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Subject: Something strange about A25.233 Defensive First Fire in Human Wave rss

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Miikka Sohlman
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Rules wrote:
25.233 DEFENSIVE FIRST FIRE: Minefield/OBA/Residual FP attacks in the Location that is being left are resolved immediately as each HW Unit moves, while such attacks in the Location being entered are resolved after all HW Units have finished moving that Impulse. The DEFENDER can then First Fire on any Location(s) presently occupied by HW Units before the Impulse ends.


Eh? What? Units that are exiting a location with Residual in it, gets attacked by that residual?

Why?
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Wulf Corbett
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I suppose the rationale is that, in a Human Wave, the men aren't dodging fire, taking cover, or even moving cautiously. They all stand up and just run...

Since they do so in the hex they're in at the start, residual fire, etc. will affect them. The moral of the story is, don't start a Human Wave in a hex with residual fire, etc. - you will know it's there before you make the decision, after all.
 
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Miikka Sohlman
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Ok but what about in the middle of the HW. In Impulse 4 (example) a squad walks into some residual and takes a hit. Then in Impulse 5, when it leaves that hex, it again takes a hit from that same residual?

And fire lane residual can also attack twice if that's true. That can't be true can it?
 
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Wulf Corbett
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Human Waves die a lot...
 
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Michail Potemkin
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You need to update your rulebook. Unfortunately the update pages you need are in Armies of Oblivion. HW rules are the exact reason why I bought my copy of AoO.
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Eddy del Rio
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The answer Miikka is that you're looking at an obsolete rule. The Human Wave Rules underwent some evolution, and the rule you are quoting is not in ASLRB2

Edit: Michail beat me to the puncharrrh
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Michail Potemkin
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Gotcha! ;-) Initiative DR 1,1
 
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Miikka Sohlman
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Thanks.

Yes, I need to update. Now, let's wait 5 years until OoB is reprinted again.

-_-
 
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Miikka Sohlman
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Is there a list somewhere of the stuff that's changed?
 
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Robin Reeve
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Hipsu wrote:
Is there a list somewhere of the stuff that's changed?
Here : http://www.multimanpublishing.com/Support/ASLASLSK/tabid/64/...
 
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Robin Reeve
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Hipsu wrote:
Now, let's wait 5 years until OoB is reprinted again.
I presume that you are speaking of AoO ?
There is an auction on eBay (presently at 110$).

Do you know how much ASL players have had to wait for AoO to come out the first time ? whistle
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Miikka Sohlman
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Robin wrote:


That only says that there are replacement pages in AoO. Not much help. I was looking for a list of changes to HW.

Robin wrote:
I presume that you are speaking of AoO ?

Yes.
 
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Robin Reeve
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Binko wrote:
It is totally unacceptable, in my opinion, that MMP does not make revised rules and updated Rulebook pages available to all ASL players.

A guy spends hundreds of dollars on ASL products and he literally has no access to the most current rules unless he goes to ebay and spends big money on OOP modules?

That's wrong.
I agree with you that those pages should be available as all the other errata are, without having to purchase AoO.

Now, during 20 years, players managed to play ASL without those corrections - and many do still play with ASLRB v1.
So the issue is minor (in my opinion - sorry if I seem offending by expressing things that way).

To answer the OP's question, a unit can be attacked by RF while exiting a Location if its situation in the Location makes it more vulnerable.
Typically, exiting a Foxhole would generate such attack.

The replacement pages mostly adressed the "Impulse movement teleportation" problem : a sleaze that I never applied myself.

I am asking if there is a ressource on CSW.
 
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Robin Reeve
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The revision was about Impulse Movement, which covers HW and Platoon movement - so you find the changed pages in chapters A and D.
There was a sleaze before, where you could move one (or two) of the tanks out of LOS before they could not be shot at.
I never used that sleaze before (and after) I read about it on GS.
The rules cleaned up the fact that DFF is made after each single MF/MP expense.

I agree that platoon movement can be a nice tactic - including use with radio equiped tanks.
 
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Martí Cabré

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Robin wrote:
The revision was about Impulse Movement, which covers HW and Platoon movement - so you find the changed pages in chapters A and D.
There was a sleaze before, where you could move one (or two) of the tanks out of LOS before they could not be shot at.
I never used that sleaze before (and after) I read about it on GS.
The rules cleaned up the fact that DFF is made after each single MF/MP expense.

I agree that platoon movement can be a nice tactic - including use with radio equiped tanks.


Could you elaborate on those tactics?

Also, is Column/Convoy movement any good or it's just used as SSR to create ambush scenarios?
 
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Robin Reeve
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marticabre wrote:
Could you elaborate on those tactics?
The clarification of the rules made them obsolete.
As I never used the "teleportation sleaze" and the debate took place about 5 years ago, I don't have a clear rememberance of it...

marticabre wrote:
Also, is Column/Convoy movement any good or it's just used as SSR to create ambush scenarios?
Convoys and columns were not the fastest way to progress ("The caravan moves at the speed of the slowest camel").
In ASL, columns and convoys are quite rare - and do fit to ambush situations (the scenario "Ambush!" has infantry advancing in column).

The only slight advantage of column move is that a single leader can give its 2 MF bonus to all units in the column : nice along a road, with no hills or obstacles to cross...
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Robin Reeve
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Robin wrote:
I am asking if there is a ressource on CSW.


Here is the answer that Perry Cocke gave to my question :

Q : Can one purchase the replacement pages provided in AoO separately?

A : It is not something we stock, and I doubt if we have any floating around the office, but give them a call or drop them a line and they will let you know.
 
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Robin Reeve
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I suggested that MMP put the pages for online d/l.

Perry Cocke answered that "the request is under consideration".
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