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Subject: 18Xpress? rss

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Tim Harrison
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BrenoK wrote:
So, what's the similarity between this and 18Xpress? Same game?


No, they are different games, and there is only a slight similarity. 18Xpress does not use hex tiles.

18xx Origins, on the other hand, is a normal 18xx game that focuses on the core elements of the game system and eliminates needless complexities. It most closely resembles 1889.
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Tim Harrison
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BrenoK wrote:
GamesOnTheBrain wrote:
BrenoK wrote:
So, what's the similarity between this and 18Xpress? Same game?


No, they are different games, and there is only a slight similarity. 18Xpress does not use hex tiles.

18xx Origins, on the other hand, is a normal 18xx game that focuses on the core elements of the game system and eliminates needless complexities. It most closely resembles 1889.


"Needless" is a bit much, no?


Needless, as in not needed to retain the characteristics of a classic 18xx game -- things like mergers, different gauges of track, receivership, or unusual rules about running -- all of which are fine in their own right, but make the system less accessible to new players.
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Burster of Bubbles, Destroyer of Dreams.
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GamesOnTheBrain wrote:
18xx Origins is a normal 18xx game that focuses on the core elements of the game system and eliminates needless complexities. It most closely resembles 1889.


Let's see -- if I had that as a design goal, I would:

Make all stock prices multiples of 5, or even 10. Eliminate the yellow part of the stock market.

Eliminate dits, O-O tiles, and special cities.

Make all terrain tiles cost the exact same amount.

Strip down the private powers, possibly making them all just cost+income.

Not have any shares pay into the company.

Have companies start up in obvious collaborative pairs, perhaps.

Have quick fast tile upgrades, possibly even yellow direct to brown.

Strip out some of the train types. 2,3,4,6 should suffice to let people watch trains rust. Allow brown track on the 4T.

How close am I, I wonder?
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Tim Harrison
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Morganza wrote:
GamesOnTheBrain wrote:
18xx Origins is a normal 18xx game that focuses on the core elements of the game system and eliminates needless complexities. It most closely resembles 1889.


Let's see -- if I had that as a design goal, I would:

Make all stock prices multiples of 5, or even 10. Eliminate the yellow part of the stock market.

Eliminate dits, O-O tiles, and special cities.

Make all terrain tiles cost the exact same amount.

Strip down the private powers, possibly making them all just cost+income.

Not have any shares pay into the company.

Have companies start up in obvious collaborative pairs, perhaps.

Have quick fast tile upgrades, possibly even yellow direct to brown.

Strip out some of the train types. 2,3,4,6 should suffice to let people watch trains rust. Allow brown track on the 4T.

How close am I, I wonder?

Not very close, to be honest. The only two that I'm doing from your list is:

1) Make all stock prices multiples of 5, or even 10.

2) Eliminate double-dits and O-O tiles. I'm keeping single dits and using 2 special cities.

Quote:
Well, goes to show that I don't think it can get much simpler than 1889 without me losing interest in the game.

18xx Origins is meant to be a teaching game, not an easy game. There will still be tough choices -- presented primarily by the tight map and challenging tile-manifest. To be honest, it might actually be a little sharper than 1889. Ideally, one will be able to comfortably transition to 1830 without a whole lot more to learn.
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Chakroun Karim
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GamesOnTheBrain wrote:
Morganza wrote:
GamesOnTheBrain wrote:
18xx Origins is a normal 18xx game that focuses on the core elements of the game system and eliminates needless complexities. It most closely resembles 1889.


Let's see -- if I had that as a design goal, I would:

Make all stock prices multiples of 5, or even 10. Eliminate the yellow part of the stock market.

Eliminate dits, O-O tiles, and special cities.

Make all terrain tiles cost the exact same amount.

Strip down the private powers, possibly making them all just cost+income.

Not have any shares pay into the company.

Have companies start up in obvious collaborative pairs, perhaps.

Have quick fast tile upgrades, possibly even yellow direct to brown.

Strip out some of the train types. 2,3,4,6 should suffice to let people watch trains rust. Allow brown track on the 4T.

How close am I, I wonder?

Not very close, to be honest. The only two that I'm doing from your list is:

1) Make all stock prices multiples of 5, or even 10.

2) Eliminate double-dits and O-O tiles. I'm keeping single dits and using 2 special cities.

Quote:
Well, goes to show that I don't think it can get much simpler than 1889 without me losing interest in the game.

18xx Origins is meant to be a teaching game, not an easy game. There will still be tough choices -- presented primarily by the tight map and challenging tile-manifest. To be honest, it might actually be a little sharper than 1889. Ideally, one will be able to comfortably transition to 1830 without a whole lot more to learn.


Any new 18XX that is inspired by 1889 is welcome in my home. We're awfully slow players.
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Gunther Schmidl
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Morganza wrote:

How close am I, I wonder?


You forgot "multiple tile lays a turn" à la 1829.
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Tim Harrison
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gschmidl wrote:
Morganza wrote:

How close am I, I wonder?


You forgot "multiple tile lays a turn" à la 1829.


Nope, not that either.
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Kevin Maroney
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I was wondering what need this fills that isn't already met by 18EZ. This isn't to say that every 18xx games needs to be flamingly different from all others. However, 18EZ does a pretty good job of being a "full" 18xx game with the complications/chrome kept to a digestable level (plus program learning).
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Zé Mário
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womzilla wrote:
I was wondering what need this fills that isn't already met by 18EZ. This isn't to say that every 18xx games needs to be flamingly different from all others. However, 18EZ does a pretty good job of being a "full" 18xx game with the complications/chrome kept to a digestable level (plus program learning).

From what I hear, 18EZ fails at being an interesting 18XX (or game). Knowing GotB's last effort, I'm fairly confident this one will.
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Tim Harrison
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womzilla wrote:
I was wondering what need this fills that isn't already met by 18EZ. This isn't to say that every 18xx games needs to be flamingly different from all others. However, 18EZ does a pretty good job of being a "full" 18xx game with the complications/chrome kept to a digestable level (plus program learning).


18EZ is almost universally frowned upon as a bad teaching game by 18xx veterans:

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/forum/106312/18ez/reviews

Hence it's 6.44 rating.
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Dave Mitton
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Actually, I liked 18EZ when I played it once.
However it is OOP from the publisher.

When/where can I see more about 18Origins and 18xpress?
The later's BBG page is devoid of information.
Origins I'll start to look harder for...

Dave.
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