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Subject: Rules 2011 (Lehman variant) better then the Scepter of Zavandor? rss

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Sylvester Stachovicz
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Simple question: should I buy SoZ game, or should I wait for new Outpost? Are new, updated Lehman rules improving Outpost that much or these 2 games are 2 different beasts whatever rules we apply.
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Ron
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Basically, both game use the same mechanisms with a different topic.

SoZ is a quicker game (around 90 minutes or so). It has all the stuff Outpost has, but needs less playing time and the "runaway-leader-problem" is not so bad, because of the shorter playing time.

Outpost is the original game; it was there first, it has a great topic, it needs some hours to play, and it supports more players.

I own and play both, but when I had to choose, I would prefer Outpost every time!
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Stephen Buonocore
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Vester wrote:
Simple question: should I buy SoZ game, or should I wait for new Outpost? Are new, updated Lehman rules improving Outpost that much or these 2 games are 2 different beasts whatever rules we apply.
Thx



I'll leave the comparisons between SoZ and Outpost to others, but as for what is "new and improved" in the Stronghold Games 20th Anniversary Edition of Outpost:

1. Updated rules: We are using the "Expert Rules", which were originally developed by Tom Lehmann shortly have the original game came out, but were never published in any format inside the game. These are less "expert" but more "tweaking/balancing/streamlining". The game plays smooooooothly...

2. "Kicker Expansion": This is a never-before-released expansion for Outpost, which is being included with the base game in the box. Again, Tom Lehmann designed this a while ago, but it was never published.

As you may tell from the above, Tom Lehmann is a huge fan of Outpost and did much developement on the game post-production of the original version. For our version, Tom has provided his time to review the rules and we have licensed his "Kicker Expansion" for the game.

And of course, as with all Stronghold Games productions, we have so greatly upgraded the components in the game from the original, and in fact, ADDED quite a few components. You'll get Player Mats (enough for all NINE players -- it goes to 9 players now), and you get "Special Factory" counters when you purchase the large Colony Upgrades, so that it is easy to recognize when you are producing Research, Ring Ore, and Moon Ore.

We are very excited about the new version of Outpost. It will be available for preorder from Stronghold Games in late October, it will be available for purchase at Essen, and it will be available retail in late November/December in North American (and thereafter worldwide).

Thanks,
Stephen Buonocore
Stronghold Games LLC
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Timo Schneider
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Is the new edition language independant and will the rulebook include different languages like Code 777 or Confusion?
 
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Stephen Buonocore
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Timo1977 wrote:
Is the new edition language independant and will the rulebook include different languages like Code 777 or Confusion?


Unfortunately, the rules and cards are in English. Both rules and cards in Outpost are not complex. We will be providing a rules translation into German online in the near future.

Thanks,
Stephen M. Buonocore
Stronghold Games LLC
 
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Timo Schneider
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Thanks for answering that quick.

Unfortunately I don't know the original game ...but I'll visit your booth anyway so I might take a look at those cards there.
 
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Mike Helba
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Stephen,

Is there any chance Stronghold Games will release the rules online soon? I always like to read the rules online before deciding if I want to purchase a game.

Thanks,
Mike
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Daniel Corban
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One thing that concerns me is Lehmann was responsible for the hugely disappointing Phoenecia. Now we are to trust his updated design and expansion ideas for Outpost? Why didn't he put those ideas to use in his own game?
 
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Eric Brosius
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dcorban wrote:
One thing that concerns me is Lehmann was responsible for the hugely disappointing Phoenecia.


It's only fair to point out that, though Tom is careful not to denigrate the publisher, many of the features of Phoenicia are not what Tom would have chosen if he had been producing the game. So yes, there are irritating things about Phoenicia, but they can't all be blamed on Tom.
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Chris Linneman
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dcorban wrote:
One thing that concerns me is Lehmann was responsible for the hugely disappointing Phoenecia. Now we are to trust his updated design and expansion ideas for Outpost? Why didn't he put those ideas to use in his own game?


I think the thing Phoenicia did best was eliminate the scripted beginning that Outpost is often faulted for. The auction items in Outpost are not really worthwhile until you get some better income (at least 3 water factories). Tom's expansion changes this. His cards are low-powered but cheap enough to be viable even on the first turn of the game in some cases.

It isn't a huge change, but it spices up the game, especially the early game.
 
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