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Space Hulk: Death Angel – The Card Game» Forums » Variants

Subject: difficulty levels rss

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TS S. Fulk
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I know this game gets a lot of love here on BGG, but it has not really clicked with us, and we love co-ops. The main problems are that there are limited choices, and the die roll seems to rule the day making the game brutally deadly.

Some people might like the challenge, but we just feel frustrated to the point that the fun is sucked out of the game. Other hard co-ops have initiation difficulty levels to make it easier to learn the subtilties of the game without getting too frustrated because it appears that you will never win the game.

So here are my proposals for easier difficulty levels.

Spinless Weakling:
Space Marines survive Genestealer attacks, if they roll the number of Genestealers or higher.
You can allows choice from all three action cards.
Support tokens can be used even when facing the wrong direction.
All players start with 1 support token.

Mamma's Boy:
Space Marines survive Genestealer attacks, if they roll the number of Genestealers or higher.
Support tokens can be used even when facing the wrong direction.

Rookie:
Support tokens can be used even when facing the wrong direction.

Harden Marine:
The original rules for the game.

Edited based on suggestions below.
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Mikkel Øberg
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tssfulk wrote:
So here are my proposals for easier difficulty levels.

I mostly play the game solo, but I share your experience that some people find it much to unforgiving, and they dislike the dice ruling all (which is one of the things I love, the same reason I like the Race for the Galaxy solitaire).

I like your suggestions, and could see myself using them to teach new players (even though I think it takes away some of the desperate battle for death which is Space Hulk.

However, I find it a bit strange that the normal level is not the normal game, but perhaps that's just arrogance?

I think the names Unworthy, Puny, and True Grit would be better names laugh
 
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TS S. Fulk
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Gregaria wrote:
tssfulk wrote:
So here are my proposals for easier difficulty levels.

I mostly play the game solo, but I share your experience that some people find it much to unforgiving, and they dislike the dice ruling all (which is one of the things I love, the same reason I like the Race for the Galaxy solitaire).

I like your suggestions, and could see myself using them to teach new players (even though I think it takes away some of the desperate battle for death which is Space Hulk.

However, I find it a bit strange that the normal level is not the normal game, but perhaps that's just arrogance?

I think the names Unworthy, Puny, and True Grit would be better names laugh


Your names sound better, I just wanted to get the rules out and did not give them a second thought.

Why are the "normal" rules "Nightmare"? Because I have yet to beat the game with those rules!
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Andrey
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tssfulk wrote:
Support tokens can be used even when facing the wrong direction.

While the difficulty itself could be easier, I don't think Death Angel needs to be stripped it of its (already scarce) meaningful decisions. Facing is among those things that I find interesting.
I suppose something like "every time you play support, you receive 2 tokens instead of one" could make the game more forgiving without dumbing it down.
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Chris D
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Random_Phobosis wrote:
tssfulk wrote:
Support tokens can be used even when facing the wrong direction.

While the difficulty itself could be easier, I don't think Death Angel needs to be stripped it of its (already scarce) meaningful decisions. Facing is among those things that I find interesting.
I suppose something like "every time you play support, you receive 2 tokens instead of one" could make the game more forgiving without dumbing it down.


Agreed. Ignoring the facing issues and the necessity to switch action cards would change the game too much.

The two support token instead of one and marines saved if they roll equal or higher the swarm number are better suggestions if you really want the game to be easier without overdoing it.
 
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TS S. Fulk
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No_Frets wrote:
Random_Phobosis wrote:
tssfulk wrote:
Support tokens can be used even when facing the wrong direction.

While the difficulty itself could be easier, I don't think Death Angel needs to be stripped it of its (already scarce) meaningful decisions. Facing is among those things that I find interesting.
I suppose something like "every time you play support, you receive 2 tokens instead of one" could make the game more forgiving without dumbing it down.


Agreed. Ignoring the facing issues and the necessity to switch action cards would change the game too much.

The two support token instead of one and marines saved if they roll equal or higher the swarm number are better suggestions if you really want the game to be easier without overdoing it.


Initiation needs to be easy. Just like it is in Ghost Stories.
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Dan Cepeda
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I do agree that facing is kind of integral, especially in the original Space Hulk, which is why I think it's okay that it carries on over here.

Quick question: have you (or anyone you played with) ever played the original Space Hulk? I feel my appreciation of the game has been increased big time because of seeing some of the tie-ins. (For instance: "OH NO! I MISCOUNTED THE DISTANCE TO THAT GENESTEALER, NOW I HAVE TO MOVE and SHOOT, AND IF I GO INTO OVERWATCH, I'LL DIE!!!" etc. --Edit: After reading this, I realize it's not really a direct tie-in, I'm thinking more the mentality in SH...)

However, there's always the fact that it's just a game, with an arbitrary set of rules written by a person who felt that they offered the perfect balance of game-play. (This is the faith I place in my rules writers...) I don't see why their arbitrary set of rules is any better than yours. (Assuming you've given some play-test and found them to be enjoyable for those you game with.)

I do like the rules you posted, but not in my games. whistle Then again, it's my experience that "initiation" tends to be (much like the original SH) "oh crap, I totally forgot about that rule" or "oh crap, I totally never saw that rule!" (When my old game group played SH, we'd open the book and almost EVERY time we'd spot a rule we'd either never seen before, or one that we'd misread every time.)

Thanks for letting me ramble,
~Daniel
 
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Jason Wallace
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Another thought on easing off the difficulty is to use a Void Lock for 2 fewer Marines (or more).

So, if you have 4 players and 8 Marines, use the 6 Marines Void Lock. It uses somewhat easier rooms (or fewer with some jumps) AND lowers the amount of Genestealers in the spawns.

Althogh you ideas do simplify things and will make them easier (and I like them for that), I like it full bore.... just trying to throw another possible approach for you to think about.

---

Oh! Thought of another one... start the game with each Marine having one Support Token already on them, a "free reroll card" so-to-speak .
 
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TS S. Fulk
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I played it once. I hate GW as a company, but I liked the game. I won't touch any of their other stuff.

iidhaegn wrote:
I do agree that facing is kind of integral, especially in the original Space Hulk, which is why I think it's okay that it carries on over here.

Quick question: have you (or anyone you played with) ever played the original Space Hulk? I feel my appreciation of the game has been increased big time because of seeing some of the tie-ins. (For instance: "OH NO! I MISCOUNTED THE DISTANCE TO THAT GENESTEALER, NOW I HAVE TO MOVE and SHOOT, AND IF I GO INTO OVERWATCH, I'LL DIE!!!" etc. --Edit: After reading this, I realize it's not really a direct tie-in, I'm thinking more the mentality in SH...)

However, there's always the fact that it's just a game, with an arbitrary set of rules written by a person who felt that they offered the perfect balance of game-play. (This is the faith I place in my rules writers...) I don't see why their arbitrary set of rules is any better than yours. (Assuming you've given some play-test and found them to be enjoyable for those you game with.)

I do like the rules you posted, but not in my games. whistle Then again, it's my experience that "initiation" tends to be (much like the original SH) "oh crap, I totally forgot about that rule" or "oh crap, I totally never saw that rule!" (When my old game group played SH, we'd open the book and almost EVERY time we'd spot a rule we'd either never seen before, or one that we'd misread every time.)

Thanks for letting me ramble,
~Daniel
 
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TS S. Fulk
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I've thought about the void lock as well as maybe skipping location 2 or 3. I'd have to see if all 2's and 3's had doors. Would shorten the game too (which would be a good thing in my opinion, the game tends to drag on).

Raven Bloodeyes wrote:
Another thought on easing off the difficulty is to use a Void Lock for 2 fewer Marines (or more).

So, if you have 4 players and 8 Marines, use the 6 Marines Void Lock. It uses somewhat easier rooms (or fewer with some jumps) AND lowers the amount of Genestealers in the spawns.

Althogh you ideas do simplify things and will make them easier (and I like them for that), I like it full bore.... just trying to throw another possible approach for you to think about.

---

Oh! Thought of another one... start the game with each Marine having one Support Token already on them, a "free reroll card" so-to-speak .
 
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TS S. Fulk
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iidhaegn wrote:
I do agree that facing is kind of integral, especially in the original Space Hulk, which is why I think it's okay that it carries on over here.


I agree that is critical, which is why attacks should only work with facing. However, I don't like the HIGH luck factor (I like luck, just not 1d6 luck). So allowing a re-roll on defense without the proper facing helps to lower the luck factor a bit for the easier levels.

Note: I've edited out having all three actions cards to choose from.
 
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Dave B.
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Maybe amend specific action cards to allow them to be used consecutively. e.g. Leon's Full Auto allows the red team to attack repeatedly (Gun Jam would have to be reworded to account for this), and yellow's increased mobility allows them to move/activate consecutively.

Personally, I think the difficulty is about right, though I wouldn't mind a less luck-based means of resolving combat. I've been thinking it over, but haven't come up with anything satisfying yet.
 
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Jason Wallace
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Cards for the dice to make the distribution more "normal" or controlled?

I made some you can use in the Files section.
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Richard Sampson
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Raven Bloodeyes wrote:
Cards for the dice to make the distribution more "normal" or controlled?

I made some you can use in the Files section.
FFG should definitely make some of these if they do more mini-expansions.
 
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Sparkle Motion
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Does anybody else think that the difficulty level varies wildly depending on the number of space marines you play with? I've been playing with 12 recently and I can't seem to lose, although I've had one or two close shaves.

Not really a viable option for making the game easier for beginners though, maximum spaces marines does mean there's a lot to think about.
 
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Stephen Sekela
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_Sparkle_ wrote:
Does anybody else think that the difficulty level varies wildly depending on the number of space marines you play with? I've been playing with 12 recently and I can't seem to lose, although I've had one or two close shaves.

Not really a viable option for making the game easier for beginners though, maximum spaces marines does mean there's a lot to think about.


I was going to start a new post on this subject a few weeks ago after we had a 6-player game and it turned out to be a real "walk in the park". However, as it was only one game, I didn't think I really had a good enough sampling. A subsequent 4 (or 5?) player game the following week was more "normal" - lost, but on the last location and very close to finishing.

Anyway, it seemed to me - besides the fact that you have more special abilities to chose from with more Space Marines - that the blip piles empty out waaaaaaay to quick, which makes the locations just fly by. We had at least two locations that we passed in just one round of play. But, like I said, I realize you can't judge anything after just one play.
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TS S. Fulk
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_Sparkle_ wrote:
Does anybody else think that the difficulty level varies wildly depending on the number of space marines you play with? I've been playing with 12 recently and I can't seem to lose, although I've had one or two close shaves.

Not really a viable option for making the game easier for beginners though, maximum spaces marines does mean there's a lot to think about.


Could be why my son and I are so frustrated. We've only played solo 3 marines and 2 player 8 marines. We've been close a couple of times.
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Sparkle Motion
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It would be interesting to try and get a ranking of the relative difficulty against number of space marines.
I think I've played all the numbers now, but apart from thinking 12 is the easiest, I'm not sure I have a clear picture what the graph looks like.
I suspect though that it's not just a straight line downwards, which is odd / interesting.

Definitely agree about the blip piles emptying too fast. With 12 I tend to find myself just barrelling through the levels, with one or two swarms which, though gigantic, don't have the time to do much damage because I'm in the last room before you know it.
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