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Subject: Need Help: Getting Cold Feet Over Game Order... rss

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Matt Sommer
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After spending so much time on BGG these past weeks, I've stepped up my orders for new games that I can hopefully try with my available group of friends.

See [geekurl=http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/669427/advice-needed-hosting-my-first-boardgaming-party-i]this[/geekurl] thread for my first/last attempt at a gaming event...

Just yesterday, I placed another order from Boards & Bits. Because of the July 4th holiday, my order hasn't shipped yet; this has lead me to question whether I am making a big mistake on some of these games I've ordered and whether I can change my order before it's too late.

First up, I ordered STONE AGE. It seems to be a lighter "gateway" game into the Agricola sort of realm, so I thought I might enjoy giving it a shot. I've thought about going for Puerto Rice and Agricola right off the bat, but I don't know if I will like them or if I can get anyone else to play them. I feel pretty good about this selection, for the most part.

I wanted to order 7 WONDERS, but balked because of the card color printing issue. Instead, I went for SMALL WORLD because it was ranked very highly on the "family" rankings. THIS is the one that has me the most concerned, frankly. I just don't know how much I am going to like this.

Can anyone look at my collection and maybe give some suggestions on whether you think this is or isn't a good choice?

I love Carcassonne, love Formula D, enjoy Ticket to Ride, and am cool with Catan. I own Memoir 44, but have only played it once because of the fiddly nature of the set-up. I'm looking for a game that I could introduce into a game group consisting of people who have roughly the same exposure and experience with lighter "Euros" as I do. Is SMALL WORLD a good pick, or will it sit on the shelf? Are there better options available?

Any ideas?

 
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I think Small World is a good choice. It is similar in play time, weight, and rules complexity to some of your other favorites. It scales well from 2-5 players.

After playing 7 wonders several times, I found myself disinterested. In my opinion, Small World will stand up to repeated play moreso than 7 Wonders (mainly due to the race and abiliy combinations but also because of the map and expansions).
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I like Agricola, Stone Age, etc. I didn't expect to like Small World, but I did. Having only played once, I can't give an opinion on repeated plays, though 7 Wonders is still fresh after a few plays.

If it doesn't work out, you can always trade it.
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Michael Off The Shelf Board Game Reviews
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Small World is a fun game, for what it is. If you are curious and got 15 minutes check out my review to see if it sounds like your type of game.

A Review.

Edit I should add that Small World will have more longevity at this point due to numerous expansions.
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Mike Jones
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There's a color printing issue? There are at least 5 copies in my gaming group, we haven't experinced any 'printing issues'

Stone Age is a very fun game, personally I much prefer it to Agricola. It easy to teach, gives you some choices on how you want to score and doesn't drag. Plus, there are dice to make it exciting if you want to run a few risks.

I however didn't find small world all that interesting. I found it some what repetitive. But, most people in the group really enjoy the game and it's not so bad as I won't play it. So, if you are looking to build a library for others to enjoy, it might not be bad to have.
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Miles Ratcliffe
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I haven't got a particularly large collection but, based on those you listed, I would recommend Tobago. It's a really nice game which is both easy to learn and offers a fair amount of strategy. I've played this game with about 20 different people now and they've all really enjoyed playing it.

I also own 7 Wonders and think its trully great game. You'll need 1 play to get used to it but, after that, you shouldn't have a problem. Btw, the colour printing issue is just for the leaders expansion so is nothing to worry about if you're just purchasing the main game.

I can't comment on Stone Age or Small World but I have been thinking about getting them for a while now. I think I'd like give them a try first.
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Matt Sommer
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golddmaster wrote:
I also own 7 Wonders and think its trully great game. You'll need 1 play to get used to it but, after that, you shouldn't have a problem. Btw, the colour printing issue is just for the leaders expansion so is nothing to worry about if you're just purchasing the main game.


Guantanamo wrote:
There's a color printing issue? There are at least 5 copies in my gaming group, we haven't experinced any 'printing issues'


The 2nd printing has some mismatched colors on the backs of the "3rd age" (?) cards, from what I've read. It's been pretty widely reported on BGG, and the Boards & Bits ordering page has a big "Warning!" notice about it.

I appreciate the suggestions given so far. I just don't know about SW, but at least it scales from 2-5 people. 7 Wonders seems to be the new hotness, but am I right in that it's best played with a large group?
 
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Caleb Wynn
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The 7 Wonders issue is not all that serious. We didn't even notice the issue until I heard about it on BGG. Haven't played the game since I heard about it, but I don't expect it to matter. It truly won't. It will just bother people who are going to pay attention to that sort of thing.

I wouldn't let it stop you from getting a great game.
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Matt Sommer
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Sidewynnder wrote:
The 7 Wonders issue is not all that serious. We didn't even notice the issue until I heard about it on BGG. Haven't played the game since I heard about it, but I don't expect it to matter. It truly won't. It will just bother people who are going to pay attention to that sort of thing.

I wouldn't let it stop you from getting a great game.


I appreciate the sentiment, but I just can't spend $35 on something that I KNOW has a defect. I know how I am, and I would constantly notice it even if it had no impact on gameplay.

 
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Shayne Gray
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I agree, the issue really isn't much of an issue. A couple of people that I've pointed it out to can not even tell that their is a slight color difference and it does not come into play at all that I've noticed.
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Miles Ratcliffe
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SommerMatt wrote:
The 2nd printing has some mismatched colors on the backs of the "3rd age" (?) cards, from what I've read. It's been pretty widely reported on BGG, and the Boards & Bits ordering page has a big "Warning!" notice about it.

Sry, didn't realise. I've got the Repos 2nd edition and have no problem. I guess there must just have been a bad batch. If that's the case, you should still be able to get the replacements when they become available so it's not like you're wasting any money.
 
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We played 7 Wonders with 2p, and didn't enjoy it. So much so that we were ready to get rid of it. We played it with 4p, and it was a whole different game. Some people enjoy it with 2, but we did not. I think there are a lot of better 2p games out there. 4p was a much better number.
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Lee Fisher
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Small World gets a bit boring. 7 Wonders has been more fun across more groups of players.

Stone Age is pretty solid though it hasn't gotten much play since Alien Frontiers.
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Clyde W
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If you have to choose between 7 Wonders and Small World, 7 Wonders is heaps better, I think. Of course, I'm not really a fan of games like Small World, much less Small World itself, so take that with a grain of salt. It's absolutely a bash the leader game, and the leader is the person who got lucky enough to snag the overpowered race on their turn. This happens about 3 times during the game, so you might be lucky enough to be the leader early on, and sneak in a win at the end from behind.

The problem here is of course you've told us what you like, but not WHY you like those games. Without that info, it's hard to say whether or not Small World has those things you like. But for me, it's absolutely a "I'll play it but only if you're really dying to play it" type games.

Having said that, I'm not really that much into 7 Wonders either. Not enough player interaction, but at least you feel a bit more in control of your fate than you do in Small World.

And having said THAT, I have no idea what defect you're talking about for 7 Wonders, and I've played about 8 or 9 different copies of that game.
 
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Clyde W
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SommerMatt wrote:
I appreciate the suggestions given so far. I just don't know about SW, but at least it scales from 2-5 people. 7 Wonders seems to be the new hotness, but am I right in that it's best played with a large group?
I'm not sure the 2p version of Small World is all that great. You eliminate the bash the leader aspect, but at that point you have a runaway leader issue instead.

7 Wonders at three players is actually the best version of 7 Wonders, I think. At least, it has the least amount of luck and the highest amount of strategy. At 7 it can get kinda chaotic, but it's by no means awful. I've never played it with the dummy hand in a 2p game, so can't comment there, but obviously there are many better 2p games to be had.
 
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Clyde W
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golddmaster wrote:
SommerMatt wrote:
The 2nd printing has some mismatched colors on the backs of the "3rd age" (?) cards, from what I've read. It's been pretty widely reported on BGG, and the Boards & Bits ordering page has a big "Warning!" notice about it.

Sry, didn't realise. I've got the Repos 2nd edition and have no problem. I guess there must just have been a bad batch. If that's the case, you should still be able to get the replacements when they become available so it's not like you're wasting any money.
I'd wager that this problem does not affect gameplay in the slightest, since you're hardly ever looking at the backs of the cards. I can see how this would be a problem in a traditional card game, but 7 Wonders isn't very traditional in how you play it.
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Small World is great because it is insanely easy to teach and new players can get the gist by turn 2. Given the various races and special abilities it stands up to repeated plays. It is quick and downtime is low. If you like it you can add the expansions for some more variety. Solid choice.
 
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Matt Sommer
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clydeiii wrote:
The problem here is of course you've told us what you like, but not WHY you like those games. Without that info, it's hard to say whether or not Small World has those things you like. But for me, it's absolutely a "I'll play it but only if you're really dying to play it" type games.


Fair question. Looking at my current group of games I'm playing, I guess I like games with a some sort of luck mechanic (tiles/dice/cards/etc.) that still have a level of strategy involved. I currently love Carc, as I've said, which (while random) still allows me to get better and better each time I play. I love Formula De/D, which (though dice-based) still rewards the player with the better grasp of strategy.

I'm not sure how well I can handle a game with lots of fiddly rules and bits, although as I said I WANT to give games like Agricola and Puerto Rico a try to see if I WILL like those sorts of games.

I'm never sure on whether I can find people to play any of these games, so most of them I'd like to buy must be fairly light and relatively easy to explain (like TTR level of difficulty, for example).

Maybe I'm asking for something impossible, I don't know.
 
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Lee Fisher
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SommerMatt wrote:
clydeiii wrote:
The problem here is of course you've told us what you like, but not WHY you like those games. Without that info, it's hard to say whether or not Small World has those things you like. But for me, it's absolutely a "I'll play it but only if you're really dying to play it" type games.


Fair question. Looking at my current group of games I'm playing, I guess I like games with a some sort of luck mechanic (tiles/dice/cards/etc.) that still have a level of strategy involved. I currently love Carc, as I've said, which (while random) still allows me to get better and better each time I play. I love Formula De/D, which (though dice-based) still rewards the player with the better grasp of strategy.

I'm not sure how well I can handle a game with lots of fiddly rules and bits, although as I said I WANT to give games like Agricola and Puerto Rico a try to see if I WILL like those sorts of games.

I'm never sure on whether I can find people to play any of these games, so most of them I'd like to buy must be fairly light and relatively easy to explain (like TTR level of difficulty, for example).

Maybe I'm asking for something impossible, I don't know.


Small World may simply not have enough luck for you. That seems to be a big complaint about it (or perhaps strength for those who are less inclined towards luck).
 
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Matt Sommer
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Well, the clock is ticking away and I'm guessing it's probably too late to change my order anyway. Hopefully I'll get a chance to play SW and see if it's something I want to keep. I'll probably buy 7 WONDERS sometime soon (whenever they fix the card issues).

 
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Joshua Woolls
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Seven Wonders is a great game, but IMO it shines with more people. I like the fact that it has a little luck with 4+ people. This is the game that I pull out when we have a group of people and we are looking for an easy to play, fun game. My friends and I game less to play games and more for social interaction. This is a perfect game for this.

My wife and I, on the other hand, game more for the game. We do not enjoy 7 Wonders at all by ourselves.

Good Great game for the right situation.
 
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I would agree with the above posters - I think 7 Wonders is a great game, and the sweet spot is 4-6 players My wife and I like the robot, but 4-6 is really where it shines. To be honest, I prefer it to Small World, mainly because when it comes down to it, while there is a lot of variable powers and races, the core idea of attack, reinforce, and decline doesn't really change a whole lot unless you buy the expansions. The expansions change the way the game works a good deal.... but those expansions are $10 each. or $20 with the big one. So in terms of base games, I'd go with 7 Wonders.

To be honest (and this is just my opinion, so no offense to those who really like Stone Age) I'm not such a fan of Stone Age. It seems that you like luck in your games, so maybe Stone Age is for you - but in Stone Age the luck of the dice will make or break your game (and since dice hate me, they broke my game). Some things can mitigate bad luck, but by and large, I feel like the unalterable turn order is not very helpful in mitigating bad dice rolls. If you want another game that has a good amount of luck but that is easier to work around, Kingsburg is a great gateway game! Anyway, good luck and have fun with your gaming!
meeple
 
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Matt Sommer
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Well, the order has shipped so I guess it's too late now! I'm stuck with what I ordered

Thanks to everyone for their opinions. Will definitely (probably) buy 7 WONDERS sometime soon.

 
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Laura BlueFrost
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What I don't like about Small World is that it's too simplistic for my taste. Collect Points every round and at round 10 whoever has more points wins. I'm not saying it doesn't require thinking because I bet you can excel in it, however, the whole concept and specially how you "conquer" new areas is just... feels like playing a Simplified Abstract Strategy Game but your victory condition is only through collecting more points than your opponent at round 10. gulp
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Matt Sommer
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mmotomb wrote:

What I don't like about Small World is that it's too simplistic for my taste. Collect Points every round and at round 10 whoever has more points wins. I'm not saying it doesn't require thinking because I bet you can excel in it, however, the whole concept and specially how you "conquer" new areas is just... feels like playing a Simplified Abstract Strategy Game but your victory condition is only through collecting more points than your opponent at round 10. gulp



I already said I bought it... stop making me feel bad!

 
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