Recommend
8 
 Thumb up
 Hide
11 Posts

Guards! Guards! A Discworld Boardgame» Forums » Reviews

Subject: Guards! Guards! When will the rules be available. rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Mark Higginbottom
United Kingdom
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Hi all. this is my first review so bear with me.

Received my copy of Guards! Guards! last week and have had the opportunity to play it a few times with 2 players and up to 5 players.

First things first.

Components.

The game components are first class. Wooden meeples for player pieces and various cubes and cylinders for markers. The cardboard pieces are made from thick and sturdy card which press out with the minimum of chads (a major bugbear of mine). The artwork is an absolute joy to behold, the volunteer cards especially. Each volunteer is beautifully illustrated with a quote from Mr Pratchett's works.

The only criticisms I have here are the golden cylinders to mark off collected spells and the player crib card. The cylinders are a little thin and tall which makes them slightly unstable. They are very prone to being knocked over by the slightest wobble of the table or more often blasted into oblivion by over enthusiastic dice rolling. The player crib card - why is there only one?
Two very minor criticisms but worth mentioning.

Gameplay
The gameplay on the whole is quite straight forward. Move around the board to collect stuff while avoiding hazards, use stuff to complete tasks. Think Talisman or aspects of Escape from Colditz and you will not be a million miles from how this game feels to play. The downside to this is that the game can drag on as players gang up to prevent a leader from winning leading to long game times (The 5 player game took 3 1/2 hours).

WARNING - Do not play this game with anyone who suffers from AP or who insists on exploring every potential move for the optimum set of actions. This really drags the game down, goes against the spirit of the game and extends game time exponentially.

Overall it is a light hearted romp around the board in a universe dripping with theme.

Rules
Ah! The rules! Now we get to the heart of the problem with this game. Ostensibly the rules are rather simple. Move round the board, collect stuff, draw cards and race back to the centre with a bit of conflict and sabotage thrown in. The issues all arise where these simple rules intersect. The devil is in the details. The rules are to open to interpretation and do not cover even common situations e.g. is more than one pawn allowed on a space? What happens when more than one player is sent to hospital because on the hilarious/pesky luggage? Select a volunteer at random, the card back are different, giving a idea to their likely characteristics. Could shuffle under the table? Each volunteer may be equipped with stuff. Lets face it, any game that needs a smart phone app to clarify the rules so the game can be played cannot be good.


Overall

I really want to like this game. Playing it with my 11 year old daughter where I can gloss over the rule shortcomings is a joy. Playing it with experienced board gamers some of whom suffer from AP is a long drawn out test of character.

The game feels like it has been rushed to market without adequate play testing (perhaps because there is another game being released that is set in the same city in the Discworld). I am rather annoyed about this as I had such high expectations. As a person who pre-ordered direct I feel I should get a properly printed copy of the rules sent to me free of charge when the game has been properly play tested and the rules finalised to a playable set and not the usual codge up of PDF's released on the web to be printed off. After all I paid for a complete and usable product, not a P&P game.

Conclusion
All the elements are there for a great game, especially for a younger audience. Just wait till the rules are finalised.









*Edited for grammar
11 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Richard Morris
Scotland
Harrogate
North Yorkshire
flag msg tools
designer
Join the BGG Folding @Home Team !!
badge
This user had more :gg: than sense
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I've not seen the game, so cannot comment on details of the rules. But it seems fairly clear from other threads on here that this has been long in its gestation, with lots of playtesting. So your comments on the rules would seem rather strange, were it not for the fact that there are already quite a few threads on here asking for clarifications. So I do not doubt you. It will be interesting to hear the explanations (if we do hear them) - were the rules clear in the designer's heads, and verbally explained to playtesters, rather than playtesters just working from the rules, for example.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Andy Holt
England
Rayleigh
Essex
flag msg tools
This is not the cat you're looking for - some other cat maybe?
badge
tout passe, tout lasse, tout casse
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I agree with most of what you say.

The random selection of volunteers in the taverns is done according to a die roll using a table hidden-away on the player reference card.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Victor Vidal
United Kingdom
London
London
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Agree
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Paul Roberts
United Kingdom
Burton On Trent
Staffordshire
flag msg tools
Sysop of "Big Bang Burger Bar" Forum (www.bigbangburgerbar.co.uk)
badge
Organiser of "Raiders of the Game Cupboard" (www.raidersofthegamecupboard.co.uk)
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
higginbottomm wrote:
Hi all. this is my first review so bear with me.
The rules are to open to interpretation and do not cover even common situations e.g. is more than one pawn allowed on a space? What happens when more than one player is sent to hospital because on the hilarious/pesky luggage?


Page 3 of the rules:

Hospital Tiles, City Watch tiles and bridges are the only spaces on the board which can be occupied by more than one player at a time


Also there is an extended version of the rulebook on their website with some deigner notes & tips:

http://www.guardsguards.com/images/file/Rules-and-Tips-app.p...

Hope this helps a little bit.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Andy Holt
England
Rayleigh
Essex
flag msg tools
This is not the cat you're looking for - some other cat maybe?
badge
tout passe, tout lasse, tout casse
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
oridyne wrote:

Page 3 of the rules:

Hospital Tiles, City Watch tiles and bridges are the only spaces on the board which can be occupied by more than one player at a time




Yes, I now see that it is there, but we couldn't find it when playing on Monday because it is in a section of the rules that describes the components*, not where it belongs under "movement".

This now raises the question as to whether you can move through an occupied space (the answer to this is given for the luggage, but not as a general rule.) I assume you can, but ...

* The sort of text that you normally just skim over because you don't expect to find anything important there.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ian Kelly
United States
Longmont
Colorado
flag msg tools
Allow me to introduce myself. I am Hexachlorophene J. Goodfortune, Kidnapper-At-Large, and Devourer of Tortoises par Excellence, at your service.
badge
If you can read this, then this sentence is false.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
higginbottomm wrote:
The game feels like it has been rushed to market without adequate play testing (perhaps to be another game being released that is set in the same city in the Discworld). I am rather annoyed about this as i had such high expectations. As a person who pre-ordered direct I feel I should get a properly printed copy of the rules sent to me free of charge when the game has been properly play tested and the rules finalised to a playable set and not the usual codge up of PDF's released on the web to be printed off. After all I payed for a complete and usable product, not a P&P game.


That surprises me, since the original design of this game is supposed to be 15 years old.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Tom
United States
Plainfield
ILLINOIS
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
This game was the first design by boardgame "fans" not necessarily game design professionals. I imagine most "first time" boardgame designs are rather rusty affairs although I am sure some designer's first games were their best. Reading the designer's website, it seems while this game was extensively play tested, I suspect this was done with people they knew which makes sense because most people don't have big budgets. The problem with play testing using your game group, friends, or employees (FFG) is this is susceptible to groupthink. So there are a few ambiguous rules, but I think it was because the rules made sense to the play testers because they understood the entent of the rules.

The good news is the authors of the game have been very responsive, quick to answer questions, very polite, and extremely receptive to criticism. I must say I don't normally like games like this but I really enjoyed the two times I played this title. I would not have traded the game away if it were not for the great offer I received. I only decided to put the game up for trade when I read something on BGG that this game was a clone of Talisman. I had just come back from Gencon dissatisfied with several of my purchases and sure this would be another disappointment. I played it, enjoyed it, and the next day got a trade offer I couldn't refuse and figured I could always buy it agin.

For all my criticism towards the game I agree with the OP...this is a fun little lite affair and I was shocked to find my wife really enjoying this game too.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Paul Roberts
United Kingdom
Burton On Trent
Staffordshire
flag msg tools
Sysop of "Big Bang Burger Bar" Forum (www.bigbangburgerbar.co.uk)
badge
Organiser of "Raiders of the Game Cupboard" (www.raidersofthegamecupboard.co.uk)
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
This thread is worth a look as it provides some rule clarifications:

http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/684719/typical-lots-of-quest...

I certainly interpret the rules that, as with the luggage, you can pass through other players. Obviously that runs the risk of them trying to use their Guild power on you as you pass, which may make you find another way around anyway

One or two of those make a lot more sense in comparison to the words as written in the rules.

I agree the rulebook is hard to follow, lacking in in-play examples of rules and not always clear.

Hopefully, as the designers seem very responsive, they will eventually compile some sort of FAQ or revised rules on their website.

I had my 2nd game of this last night, both times with 4 players, We are still having to skim the rules but I really like this game.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Leonard Boyd
msg tools
designer
mbmbmbmbmb
Hi all.

Firstly thanks to all everyone who has posted on this thread.

I think the question of can players share a tile on the playing board has already been answered here (thanks Paul).

(We had included this information in the description of the playing board because this is where we explained the layout of the board and covered which areas where considered to be in play and where players can and can not move during the game etc. Perhaps, with the benefit of hindsight, we should have repeated this information in the movement section as suggested here.)

The point raised by Andy about the recruiting of volunteers in a Tavern is covered on page 5 of the rule book under the heading Recruiting a Volunteer.

“Random Volunteers may also be recruited in the two Taverns
marked on the playing board. See Player Guide for details.”

In respect to the Extended Rules & Hints & Tips document available on our website:
This was designed purely to give anyone interested a few tips from the designers into some of the possible strategies and options a player might have throughout the game.

As for the Free App this is something we have produced and put out there purely because we thought fans would find it fun to have on their phones.
Again this just gives a few hints and tips on stuff like Who is the best volunteer to recruit for Toughness? or Who is the most Streetwise? or which characters give the best bonuses etc.

I have to make clear that neither of these is designed as an essential ‘must have before you play’ add-on and they are not intended to be updates or corrections of the rule book in any way.

It is obvious from some of your posts here and other questions asked that some are finding the rule book hard to follow, and to those who are all I can do at this point is assure you that we will be constantly monitoring forums like this one and will endeavor to answer any queries raised as soon as possible.

Tom may have hit the nail on the head . . . We are new to this business and Guards! Guards! is our first game. Having said that we are immensely proud of what we have created and what we have achieved in getting it published.

Thanks again for taking the time to post your thoughts guys, we really appreciate your interest and will allways take any feedback (good or other wise) into consideration for future editions.

Regards
Leonard.












6 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Leonard Boyd
msg tools
designer
mbmbmbmbmb
Forgot to mention:

The Free App is now available to download for Andriod phones (from the App Market) & for the Iphone (from the apple App store). We will post direct links of our facebook page & website shortly.

LB.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.