Recommend
 
 Thumb up
 Hide
7 Posts

Mansions of Madness» Forums » General

Subject: Number and Types of Cards in a Pile Public Knowledge? rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Thrift Thopter
United States
Massachusetts
flag msg tools
Avatar
mb
Are the number and/or types of cards in a pile public knowledge? The top card of each pile is obviously public knowledge, but does the keeper have to let the others know how many cards are beneath those cards, and whether they're obstacle or exploration cards?

If the investigators know an unprotected pile of exploration cards has multiple cards, they could suspect that pile might be better to investigate than other piles and otherwise plot a strategy based on what types of cards are where.

The keeper's guide says the keeper puts cards down, one at a time, in the order specified, but does this mean he has to do so visibly, or is this just a reminder not to mess up the order of the cards?

Thanks.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chris J Davis
United Kingdom
London
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Overtext pending moderation...
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Thrift Thopter wrote:
Are the number and/or types of cards in a pile public knowledge? The top card of each pile is obviously public knowledge, but does the keeper have to let the others know how many cards are beneath those cards, and whether they're obstacle or exploration cards?

If the investigators know an unprotected pile of exploration cards has multiple cards, they could suspect that pile might be better to investigate than other piles and otherwise plot a strategy based on what types of cards are where.

The keeper's guide says the keeper puts cards down, one at a time, in the order specified, but does this mean he has to do so visibly, or is this just a reminder not to mess up the order of the cards?

Thanks.


Knowing the number of cards in a pile does not help the investigators at all. Depending on the choices the Keeper makes, any one pile could either contain essential cards (i.e, clues) or simply "Nothing of Interest" cards.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ken Dilloo
United States
Bothell
Washington
flag msg tools
Everything is relative to perception, and your perception is limited.
badge
The Ginger Ninja
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Right, plus that takes out any flavor of the game. Would you know what kind of things are behind a locked door?
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Thrift Thopter
United States
Massachusetts
flag msg tools
Avatar
mb
I realize that there are "Nothing of Interest" cards that can distract investigators, that the knowledge of card quantity wouldn't be very much help, as the investigators are primarily following the clues, and that the knowledge of how many/what types of cards behind doors would be un-thematic.

Spoiler (click to reveal)
I meant that if the investigators knew there were two cards in a room, they'd know it wasn't a room that just had "1 random card" placed into it at the end of setup, as happens in most "stories." Maybe I'm just worrying too much about players who played as a keeper, and therefore know that random cards are placed in empty rooms in most stories. I may be overly concerned about two cards in a room with no door or hazard because in Story 1, one of the two places the first clue can be, is in such an unsecured room. I know the prologue's hint makes it obvious the first clue's there, but I'm worried about important items in the later stories as well. I've only read the 1st story, and don't want to know the others yet, so, I don't know how valid my concern is yet.


The main question I want answered is whether the number and/or types of cards is public knowledge. I feel the types at least shouldn't be, and bigloo33's post seems to indicate this, but I just want to make sure.

Spoiler (click to reveal)
It seems that no matter the keeper's choices for a story, there are always the same number of cards. in each room, as though the number of cards is public knowledge (though I suppose it could be because you can sort of see the number of cards in a stack from the side, if you aren't trying to not pay attention).


This looks like a good game, and I just want to make sure I play it correctly, when I try it the first time.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jonathan Hersey
United States
Peoria
Illinois
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
My vote is that No the number and types of cards are not public knowledge. Nowhere in the rules does it state this is the case, but more importantly I think if you think about the “spirit of the game” you must also conclude no. MoM is all about ambiance, the art, unknown information at the bases of each monster, the unknown outcome of casting spells, the various combat scenarios from the combat decks, the unknown objective at the start of the game, and the unknown card piles all create a strong thematic atmosphere of mystery, fear, tension, etc. Making the types and number of cards public knowledge would go against that atmosphere IMHO. Some like to use the variant where the cards aren’t even on the board but rather tokens are placed on the board that correspond to card piles off to the side further embedding the games' theme (personally I think this makes the game a bit too hard for the investigators)

With all that being said though, I think it comes down to you as the keeper and the group you are playing with. I am less rigid of a keeper as some and so there are games where I feel I have to give further clues to the investigators in order to give them a chance to win. I by no means feel the investigators have to win, but there are situations where they’re not going the right way and if they don’t act fast there won’t even be a chance. So I like to drop a hint here and there if necessary.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Thrift Thopter
United States
Massachusetts
flag msg tools
Avatar
mb
Thanks.

I didn't think it would make sense if the types of cards under the top card of a pile would be public knowledge, but I did want to make sure.

Spoiler (click to reveal)
I suppose the "Nothing of Interest" cards in piles with other exploration cards must be there to make the piles in a room look the same size, no matter the keeper's story choices, in case an investigator player accidentally notices the number of cards in a pile.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Kelly Overholser
United States
Minnesota
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I'm actually going to argue this point and say that there's not much point in not allowing it.

Remember, every single room in every scenario will have the same number of cards and the same "back" on each card no matter what the setup choices are. If a room has a lock and a clue for one option in a scenario, it will always have a lock on top and a single investigation card underneath. The card might be different; it could be a useful item, or nothing of interest, and the lock itself will be different, but without looking at the fronts, there's no way to tell (barring marked cards, of course). Since the rooms that have clues in one option but don't have clues in the current game will have the same number of cards, the investigators can tell what rooms might be important, but they won't be able to tell what rooms actually have clues without going there first.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.