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Summoner Wars: Master Set» Forums » General

Subject: the purple cards are just to close in color for my friends rss

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tim Tim TIm TIM TIMMY!!
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Hey All,

So I finally started to play SW after getting the MS at GC, and I picked up one other starter box.

I live in the frontier of a developing country so it is hard to find gamers here. I have a volunteer that has been here over a year and half and I got him gaming a lot, he is good guy, but not a gamer and not a strategic thinker - like I consider myself to be. So with cards that are basically the same exact color and one having kinda a marble effect I feel was a REALLY BAD IDEA.

I figure they wanted the colors to all be darker and such, but man a nice bright color we could tell apart would work so much better.

I have housed ruled that the Shadow Elves and the Deep Dwarves are not aloud to fight each other cause my friend Matt is just not paying enough attention to tell them apart. It makes me think I need to get sleeves for one one of them - but again I just wonder what the designer was thinking on that color combo being so similar - plus the fact that they are both in the MS, if one was a older faction I could kinda understand it - but there are so many colors to choose, why choose the same one twice.

The markers on the back side of the cards are also the same color and they are different, but to a non gamer who is not paying attention I have found they look the same or very similar - I figure they want the game to have a standard look, and that makes sense to me, but again I think making them a different color would clear up a lot of confusing issues when playing the game with casual gamers verses hard core geeks. But to be honest I think I mixed them up once also so maybe it would help everyone playing and not just the casual gamers.

Just my take on the color scheme, go back to your regular program now.

Game On´
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Bryan Stout
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The colors could have been more distinct, but the main way to tell different forces apart is the way they are facing. After all, some factions can take over opposing units, so you must be able to distinguish them by their facing -- if it's upside down, it's not your unit. See if your friend can use that as the main way of telling them apart.
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tim Tim TIm TIM TIMMY!!
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Barliman wrote:
The colors could have been more distinct, but the main way to tell different forces apart is the way they are facing. After all, some factions can take over opposing units, so you must be able to distinguish them by their facing -- if it's upside down, it's not your unit. See if your friend can use that as the main way of telling them apart.


I hear ya, but nope it does not help. A big thing was we played a 2nd game and he did not separate them correctly so he had some of my guys in his deck and just played them as his own, and then I am like how did you get one of my elves on your side - I don´t know, shit, lets start over and let me separate the cards.

I got the facing part, but if they where actually different colors, and not the same color with one having a kinda marble effect then you could say hey wait a minute that is a different color so that does not belong here, but with the colors being so very close you have to pay way to much attention to it, hence my new house rules that those 2 factions should not fight each other.
 
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Richard Sampson
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While I can see where you are coming from you should consider a couple of things:

1.) All cards have their faction symbol on front and back. When separating the cards after a game, you can use the large symbols on the back to do so (assuming you don't have opaque sleeves).

2.) Orientation can help you during game play, and is necessary in cases where control is taken of an opposing unit (such as Benders).

3.) The elves pictured on the cards don't look anything like the dwarves and should be an immediate red-flag if you have your opponents unit in your hand.

The only issues I have ever had with similar color is with the walls, but looking at the back of the card is a sure-fire way to resolve whose wall it is.

Edit: In regards to the color chosen, I believe the factions were designed before the game (the original starter sets) was released. So the colors were probably chosen before it was decided to make this set.
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tim Tim TIm TIM TIMMY!!
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again I here ya, and I am a gamer, so no problems for me. But AGAIN I am talking about playing this game with friends who are not gamers, and may not pay as much attention as a serious gamer would - if the colors where different, and the symbols on the back where different colors it would help a lot for my friends who I can get to play this who are not geeks or serious gamers.

1) yes I understand, but they are close enough that my friend got them mixed up more then once.


2)Yep, but that has not been a problem, the problem is when he summons a guy and it is one of my guys - and I ask how did you get a elf in your dwarf army ( he just chuckles and says I don't know )

3) yes your right and it is for me, but not for my friend who is not a gamer, cause he does not notice it at all ( You got 3 common units to use, maybe 4, you would think he would notice a new character - but he doesn't. Yes I would but again I am a geek ). I think it comes down to I need to move to where there are other gamers so I can have better competition in games like this and heroscape.


edit comment - could be, no clue, but they are close enough I think it was a bad choice, that does not mean it was a bad choice in any way shape or form, it just means for me it does not work and I wish it was different.
 
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Richard Sampson
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Sounds like you need some new friends.
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Christen
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Sounds like the issue is your friend, not the game
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Bryan Stout
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ras2124 wrote:
Sounds like you need some new friends.

Nah, he just needs to educate this friend.

These issues of recognizing different faction symbols is really not a function of being a geek or not. Just have him practice looking at the faction symbols when he sorts or draws cards. And looking for the name of the faction on the front side.

And if a card ended up in the wrong pile, I probably wouldn't start the whole game over, I'd just shuffle it into the correct draw pile.


And yes, I agree that it would have been better if the colors were more distinct. Point taken. But if your friend is smart enough to actually play the game, he is smart enough to learn to look for faction symbols and names.
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tim Tim TIm TIM TIMMY!!
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don't forget that a lot of people play games when they are drinking and partying so that may add to the difficulties my friend has.

My friend has trouble keeping the 3 piles and his hand separated, so yea I could use smarter friends, but then they would be smart enough to work and have jobs and probably not play games all day, so I guess it is a give and take,
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KevOne
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I feel the same, the color indeed is too close, there still many other shades of purple to choose from. I actually would want to see the shadow elve to be a pinkish purple like the skirt on their ranger. My girlfriend would of loved that. Both same shade of purple indeed is one poor choice I must say.

But aside from that, everything in the master set is perfect, the balance, the theme and the game itself. The same shade of purple is just really us nit picking at the end of the day whistle
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tim Tim TIm TIM TIMMY!!
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Baoaa wrote:
I feel the same, the color indeed is too close, there still many other shades of purple to choose from. I actually would want to see the shadow elve to be a pinkish purple like the skirt on their ranger. My girlfriend would of loved that. Both same shade of purple indeed is one poor choice I must say.

But aside from that, everything in the master set is perfect, the balance, the theme and the game itself. The same shade of purple is just really us nit picking at the end of the day whistle


What he said, I totally agree.
 
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David Richards
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Just wanted to chime in on the differences between the cards of these factions. While the purple may be close, there are many stark contrasts between the overall palettes used for each. Back when I was first tasked with designing the cards, I did so knowing that should the game take off (as it did) there would need to be a way to visually separate different factions should they have a base color which was similar as more factions would be released.

The obvious one, as mentioned above, is the faction symbol on the back. Personally, I don't feel these are difficult to tell apart. The shapes are quite different. However, if looking only at the back of the card, other ways to tell the difference would be the color of the logo, the different color of the outline along the edge of the card, and the different color of the metallic elements in the corners. And yes, the level of saturation of the card backgrounds are different, as well as the intensity of the texture.

When the cards are in play, outside of the two factions facing different directions, you can tell the cards apart in a number of different ways in regards to color:

• The metal outline separating the different sections of the card, as well as the corners.

• Each banner is composed of three different colors (outside, stroke, and inside). And the different font color of the unit name also helps, as well as the faction name being just below the unit name.

• The shields representing the different kinds of units are different colors.

• The wound markers color and the space they're in. The faction symbol is here as well (unless a merc).

• The box color for the units ability.

• The cloud background in the staging area for the character illustration (though these two factions are a little close, I admit).

The argument that the two shades of purple are close is perhaps a valid one. But, as listed above, there are a number of different ways to tell the two different factions apart.

Even if one is slightly inebriated.


David Richards
Graphic Designer for Plaid Hat Games
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tim Tim TIm TIM TIMMY!!
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I hear ya, and I have no problem with telling them apart, but as you said, the shades of are close -- so for the casual gamer who has had a few to drink this is a tougher issue. Understand I consider my self a pretty hard core gamer so I am paying way to much attention to everything and rereading the cards to make sure I know what is going on - my friend is there to relax, have a good time, and is not paying a lot of attention and will miss a lot of the special abilities on the cards ( which I constantly point out to him so it is a better game for me also )

Thanks so much for all that info, now I need to go check out your great work even closer!
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