Chris J Davis
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Subject line says it all. Have you?
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Joel Schuster
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Re: Has anyone played with the original cards and expansion cards mixed together yet?
You mean Chaos Cards, right ?

No.
 
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Chris J Davis
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Re: Has anyone played with the original cards and expansion cards mixed together yet?
Yes.
 
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Joseph Cochran
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Re: Has anyone played with the original cards and expansion cards mixed together yet?
The rulebook indicates that you shouldn't and honestly, given the delicate balance of the powers and the way they are shifted a bit between sets I'm unlikely to want to try it.

But if anyone does, I'll be interested in hearing the results... devil
 
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Vasilis
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Re: Has anyone played with the original cards and expansion cards mixed together yet?
Why wreck a perfectly good game by combining the cards from the two sets?
 
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Re: Has anyone played with the original cards and expansion cards mixed together yet?
Bowmangr wrote:
Why wreck a perfectly good game by combining the cards from the two sets?


For SCIENCE!

Anyway, could people please stop not answering the question.
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Joseph Cochran
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Re: Has anyone played with the original cards and expansion cards mixed together yet?
bleached_lizard wrote:
Anyway, could people please stop not answering the question.


I'm sorry, I thought my answer was implicit: No.
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Re: Has anyone played with the original cards and expansion cards mixed together yet?
bleached_lizard wrote:
Bowmangr wrote:
Why wreck a perfectly good game by combining the cards from the two sets?


For SCIENCE!


LOL!

Quote:
Anyway, could people please stop not answering the question.


My answer was implicit too: No and won't even consider doing it.
 
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Chris J Davis
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Re: Has anyone played with the original cards and expansion cards mixed together yet?
Those for whom the answer to the question is "no" should consider the question rhetorical. All others may regard the question as literal.
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Jim Temple
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Re: Has anyone played with the original cards and expansion cards mixed together yet?
This thread is cracking me up.
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Chris J Davis
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There - thread title changed to make it simple for people.
 
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Andy Pelton
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FFG made it quite clear in the rules that the Morrslieb set and the Original set of Chaos/Upgrades must never be mixed together.

Mix them together at your peril and untold suffering and blight will be brought in to your world! (that, and you'll most likely find that imbalance is brought in to the world)

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Chris J Davis
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peltazoid wrote:
FFG made it quite clear in the rules that the Morrslieb set and the Original set of Chaos/Upgrades must never be mixed together.

Mix them together at your peril and untold suffering and blight will be brought in to your world! (that, and you'll most likely find that imbalance is brought in to the world)



Yes, I know, I've read the rules and multiple people have pointed that out so far.

Next!
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Joseph Cochran
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bleached_lizard wrote:
Yes, I know, I've read the rules and multiple people have pointed that out so far.

Next!


Given the responses, you may have to be the one to try it...
 
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Chris J Davis
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jsciv wrote:
bleached_lizard wrote:
Yes, I know, I've read the rules and multiple people have pointed that out so far.

Next!


Given the responses, you may have to be the one to try it...


*sigh* I suppose I must. shake
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Our group has plenty of times and I actually prefer it. We keep the Chaos Cards seperate though as a possible draw from either. We combined the upgrades as well with the rule of no doubling upgrades on any of the figures.

We have probably played about 7-8 games this way and it doesn't seem to be that imbalanced. Honestly the added options from the old game make dealing with Khorne and his new upgrades much more managable.
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Richard Binney
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Yes and honestly I think everyone should try it. Makes the game a hell of a lot more interesting. The new chaos cards dissapointed me a little bit. There were none of those handy counters, such as Slaanesh playing field of ecstacy where Khorne had stacked an army. I've played several games mixing the chaos cards, and there has been no issue with balance.
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Jeff Rudd
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I'm going to attempt this... I've picked out the most useful cards for each race. We'll see how it goes. Rat is definitely at a disadvantage.
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Chris J Davis
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I forgot to come back here and mention: our last game we tried this and it seemed to work just fine. We played that whenever a player had to draw cards, they had to draw evenly from each deck (with any odd numbers being of the player's choice).

Picking and choosing the best cards from each deck definitely seems like the wrong thing to do and would be unbalancing.
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So have you tried it yet, bleached_lizard? I have been interested to know what others results might be. I def dislike most of the new Nurgle cards but like most of the changes for the other gods.
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Thorsmitersaw wrote:
So have you tried it yet, bleached_lizard? I have been interested to know what others results might be. I def dislike most of the new Nurgle cards but like most of the changes for the other gods.


Read the post above yours.
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Hey Chris,

As it's been a little while now since this thread started, have you (or indeed anyone else out there) had many more opportunities to play enough games with combined decks to feel for any major imbalance? I have been tempted to shuffle the decks together, but sadly I currently don't get to play CitOW enough to make the experiment worth throwing away a session over.
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Unfortunately, not yet... but we're probably doing so again tomorrow! Will let you know how it goes.
 
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Chris J Davis
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Okay, we played with both decks mixed together, and although the game was very close (it came down to a single die roll between Khorne and Slaanesh), we determined that there is a problem with playing this way, which is that the focus of each god's deck is diluted, and so you may not get the cards you want that help you focus on your primary strategy.

So although this would on average affect all players equally, an element is introduced in that whichever player is luckier in drawing cards that synergise well will do better. This effect will probably be quite subtle for most games/players, and won't affect the outcome unduly, but obviously will cause problems sometimes.

This could possibly be rectified by allowing the players to draw more cards (maybe draw 4, keep 2 or something), or by allowing the players to choose which deck they wish to draw from (though this would only be a good solution for players experienced with both decks).

One other minor problem we came across was an ambiguous rule conflict between Khorne's cultist upgrade from the base game (the one that allows them to roll combat dice) and Tzeentch's Havoc card from the expansion (causes Warriors and Greater Daemons to place corruption instead of rolling battle dice). There was a discussion as to whether the cultists should roll battle dice or not; if you read the Havoc card for yourself, you may see the ambiguity.

In the end, we decided that the best thing was to use only the base game cards, as these give each of the gods the best thematic focus (the expansion cards make each god feel more generic), but that it might be okay to mix all the upgrades together.
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Chris J Davis
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We talked about it more, and we decided we're going to try what someone posted above, and take only the "best" cards from each god's deck and mix them together and just leave out the chaff. By "best", I don't mean the strongest - more "best" from a game design perspective. Same for the upgrades - only use the "best" ones.

So the Chaos cards we're going to remove for each god are:

Khorne

The Blood God's Call
Lambs to the Slaughter
Reborn in Blood
Field of Carnage
Lure of Battle

Nurgle

All Things Decay
Festering Fever
Rain of Pus
The Stench of Death
Virulent Outbreak

Tzeentch

Glean
Havoc
Warp Shield
Warp Portal
Warpstorm
Transmogrify

Slaanesh

Demonic Subtlety
Rapturous Excess
Pleasure Shield
Dark Influence
Perverse Infiltration

And the upgrades we are going to use are:

Khorne

Crimson Tide
Vengeance
Cultists - base
Warriors - expansion
Daemon - base

Nurgle

Infested Colony
Cavalcade of Decay
Cultists - expansion
Warriors - expansion
Daemon - expansion

Tzeentch

Deluge of Magic
Magical Disregard
Cultists - expansion
Warriors - expansion
Daemon - expansion

Slaanesh

Power of Pleasure*
Power of Pain*
Fall from Grace
Cultist - base
Warrior - expansion
Daemon - expansion

*I decided that these essentially count as a single upgrade that takes two dial advancements to upgrade to fully, so Slaanesh is the only god to have 1 extra upgrade card.

If we ever get around to trying this out, will post the results here.
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