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Yggdrasil» Forums » Rules

Subject: Looking at/in bags? rss

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Jimmy B
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I can't find any reference in the rules or FAQ concerning acceptable behavior concerning the island bags, and the people I've played with have a wide range of opinions. Clearly if we all had perfect memories (or a pad and pencil) we would know the exact content of every bag. But many games rely on the players' inability to keep track of many things at once to add additional strategy. In Yggdrasil, going from extreme to innocent, where is the line of "allowed" vs. "cheating"?

* Taking the tokens out of a bag and counting
* Opening a bag, and moving them around with a finger until you see all of them
* Opening a bag, and shaking it until you see all of them
* Opening a bag and seeing only what's visible on top
* Holding the white bag up and seeing the tokens through the material
* Feeling the tokens through the material to count them
* Feeling the tokens through the material to get a rough idea how many are in the bag
* Hefting the bag to guess how many are in the bag
* Relying solely on memory/talking to other players/deduction to figure out the bag contents

Does the answer change how a player removes a Viking when Hel is drawn? Can you open the bag and select a Viking, or do you need to blindly pull tokens until getting a Viking?
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Anne-Cécile Lefebvre
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Hi,

The designers of Yggdrasil thought that it is up to the players to come to an agreement about the use of the bags. It depends on the wish of using memory or not. Yggdrasil can be played either checking the bags contents each time you want to draw in or without looking into the bags.
Quote:
* Taking the tokens out of a bag and counting
* Opening a bag, and moving them around with a finger until you see all of them

This might be a very labored way to play.

Quote:
* Opening a bag, and shaking it until you see all of them
* Opening a bag and seeing only what's visible on top

That is the way the designers used to play.

Quote:
* Holding the white bag up and seeing the tokens through the material

Best open and look in the bag

Quote:
* Feeling the tokens through the material to count them
* Feeling the tokens through the material to get a rough idea how many are in the bag
* Hefting the bag to guess how many are in the bag

Rough estimate ; for my point of view, best either to open the bag and count or relying only on memory.

Quote:
* Relying solely on memory/talking to other players/deduction to figure out the bag contents

That is a challenging way to play

Regarding Hel's effect, the way to remove the vikings depends on the way you want to play...
However, it seems to me that open and directly select a Viking is more pleasant for the game.


A couple of things in Yggdrasil (checking the bags' contents and counting the Enemy cards) had been left by the designers to the players' assessment on purpose so that they can play with their own challenge level.

Anne-Cécile
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Jan
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We just use a rough estimate about how many tokens are in a bag, but we will never just take a bag to have a look at it. We only see the tokens when we use the bag itself by adding tokens or removing tokens.
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Rich Moore
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I DO look in the bag, but only when required by the game to do so (e.g. Hel's ability.) This means I rarely get to look in the black and green bag.
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Mike Norris
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rcmoore4 wrote:
I DO look in the bag, but only when required by the game to do so (e.g. Hel's ability.) This means I rarely get to look in the black and green bag.


Even with Hel, I usually just reach in and pull out until I get the right # of pieces, so I don't really look in the bags ever. If you are focusing on just a couple islands it shouldn't be too hard to manage.
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Rich Moore
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demondude777 wrote:
rcmoore4 wrote:
I DO look in the bag, but only when required by the game to do so (e.g. Hel's ability.) This means I rarely get to look in the black and green bag.


Even with Hel, I usually just reach in and pull out until I get the right # of pieces, so I don't really look in the bags ever. If you are focusing on just a couple islands it shouldn't be too hard to manage.


While I do look in the bag, I don't necessarily count tokens. It's long enough to find the tokens I need, though, and get a good feel for how much "orange" there is. If you want to avoid looking in the bags at all, though, your method seems to me the only practical way to do so.
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Fenrir Jarl
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I always think that if you can get knowledge about something from any source (counting tokens) you can just check it by yourself.
If you wouldn be allowed to check how many tokens are in the bag, you will start counting it by writing on paper every change t okeep track on it.
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