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Circus Maximus» Forums » Rules

Subject: Damaged wheel and corner straining rss

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M Garcia
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Hello,

if a chariot with a damaged wheel (i.e. 4 points of damage) starts moving on the stretch with a speed over 14, and then goes into a corner over the safe speed limit, how many dice rolls does the player need to do to check for flip?

a) One for FLIP DUE TO WHEEL DAMAGE because his speed is over 14 and another one for FLIP DUE TO CORNER STRAIN once he is in the corner (2 checks in total).

b) One for FLIP DUE TO WHEEL DAMAGE because his speed is over 14 and once he is in the corner, one for FLIP DUE TO CORNER STRAIN and another one for FLIP DUE TO WHEEL DAMAGE for straining in a corner with a damaged wheel (3 checks in total).

Thank you.

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a - two checks.
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Steve Bachman
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Without a close examination of the rules, I'd go with (b). The first wheel damage check is for speed, the second is for strain. The risk to the wheel for these two things is different.
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M Garcia
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Another opinion to break the tie?
 
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Carles Ryhr
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Ward wrote:
Without a close examination of the rules, I'd go with (b). The first wheel damage check is for speed, the second is for strain. The risk to the wheel for these two things is different.


But when you start your turn you check already for speed, only when you go into the curve you check for strain, it is not necessary to check again for speed.
 
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Steve Bachman
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turlusiflu wrote:
Ward wrote:
Without a close examination of the rules, I'd go with (b). The first wheel damage check is for speed, the second is for strain. The risk to the wheel for these two things is different.


But when you start your turn you check already for speed, only when you go into the curve you check for strain, it is not necessary to check again for speed.

You are not checking again for speed on the damaged wheel, you are checking for strain on the damaged wheel.

I guess I'll have to take a closer look at the verbiage in the rules to see what it actually states.
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turlusiflu wrote:

But when you start your turn you check already for speed, only when you go into the curve you check for strain, it is not necessary to check again for speed.


Agreed
 
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Steve Bachman
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kjamma4 wrote:
turlusiflu wrote:

But when you start your turn you check already for speed, only when you go into the curve you check for strain, it is not necessary to check again for speed.


Agreed

The rules seem clear enough on this:

2nd Edition rules wrote:
7.1 A chariot is in danger of flipping whenever it strains in a corner, or whenever it has a damaged wheel. Each is a separate procedure, and a chariot with a damaged wheel straining through a corner would have to check twice in a movement phase, once for each cause.

Here it states that a check is made both for straining in a corner and for straining through a corner with a damaged wheel. Speed matters not here.

2nd Edition rules wrote:
7.41 Any chariot with a wheel already damaged from previous attacks must check for flip (due to losing the wheel) at the start of any movement phase in which it will use "14" or more MFs, and/or the chariot is straining in a corner lane. If a chariot strains in a corner lane at a speed of "14" or more it must check for flip twice - once for each cause.

Here it states that a check is made both for excess speed with a damaged wheel and for straining through a corner with a damaged wheel.

If you argue that only two checks are needed, you are ignoring the last sentence of 7.1 which states that regardless of speed, a second check is made for straining with a damaged wheel. Each rule states that checks are made for each cause. The example given has three causes to check for:

1 Excess speed with a damaged wheel (per 7.41, it matters not whether in a corner or straightaway)

2 Corner straining (per 7.1, it matters not whether you have a damaged wheel or whether you began the turn in the corner)

3 Corner straining with a damaged wheel (per 7.1, it matters not what speed is used and per 7.41, it matters not if a check due to excess speed was already done)

I don't see where the rules allow you to ignore any one of those three causes.
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THREE ROLLS


I need to read the question and see what is being asked rather than just looking at the title of the thread and answering what I think you want.

If a wheel is damaged, you roll once immediately if you use 14 or more MFs. This is a 2d6 roll against the amount of damage the wheel has sustained.

If you exceed the safe maximum corner speed, you then make two rolls. One is the same 2d6 roll against the amount of damage the wheel has taken. One is a 3d6 roll on the Corner Strain Chart.

So yes, in total there are three rolls. Two wheel checks and one corner strain check.

Mea culpa.

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