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Dungeons & Dragons: Conquest of Nerath Board Game» Forums » Rules

Subject: rules clarification on bridging. rss

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Alan Castell
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Sorry for posting to the wrong section but off the playbook tethered it won't select "rules".
IF a warship is "bridging" can it only move 2 units across or is it unlimited?
 
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Greg Lott
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As soon as a ship begins disembarking its cargo, its movement is complete. Therefore, it cannot pick any one else up after it begins dropping cargo off.
 
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Kiren Maelwulf
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Warships can move before and after loading but once it unloads the warships turn ends. So you be able to bridge a total of 2 units per ship, per movement phase.
 
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Mont A.
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That's a really good question.

Having studied the rules last night, I don't think it's addressed.

Unloading units ends a warship's movement, but not explicitly its activity.

And regarding carrying limits, the rules state only that "A Warship can carry up to 2 land pieces." Whether this is the limit it can carry per turn (which would limit bridging via that ship to a maximum of 2 pieces), or whether this is the limit it can carry at any given moment (which would leave briding unlimited) isn't specified.

Another game of this type — the excellent Viktory II — specifies that once a ship has unloaded any units, it cannot load again that turn. That leaves no ambiguity. Nerath's rules don't say anything like this though.

So I think it all hinges on how we fill in the reference missing from the crucial line "A Warship can carry up to 2 land pieces."

My hunch is that the designers intend bridging to be limited to 2 pieces per warship though.
 
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Mont A.
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ferris1971 wrote:
As soon as a ship begins disembarking its cargo, its movement is complete. Therefore, it cannot pick any one else up after it begins dropping cargo off.


I suspect that is indeed what the designers intended. But I don't think the rules say that. Yes, a ship's movement ends once it unloads, but as written this only precludes a ship moving to another space after unloading. Neither loading nor unloading use movement points, and they don't count against movement in any way.

So although unloading units ends a ship's movement, that doesn't preclude loading and unloading more units, because loading/unloading doesn't require any movement.

I'm not saying this is what the rules intend. I'm just saying this is what they allow as written.
 
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Kiren Maelwulf
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Actually both loading and unloading are in fact part of the movement phase so if the pieces movement is over for the turn as is stated on page 12 of the rulebook it would stand to reason it could no longer participate in activites restricted to it's movement step.
 
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Mont A.
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Kirenx wrote:
Actually both loading and unloading are in fact part of the movement phase so if the pieces movement is over for the turn as is stated on page 12 of the rulebook it would stand to reason it could no longer participate in activites restricted to it's movement step.

Kiren, I'm not sure what you mean by movement phase. I don't think the rules even mention the term movement phase, let alone restrict loading and unloading to part of it.

Again, I think the designers intend what you say. It's just that the rules as they are now don't fully implement that intention.
 
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Kiren Maelwulf
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Typhon wrote:
Kirenx wrote:
Actually both loading and unloading are in fact part of the movement phase so if the pieces movement is over for the turn as is stated on page 12 of the rulebook it would stand to reason it could no longer participate in activites restricted to it's movement step.

What are you looking at Kiren? I don't think the rules even mention the term movement phase, let alone restrict loading and unloading to part of it.

Again, I think the designers intend what you say. It's just that the rules as they are now don't fully implement that intention.


It states on page 12:
Quote:
Unloading: Once a Warship unloads pieces it is carrying, its movement is over for the turn.


Loading and unloading occur during the warships movement. Whether or not the warship is actually moving is irrelevent, if it's movement is over it can no longer preform actions that are played out during it's movement. This means even if all you do is unload you can not afterwards load. The order given for transport rules starting on page 11 is Loading, Transporting, and then Unloading which as mentioned above ends the Warships movement for the turn. All this happens during Step 2: Move when as listed under the movement basics on page 10:

Quote:
Pieces move in different ways, depending on their type. Some pieces can perform special actions while moving.


All the transportation actions occur during the move step, all bridging points out is that you can utalize those actions with a move of 0. If the pieces movement is over however there is no additional step listed in the rules were a warship would able to continue using movement abilities.
 
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Kiren Maelwulf
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Typhon wrote:
Kirenx wrote:
Actually both loading and unloading are in fact part of the movement phase so if the pieces movement is over for the turn as is stated on page 12 of the rulebook it would stand to reason it could no longer participate in activites restricted to it's movement step.

Kiren, I'm not sure what you mean by movement phase. I don't think the rules even mention the term movement phase, let alone restrict loading and unloading to part of it.

Again, I think the designers intend what you say. It's just that the rules as they are now don't fully implement that intention.


They do not use the term phase, that is my own wording. They do mention movement and special abilities while moving. My main point is that those abilites are stated to be used while the unit is moving, the fact that the unit may be moving 0 is not an issue, however when the units movement is over for the turn there is no other timing listed were the unit would still be allowed to use movement effects.

You are probably right that the rules could have been written clearer. I think though that a "rules lawyer" could still make a solid case that they are clear with what is written down currently.
 
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Mikkel Øberg
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Shadrack wrote:
IF a warship is "bridging" can it only move 2 units across or is it unlimited?


A quick search in the forums net my old post, where I posted the official answer from Wizards:

Gregaria wrote wrote:
Can a single transport initiate two sea landings, and unlimited bridges?


Wizards: A single warship can initiate 2 sea landings however it will not be able to act as a bridge. The reason for this is that disembarking is part of the ships movement and it is no longer allowed to move after units disembark from it. That also means that any units that embark later in the turn will not be able to disembark as the warship's moves are done.
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Eric Ruhland
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Gregaria wrote:
Shadrack wrote:
IF a warship is "bridging" can it only move 2 units across or is it unlimited?


A quick search in the forums net my old post, where I posted the official answer from Wizards:

Gregaria wrote wrote:
Can a single transport initiate two sea landings, and unlimited bridges?


Wizards: A single warship can initiate 2 sea landings however it will not be able to act as a bridge. The reason for this is that disembarking is part of the ships movement and it is no longer allowed to move after units disembark from it. That also means that any units that embark later in the turn will not be able to disembark as the warship's moves are done.
So does that mean I can pick up two land pieces, move two sea spaces, disembark the 2 land pieces and then, as part of the movement for another piece embark 2 more land pieces on the same ship (where they will stay until next turn when I can use the ship's movement to disembark them)?
 
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Kiren Maelwulf
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Eirikr wrote:
Gregaria wrote:
Shadrack wrote:
IF a warship is "bridging" can it only move 2 units across or is it unlimited?


A quick search in the forums net my old post, where I posted the official answer from Wizards:

Gregaria wrote wrote:
Can a single transport initiate two sea landings, and unlimited bridges?


Wizards: A single warship can initiate 2 sea landings however it will not be able to act as a bridge. The reason for this is that disembarking is part of the ships movement and it is no longer allowed to move after units disembark from it. That also means that any units that embark later in the turn will not be able to disembark as the warship's moves are done.
So does that mean I can pick up two land pieces, move two sea spaces, disembark the 2 land pieces and then, as part of the movement for another piece embark 2 more land pieces on the same ship (where they will stay until next turn when I can use the ship's movement to disembark them)?


I think it is just refering to the fact that you can unload units to different adjacent coastal spaces. Loading is a seperate part of the sea transport ability and the offical stance seems to clarify that once you finish with disembarking pieces the warship is done for the turn.
 
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Eric Ruhland
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Gregaria wrote:
Wizards: A single warship can initiate 2 sea landings however it will not be able to act as a bridge. The reason for this is that disembarking is part of the ships movement and it is no longer allowed to move after units disembark from it. That also means that any units that embark later in the turn will not be able to disembark as the warship's moves are done.
This seems to indicate that they can embark afterwards. Perhaps embarking is a function of the ground piece's movement rather than the ship's movement?
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Kiren Maelwulf
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Eirikr wrote:
Gregaria wrote:
Wizards: A single warship can initiate 2 sea landings however it will not be able to act as a bridge. The reason for this is that disembarking is part of the ships movement and it is no longer allowed to move after units disembark from it. That also means that any units that embark later in the turn will not be able to disembark as the warship's moves are done.
This seems to indicate that they can embark afterwards. Perhaps embarking is a function of the ground piece's movement rather than the ship's movement?


Yeah you are right that does seem to suggest that. Makes sense, good catch.
 
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Alan Castell
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Bridging: If a Warship moved 2 sea spaces before it loaded
land pieces, it can unload those pieces only into another
coastal space adjacent to the sea space it is in. A Warship can
also load and unload pieces without moving at all. Moving
land pieces across a sea space in this way is sometimes called
“bridging.” Bridging is a quick way to move land pieces across
a narrow passage just 1 sea space wide, such as the Saris Strait
or Skallen Reach, or even Lake Surth

What confuses me is that it is a "quick way to move land pieces".
Why would they make that statement.
Why is Bridging quicker than transporting?
That is what caused me to notice this.
 
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Kiren Maelwulf
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Shadrack wrote:
Bridging: If a Warship moved 2 sea spaces before it loaded
land pieces, it can unload those pieces only into another
coastal space adjacent to the sea space it is in. A Warship can
also load and unload pieces without moving at all. Moving
land pieces across a sea space in this way is sometimes called
“bridging.” Bridging is a quick way to move land pieces across
a narrow passage just 1 sea space wide, such as the Saris Strait
or Skallen Reach, or even Lake Surth

What confuses me is that it is a "quick way to move land pieces".
Why would they make that statement.
Why is Bridging quicker than transporting?
That is what caused me to notice this.


Bridging is transporting, not quicker. The idea is supposed to be that you can just leave a warship in an area to bridge and units can pass over a water space from one land space to another in a single turn.

I think the developers were trying to coin a phrase for their game with the use of the word bridging. Would probably be better if they didn't for a new game as it can cause confusion.
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Donald Walsh
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Note that the question on the WotC forum is worded differently from the OP's question.

I also read that unloading ends a move for the ship, which would mean no more "loading" action for that ship on that turn.
 
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Eric Ruhland
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havoc110 wrote:
Note that the question on the WotC forum is worded differently from the OP's question.

I also read that unloading ends a move for the ship, which would mean no more "loading" action for that ship on that turn.
But that assumes that loading, like unloading, is part of the ship's movement. Perhaps it is not part of the ship's movement but rather a part of the land unit's movement in which case you would still be able to load after unloading. I don't have the rules in front of me so I will have to check once I've unpacked my games (just moved).
 
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Alan Castell
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Exactly. That is how I see it too. Why make specific mention of bridging to point out something that is the same as the rules. It seems more like they pointed it out for a reason.
Would be great to get a designer clarification on this.
I really respect the game designers that are on this site. I think tech support should come with every purchase and for a bit of time on a forum, designers can support the people who bought their game. Very cheap way of supporting your product. No calling center needed if you do it right.
Anyways, just would like to know for sure whether there is a 2 unit max per warship bridging, or could you move a couple of 2 move guys over and then 2 more and so on, or move a force over like a bridge, which doesn't have a limit.
Why use the word "bridge"?
Help WOTC.
 
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Peter Lee
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Bridging only allows two figures/warship, not an unlimited number.
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Alan Castell
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Thanks Peter. This one almost caused me and a friend to come to blows this weekend.
What about clarifying the rule on when you take over possession of a space, posted elsewhere, if possession changes during the movement phase or if there is still a "battle" on a space that doesn't have an enemy on it, just his possession marker.
 
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Peter Lee
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When a realm moves into an unoccupied enemy space, possession doesn't change until the "fight battle" steps.
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Donald Walsh
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Thanks again, Peter
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