Correct in both situations. If you have tokens in hand - presumably because you removed them during the conquest(s) that took you off the board - you may re-enter the board on your next turn; or you may decline that race, following the steps you outline in #2.

Quote:
Situation #2 - Active race is destroyed (completely eliminated from the game with no tokens in hand). On player's next turn, player again has two options: put active race into decline OR retain destroyed race as active...
Resolution Option #1: Player chooses to retain destroyed race as active, retaining existing in-decline race but scoring nothing for eliminated race. (This option would only make sense to choose in last round of the game in cases where in-decline race was scoring a decent number of points and/or no time was available to introduce new active race.)
Resolution Option #2: Player puts destroyed active race into decline by flipping active race board to in-decline and removing board&tokens for prior in-decline race. Player scores 0 for this turn and will select new race on next turn.


Correct again.

Quote:
The debate in a game played this past weekend was whether a destroyed active race would have its board removed from play, thereby retaining current in-decline race and picking up new race at start of next turn, effectively skipping the "going into decline" turn. As interpreted by the scenarios/options above, the existence and status (active or in-decline) of a race is assigned by the boards, regardless of the presence or location (on-board or in-hand) of unit tokens.


Yeah, there's nothing in the rules that suggests that you get to treat an eliminated active race as if you had "declined" it and skip the "going into decline" turn to grab your next race. You have two and only two choices each turn after the first: take a conquest turn with your current active race or put your current active race into decline.
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Pokey 64
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Niagara Falls
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Golux13 wrote:
jtflynn wrote:
I'm looking confirmation of my understanding for 2 related situations.

Situation #1 - Active race eliminated from board but some tokens in hand.
Resolution Option #1: Tokens for active race remain in hand until start of player's next turn, at which point they choose to retain them as active, bringing tokens from hand onto the board as if they were a new race.
Resolution Option #2: Tokens for active race remain in hand until start of player's next turn, at which point they choose to put active race into decline. Active race and special power boards are flipped, tokens are returned to tray and tokens/board for prior in-decline race are removed from play. Player will score 0 for this turn.


Correct in both situations. If you have tokens in hand - presumably because you removed them during the conquest(s) that took you off the board - you may re-enter the board on your next turn; or you may decline that race, following the steps you outline in #2.

Quote:
Situation #2 - Active race is destroyed (completely eliminated from the game with no tokens in hand). On player's next turn, player again has two options: put active race into decline OR retain destroyed race as active...
Resolution Option #1: Player chooses to retain destroyed race as active, retaining existing in-decline race but scoring nothing for eliminated race. (This option would only make sense to choose in last round of the game in cases where in-decline race was scoring a decent number of points and/or no time was available to introduce new active race.)
Resolution Option #2: Player puts destroyed active race into decline by flipping active race board to in-decline and removing board&tokens for prior in-decline race. Player scores 0 for this turn and will select new race on next turn.


Correct again.

Quote:
The debate in a game played this past weekend was whether a destroyed active race would have its board removed from play, thereby retaining current in-decline race and picking up new race at start of next turn, effectively skipping the "going into decline" turn. As interpreted by the scenarios/options above, the existence and status (active or in-decline) of a race is assigned by the boards, regardless of the presence or location (on-board or in-hand) of unit tokens.


Yeah, there's nothing in the rules that suggests that you get to treat an eliminated active race as if you had "declined" it and skip the "going into decline" turn to grab your next race. You have two and only two choices each turn after the first: take a conquest turn with your current active race or put your current active race into decline.


Situation #2 is only partly correct.

If you lose all tokens of your active race your only option is to go into decline with it on your next turn. If you have an additional in decline race on the board, it will disappear and score zero points.

Resolution option #1 for situation #2 cannot exist. Small World has no rule that allows a player to "pass" their turn.

Resolution #2 for situation #2 is correct. It would be a terrible thing to happen but it is proper procedure by the rulebook.
 
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Dan Schaeffer
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panzer6 wrote:
Situation #2 is only partly correct.

If you lose all tokens of your active race your only option is to go into decline with it on your next turn. If you have an additional in decline race on the board, it will disappear and score zero points.


I started to ask where in the rule book this came from, but then I realized who posted it.

There is nothing in the rules that would require you to put your active race in decline, even if you have no tokens on the board and none in hand. I don't think there are any circumstances where not doing so would be a game-wining move, but it's certainly legal not to.
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Ragnar Iceblood
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Golux13 wrote:
panzer6 wrote:
Situation #2 is only partly correct.

If you lose all tokens of your active race your only option is to go into decline with it on your next turn. If you have an additional in decline race on the board, it will disappear and score zero points.


I started to ask where in the rule book this came from, but then I realized who posted it.

There is nothing in the rules that would require you to put your active race in decline, even if you have no tokens on the board and none in hand. I don't think there are any circumstances where not doing so would be a game-wining move, but it's certainly legal not to.


You are correct, you are allowed to "pass" your turn , e.g. do nothing, as DOW has officially decleared.
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Bryan Stout
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panzer6 wrote:
Situation #2 is only partly correct.

If you lose all tokens of your active race your only option is to go into decline with it on your next turn. If you have an additional in decline race on the board, it will disappear and score zero points.

Resolution option #1 for situation #2 cannot exist. Small World has no rule that allows a player to "pass" their turn.

Resolution #2 for situation #2 is correct. It would be a terrible thing to happen but it is proper procedure by the rulebook.

Though Pokey is very firm about this interpretation, no one that I know of agrees with him. The official FAQ says,

Quote:
All active units destroyed
If all your active units are destroyed in one turn you may:
1) Score points only with the in-decline race.
or 2) Go into decline and score 0 for that turn.
You may not take a new combo this turn.

This has been an old, long and frustrating argument, which no one wants to repeat. If you want to see it, look at this thread: Conquest is never mandatory.

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