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Subject: Scenario 2 Objective confusion [COREY REPLY INSIDE] rss

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Benjamin Schoenheiter
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If the objective is to
Spoiler (click to reveal)
summon a cthonian and have him survive 4 rounds

and there are 2 turns left till event card 5 AND
Spoiler (click to reveal)
the investigators have found clue 1 stating they will win at the reveal of event 5
does that mean the keeper looses? From the flavor text it would not make sense, but then again the text on the objective is a bit odd.
 
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Michael Kefauver
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Re: Question concerning Scenario 2
If those clues are the right ones (don't have them in front of me) then yes. They delayed the ritual enough that it falls apart and the event in the spoiler box doesn't have time to come to fruition.
 
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Benjamin Schoenheiter
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Re: Question concerning Scenario 2
But it was fulfilled? If the condition is a REAL "or" then it would just account for a different subset of events. Know what I'm getting at?
 
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Ian Gill
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Re: Question concerning Scenario 2
I was confused by this very situation and I would normally assume the Keeper cant win (but can still play to stop an investigator win.

However, We play all three varaints so the variable ending makes his win still technically possible (but also give the investigators more time).

I'd love to have an official answer on this!!!
 
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Benjamin Schoenheiter
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Re: Question concerning Scenario 2
Posco wrote:
I was confused by this very situation and I would normally assume the Keeper cant win (but can still play to stop an investigator win.

However, We play all three varaints so the variable ending makes his win still technically possible (but also give the investigators more time).

I'd love to have an official answer on this!!!



We are mid play now and the cthonian is in round 2. But there is only 1 round left on the event. This is really infurating for us as the investigators have found the final clue.
 
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Benjamin Schoenheiter
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Re: Question concerning Scenario 2
benji_online wrote:
Posco wrote:
I was confused by this very situation and I would normally assume the Keeper cant win (but can still play to stop an investigator win.

However, We play all three varaints so the variable ending makes his win still technically possible (but also give the investigators more time).

I'd love to have an official answer on this!!!



We are mid play now and the cthonian is in round 2. But there is only 1 round left on the event. This is really infurating for us as the investigators have found the final clue.


We just now played it as such that when i summoned the Cthonian, Event 5 is just not happening. It felt wrong to do it any other way, since both the flavor text on the event, as well as the Objective seem to go with that. Logic however, following the way the rules usually are, does not. How did you play that? Or did you manage to summon the Cthonian with enough time left, that it wasn't an issue?
 
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Scott Arnone
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Re: Question concerning Scenario 2
I think this one is a bit tougher for the Keeper if you have fewer Investigators. If you're facing 4 Investigators, you won't have too difficult a time of summoning it fairly early. If you're facing 1 or 2 however, I'd recommend either not playing with that objective, or simply accepting that you're going to have to play for the stalemate and just try and keep the investigator from getting the clue.

Remember, the Keeper gets to choose the objective, so you don't have to choose that one in a situation where it severely handicaps you.

Though, I suppose you could simply say 1 cultist, +1 cultist for each Investigator has to be in the Chapel. But I'm not sure a single Investigator would stand much chance against a Chtonian + 2 Cultists. So then it might be tipped in the other direction.

As for the flavor not making sense, I think it does--the ritual is ongoing for those 4 turns. If the 5th event card comes up, then it essentially fizzles and the Cthonian is sucked back through to the other side.

Either way, I don't think there's anything wrong with certain Objectives not working with low amounts of investigators.
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Benjamin Schoenheiter
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Re: Question concerning Scenario 2
I'm still not quite convinced quite frankly. It would still very much make sense in game terms to have started a 4 turn win countdown once the chthonian is summoned. It still is pretty hard to have 4 frail cultists gather in the chapel. They still have to move there. And if you want to offer any resistance you should at least sacrifice 2 for a hound of tindalos. It makes sense too that the keeper autofails after the fifth event if he couldn't summon the chthonian. My take is that it makes total sense that the four turn countdown can be fulfilled even though the turn time wouldn't allow it - my take is that "too late" is true when you the keeper couldn't summon it in time. If he could - four turns it is. Also, the fith event has no meaning whatsoever for every other objective in that scenario. So why not suspend it after the cthonian has been summoned?
 
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Benjamin Schoenheiter
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Re: Question concerning Scenario 2
I just spent the last hour obsessing over this fact, and it indeed seems that the conditional on Event 5 is only applicable to Story 1B and not 1A or C. So the game only autoends after Event 5 if the cthonian has not been summoned AND the Investigators have not found the last clue. For every other purpose Event 5 has no meaning and the game does not end after event 5.

Quote:
As for the flavor not making sense, I think it does--the ritual is ongoing for those 4 turns. If the 5th event card comes up, then it essentially fizzles and the Cthonian is sucked back through to the other side.


Or how do you explain that there is no ritual in 1A or C?

Edit: I posted this a rules question. I'll post back when I get the answers.

EDIT 2:


This event card applies to ALL stories. Therefore, if players have found clue 1A or 1C when this card is revealed, they LOSE THE GAME.

Once the Cthonian has been summoned, there are 4 possible outcomes:
- The Cthonian is killed – Investigators win
- The Last Event Card is drawn – Investigators win
- The Cthonian survives for 4 turns before the last Event card is drawn – Keeper Wins
- All investigators are killed during the finale – Keeper wins (as per rulebook).

I hope this answers your question!

-Corey Konieczka
VP of R&D
Fantasy Flight Games
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Brian Schoner
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benji_online wrote:
Once the Cthonian has been summoned, there are 4 possible outcomes:
- The Cthonian is killed – Investigators win
- The Last Event Card is drawn – Investigators win
- The Cthonian survives for 4 turns before the last Event card is drawn – Keeper Wins
- All investigators are killed during the finale – Keeper wins (as per rulebook).

Regarding the bolded item - I just played that scenario, and as written, the Investigators only win when the last event card is drawn if they have found Clue 1B. So there is actually a fifth scenario:

- The last event card is drawn and the Investigators have not found Clue 1B - all players lose.
 
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