clarence
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Hi guys, for those who don't mind playing a longer session of BSG.
I think it is possible to include the New caprica option on distance 6.
There may be balancing issue to be fix like increasing the starting population.
 
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Ossian Grr aka "Josh"
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If you really wanted to combine New Caprica and the Ionian Nebula, you're right, it would be a VERY LONG game. You could just say that the 'last jump' of New Caprica (the one the Admiral declares) leads directly to the Crossroads phase (if the humans survive it).
But I think that in order to balance it, you would also have to create some Ally characters that are placed in New Cap locations; otherwise you go a very long time without being able to affect your Trauma.
 
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Ossian Grr aka "Josh"
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Location: Resistance HQ
Benevolent: Destroy all Occupation Forces.
Antagonistic: Execute all characters.


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Roberta Yang
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Have you fully considered all of the ramifications of making New Caprica happen before the end of the game? If the humans need to survive after it, their play there becomes very different, switching from trying to save enough civvies to trying to save as many civvies as possible. This could be good if you see the current state as dull and anti-thematic or bad if you see the new version as being too difficult for the humans, but at any rate, it will be very different, and you need to consider that when making variants.

Another issue: Allies don't show up on New Caprica, so it's difficult to dispose of Trauma while there, and if it comes just before Crossroads, there won't be any time to dispose of them afterward. Meanwhile, it's much easier to be sent to Detention there than to Galactica's Brig, so more Trauma will probably be distributed there than at any other point in the game. There two factors together make it easy for a player to acquire too much bad trauma there and get screwed, so you may force players to deliberately let themselves be executed when Galactica jumps away in order to avoid being ejected from the game.
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Matt Steski
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I was wondering how to do this, because I do love New Caprica... Maybe you could have the Crossroads phase occur before New Caprica? Like maybe right at 7 distance, before placing characters at Resistance HQ.

It wouldn't be much longer for the eliminated players to sit out, instead of a jump cycle, it'd be a jump cycle and maybe a few more turns after that.
 
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David F
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If you really want to combine them, play a game with NC, then play a game with IN. The point of the game series is to provide a narrative to Kobol, then a narrative to New Caprica, then a narrative to Ionian Nebula, and finally a narrative to Earth (I'm sure there'll be another expansion next year). You can jump in to play any part you like the most.
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Roberta Yang
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In my opinion, if you must combine them, the best way to combine them might just be to have them occur simultaneously: when you arrive at New Caprica, draw and resolve the Crossroads cards, then see who gets booted out of the game, and then just play New Caprica as normal from there (with no Allies present when Galactica returns). The actual Ionian Nebula beyond the opening Crossroads step is pretty generic, just being a space battle with the same Cylon fleet that shows up at New Caprica anyway, so they shouldn't get in each others' way too much, and New Caprica would still be the last step of the game. Changes will still occur, but they seem less drastic and damaging than having New Caprica and Crossroads occur separately would be.
 
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Ossian Grr aka "Josh"
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salty53 wrote:
In my opinion, if you must combine them, the best way to combine them might just be to have them occur simultaneously: when you arrive at New Caprica, draw and resolve the Crossroads cards, then see who gets booted out of the game, and then just play New Caprica as normal from there (with no Allies present when Galactica returns).


If you do this, you might at least want to push New Cap back up to distance 8.. otherwise you're making the Crossroads Phase a lot harder.
Also, if players get Eliminated at the Trial/Boxing phase, and then New Cap happens, it will be annoying for the Eliminated players and harder for the non-Eliminated players.
 
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Roberta Yang
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jozxyqk wrote:
If you do this, you might at least want to push New Cap back up to distance 8.. otherwise you're making the Crossroads Phase a lot harder.

How so? They have almost as much time as ever to spend their Trauma, and even though they have less time to lose Trauma, they also have less time to gain Trauma. In fact, New Caprica's heavy emphasis on preserving non-civilian Population will strongly discourage FTL Control jumps (particularly at -3) and thus make it take even longer to get to the 7 distance New Caprica Crossroads than to a regular 8 distance Crossroads.

Also, adding an extra point of distance definitely makes the game harder on the humans. Now you're asking them to go through the regular New Caprica stuff AND manage more things as well. Adding an extra point of distance will make things harder, not easier.

jozxyqk wrote:
Also, if players get Eliminated at the Trial/Boxing phase, and then New Cap happens, it will be annoying for the Eliminated players and harder for the non-Eliminated players.

That's true of the regular Ionian Nebula finale.
 
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Ossian Grr aka "Josh"
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Sorry, you're probably right, Roberta.
I don't have a whole lot of experience with New Caprica, but it did seem to me like that phase was a whole lot longer than the Ionian Nebula phase.

I also don't think it's a great idea to combine the endings without some major modifications, although I don't recommend using my joke Duck ally
 
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Roberta Yang
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The number of remaining turns is certainly longer, since humans need to fill a jump track and then evacuate, whereas in the Ionian Nebula they ideally just need to get to Blue-3 and jump, or at the very worst need fill no more than one jump track. The turns may go faster with New Caprica, though, since on New Caprica each side has basically only one Action worth taking, whereas players in the Ionian Nebula have as many options as ever.

Just having the two occur simultaneously is far from a perfect solution; there are a lot of obvious problems with it. Adding New Caprica to the equation shifts the overall early-game strategy from "Protect the civvies, jump at -3" to "Screw the civvies, never use FTL Control", which alters the power dynamics hugely. With Population so tight, several Allies' will probably be seen as very different; for example, Friendly Zarek is really useful in a regular Ionian Nebula game, but often detrimental to the humans in one with New Caprica (though being able to buy a Morale helps). And then there's the Crossroads cards themselves. Sure, there are obvious minor things like the destroyed civvie in Miraculous Return's antagonistic effect no longer being bad for the humans or its Morale effects being amplified, but there are more major ramifications too. For example, when Miraculous Return's benevolent effect makes raiders activate twice, they will, depending on how you rule it, fire on Galactica sixteen times instead of moving after the now-on-New-Caprica civilians. And then there's the option of executing the Admiral. In the Ionian Nebula, the endgame Admiral is less powerful than the Admiral at any other time, as no more Destinations remain to be drawn, but in New Caprica, the endgame procedure makes the Admiral the most powerful figure, so knowing their loyalty becomes crucial. (Of course, that -1 Morale cost might hurt more...)

Still, this seems to me to be a better fix than having the two occur consecutively, even though the best solution is probably to just not combine the two in the first place.
 
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G Haase
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Here's my thought:

Distance 4: Sleeper Step
(As normal)

Distance 7: New Caprica
(When you the destination card that brings the fleet to 7 distance is played, set it aside and begin the New Caprica Phase. Place half the remaining civilian ships, rounding up, on the New Caprica board, but play the phase as normal otherwise. When the fleet jumps away from New Caprica, resolve the effects of the set aside Destination card. Colonial 1 is again accessible after the jump.)

Distance 9: Crossroads
(As normal)

This keeps everything from happening at once, keeps New Cap from jumping straight into Crossroads (unless the Admiral draws a 3 destination at distance 6), and makes New Cap challenging but without wrecking the human's chances if they don't save everyone.
 
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Roberta Yang
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rowanalpha wrote:
Here's my thought:

Distance 4: Sleeper Step
(As normal)

Distance 7: New Caprica
(When you the destination card that brings the fleet to 7 distance is played, set it aside and begin the New Caprica Phase. Place half the remaining civilian ships, rounding up, on the New Caprica board, but play the phase as normal otherwise. When the fleet jumps away from New Caprica, resolve the effects of the set aside Destination card. Colonial 1 is again accessible after the jump.)

Distance 9: Crossroads
(As normal)

This keeps everything from happening at once, keeps New Cap from jumping straight into Crossroads (unless the Admiral draws a 3 destination at distance 6), and makes New Cap challenging but without wrecking the human's chances if they don't save everyone.

With nine distance total plus both special endgame phases separately, the odds seem to be stacked strongly against humanity; they're going to need some sort of extra compensation.
 
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G Haase
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They probably would need a +1 or +2 to starting resources. Testing would tell.
 
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Nicholas Bazzano
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Has anyone given thought to using NC with exodus as it occurred in season 3? That is start with everyone already in NC (including Pegasus if you have/want to, instead of at a certain jump point), and then play through a least to the crossroads (if not the Battle itself).
 
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Gurps Melendor
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Distance 3: New Caprica.

After de New Carpica jump: Sleeper Agent.

Distance 7: Crossroads.

 
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Roberta Yang
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What I said earlier about having New Caprica be anytime before the end of the game still applies (i.e. the humans' goal and playstyle is dramatically changed), and having it occur pre-Sleeper before most Cylons reveal and probably before some even exist seems like it would reduce the tension dramatically and make the phase even more bland than it already is.
 
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