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Subject: Waning interest..... rss

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Kevin Anderson
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At one point this was one of my favorite games.
But as more games were played certain things began to emerge that I'm not a fan of. Up until recently I've always enjoyed the "game within a game" that was the Turkish Max RP level. How many to use, could you afford to take an Action "off" to even play an RP card, and to occasionally build it back up a notch or two for the late game.
Now I discovered after all this time I've been doing it wrong. 25 is all you can ever spend without the Bonus and GE RPs and there never seems to be enough of those. The game STARTS with 8.5 RPs worth of reduced units which all the starting Bonus RPs can't cover.
Maybe I'm wrong but after this I'm instituting a new playing style as the Allies and just attack at every opportunity.
In the past, I would ignore Gallipoli but why now? I see no way beyond awful one-sided die rolls in battle that you can't wear down those RPs quickly and keep the pace with your own stash of BR men and equipment they can potentially pour in to the "sideshow".
Now you can't even try and prepare for Turkish War Weariness. The British one is a joke in comparison. (I never play it for the event).
The other item I'm not caring much for is the domination towards play of a single card: "Parvus To Berlin". But, that can be a whole thread in itself.
It's easy to see why people bid on being the Allies.
 
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juerg haeberli
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Hmm......I can't completely follow you on the replacement part. Yes there are 25 TU replacement points ( if Blockade comes early ) but with the German replacement points they last quite long and there are some ways around replacement shortage and TU war weariness in the endgame.
a) The army of islam HQ which produces replacement points if correctely used.
b) Tsars armory which can be used to replace units which you have reduced for war weariness.
For Parvus, Secret treaty and Persian Push we are testing a house rule which gives 1 VP to the opponent if you play Secret Treaty or Persian Push first and subtracts a VP if Parvus is played in turn 3 and adds a VP if he is played in turn 6 ( or later )
Right now we play with a 8 card hand which seems to be a little better for the AP than the CP but has the advantage that on average Parvus shows up a little earlyer.
Now the idea with the all out attck isn't new but landing at Galliapoli is a big strategic decision which requires a lot of resources which you can't use in other places which may be better suited for it.
Just landing and attacking usually leads to desaster on the Jihad front.
So over all. Yes Parvus and Bulgaria are very important cards but I think the replacement front is still well balanced and so far I don't think it has a problem game wise.
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Philip Thomas
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A3RKev wrote:
At one point this was one of my favorite games.
But as more games were played certain things began to emerge that I'm not a fan of. Up until recently I've always enjoyed the "game within a game" that was the Turkish Max RP level. How many to use, could you afford to take an Action "off" to even play an RP card, and to occasionally build it back up a notch or two for the late game.
Now I discovered after all this time I've been doing it wrong. 25 is all you can ever spend without the Bonus and GE RPs and there never seems to be enough of those. The game STARTS with 8.5 RPs worth of reduced units which all the starting Bonus RPs can't cover.
Maybe I'm wrong but after this I'm instituting a new playing style as the Allies and just attack at every opportunity.
In the past, I would ignore Gallipoli but why now? I see no way beyond awful one-sided die rolls in battle that you can't wear down those RPs quickly and keep the pace with your own stash of BR men and equipment they can potentially pour in to the "sideshow".
Now you can't even try and prepare for Turkish War Weariness. The British one is a joke in comparison. (I never play it for the event).
The other item I'm not caring much for is the domination towards play of a single card: "Parvus To Berlin". But, that can be a whole thread in itself.
It's easy to see why people bid on being the Allies.


When you've been playing a particular way for some time, it can be difficult to change to playing a different way. As someone who has been playing with 25 Max RPs for a while, I find that they are normally enough to see the game through: sometimes the Turks do run out of RPs, but only rarely and quite late in the game. As for all those reduced units at the start, well you don't have to flip them all. Some will be killed by the Allies before they can be flipped, others you can use as fodder for LCUs, and the TU-A VI Corps I generally leave reduced until I can remove it with Caucasian Army Reforms. There are plenty of Bonus RPs in the opening events and if Blockade is played in turn 2 not turn 1 you have a free use of RPs in turn 1 before the limit bites.

Did the Turks ever run out of RPs in your games?

Allied aggression (and in particular Russian aggression) is in general a very sensible strategy. Landing at Gallipoli can work well if done in force and after securing Athens. Wearing down those RPs may take longer than you think. In your previous games there was no need for the CP player to play multiple cards for RPs a turn (putting back all the TU Rps given by the second and (if required) third card), so you probably haven't seen just how resilient the TU RPs can be. I assure you it is perfectly possible to plan for Turkish Warweariness in the rules as written: it is a matter of using your RPs economically.

British Warweariness is not often played for the event, true.

Parvus to Berlin, I guess it is a problem with this ops/event system that either you make key events inevitable and get the Parvus problem or you make those events possible and get complaints about wild historical inaccuracy (see Paths, I'm not sure the complaints are valid, but they're certainly there).

People bid on playing the Allies, but the Central Powers tend to win!
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Kevin Anderson
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Most of my games have been against the same FTF opponent. True, the TU RPs have never gone to 0 but they've been as low as 7 and we've never gone beyond Winter 1918.
I would have preferred if Tribes, while they used TU RPs, didn't lower the maximum which would strictly be for TU and TU-A, or allow the Turks a one-time RP card play immediately following the play of Blockade. Only the amount of TU RPs on the card would be used and would be considered "bonus". This would represent a last ditch recruitment/supply effort before the blockade fully kicks in.
 
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Kristian Thy
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Gunulfr ok Øgotr ok Aslakr ok Rolfr resþu sten þænsi æftir Ful, felaga sin, ær warþ ... døþr, þa kunungar barþusk.
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A3RKev wrote:
I would have preferred if Tribes, while they used TU RPs, didn't lower the maximum which would strictly be for TU and TU-A ...


I've never (as in never ever) used TU RPs for tribes. In the early game - before the Berlin-Istanbul railroad is open - you usually have 1 Allied RP and 1 GE RP per turn that you can't use for anything else anyway. Later on, tribes become increasingly irrelevant as the AP either closes down their home spaces (Senussi, Bawi, Bakhtiari) or the front passes them by (Laz, Marsh Arabs, Jangali).
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Philip Thomas
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A3RKev wrote:
Most of my games have been against the same FTF opponent. True, the TU RPs have never gone to 0 but they've been as low as 7 and we've never gone beyond Winter 1918.
I would have preferred if Tribes, while they used TU RPs, didn't lower the maximum which would strictly be for TU and TU-A, or allow the Turks a one-time RP card play immediately following the play of Blockade. Only the amount of TU RPs on the card would be used and would be considered "bonus". This would represent a last ditch recruitment/supply effort before the blockade fully kicks in.


Like Kristian I don't use TU Rps for tribes. 7 RPs in Winter 1918 is plenty, more than 2 RPs per turn (no RPs are used in the last turn of course). The one-time RP Card is effectively what happens if Blockade is played in turn 2 (the CPs get the RPs from their card in turn 1 free).

Let us know how you get on with the rules changes...
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Kevin Anderson
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I've slowly come to this conclusion myself. In my last game Laz and Sinjabi received quite a few RPs but they were involved in a lot of Turn 6 Parvus Russian battles. The rest were either cut off or simply not worth it.
Began a new game last night FTF. Now I don't know whether to laugh or cry after the stink I've just made but due to game circumstances as of the start of Winter 1916, neither side has played an RP card yet.
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Kevin Anderson
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Playing ACTS/ Cyberboard Pursuit with Mr. Thomas as the CP has been very educational particularly in the frugal play of TU RPs. I must admit to being a bit mistaken on my previous stance.
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