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Subject: Rules Now Posted - A few thoughts rss

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1603-1714
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In case you didn't notice, the rules to Kingdom Builder have now been posted on BGG and they can be found here.

Just read through them myself and the game sounds very interesting. It's simple to play - not a lot of rules at all, which I think is great. It also seems to have a lot of replayability with the eight different game boards and the ten different kingdom builder cards. I wouldn't be surprised if more boards and cards came out in expansions. I like how the kingdom builder cards will cause a lot of competition for placement on the board but still give players options for how they want to score points or even to block others. From the rules, the game seems to have a very tactical feel to it.

A couple things surprised me. First, the way terrain cards are used. Players won't actually have a hand of cards but will simply draw a terrain card at the end of their turn and then play that single card on their next turn. Whatever terrain card they play is where they have to place their settlements, so there is a lot of luck involved in the game in this way. I also found it interesting the way ties are handled with the Lords kingdom builder card. If two players are tied for first, both get full first-place points (12) and then there is still a seperate second-place scoring (6) for whoever is actually now in third place. Just not how most games handle these kind of ties.

It's great to have the rules up and available already. I'm more and more excited about this game and I'm checking regularly for when I can preorder it.
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Matt Davis
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Yeah, the terrain card thing seems odd. Easy possible variants would be having 2 cards at the start of the game so you always have a choice, or being able to choose from some face-up cards TtR-style. Those would add some more control. My apologies in advance for all the people who will yell at me for suggesting variants already.
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Bryan Graham
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Well, we also haven't seen what any of the locations do. It's quite possible that some of them let you draw additional terrain cards or have a larger hand.
 
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Lee Fisher
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Broccoli wrote:
Well, we also haven't seen what any of the locations do. It's quite possible that some of them let you draw additional terrain cards or have a larger hand.


Yes we have.
They are all covered in the rules.
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1603-1714
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lfisher wrote:
Broccoli wrote:
Well, we also haven't seen what any of the locations do. It's quite possible that some of them let you draw additional terrain cards or have a larger hand.


Yes we have.
They are all covered in the rules.

And none of them let you draw extra cards. However, they do let you play on certain terrain types or other places on the board not connected to the terrain card you play.
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Bryan Graham
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lfisher wrote:
Broccoli wrote:
Well, we also haven't seen what any of the locations do. It's quite possible that some of them let you draw additional terrain cards or have a larger hand.


Yes we have.
They are all covered in the rules.

Doh! Crap, I missed the last page. Derp.
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Craig Groff-Folsom
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What I find most interesting is the fact that there are no points scored until the endgame. Also, the fact that other than indirectly competing for open knowledge locations, there seems to be no real interaction (attacks or forcing removal of tokens). Then again, Carcassonne has the Princess and Dragon, right? These are always expansion possibilities.
 
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Michael Denman
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Do the Castle scoring rules make sense? The example on page 3 seems to directly contradict the rules sitting right next to it, not to mention the End of Game scoring rules at the end.
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Chaddyboy
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Trump wrote:
Do the Castle scoring rules make sense? The example on page 3 seems to directly contradict the rules sitting right next to it, not to mention the End of Game scoring rules at the end.

Everything seems consistent to me. You earn 3 gold per castle hex you've built next to. What doesn't make sense?
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Michael Denman
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chaddyboy_2000 wrote:
Trump wrote:
Do the Castle scoring rules make sense? The example on page 3 seems to directly contradict the rules sitting right next to it, not to mention the End of Game scoring rules at the end.

Everything seems consistent to me. You earn 3 gold per castle hex you've built next to. What doesn't make sense?


OK then, knowing that's the rule, then the part that's wrong is the example's caption. It implies that you need MORE than one settlement next to a Castle hex to score it. Oh ,and "settlements" should be singular there too.
 
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Gabriel Manasan
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"Players earn 3 gold only even if they have built more than one settlements next to a castle hex."

You may have missed a word there. It is saying that you gain 3 gold per castle, whether you have one or more settlement next to that castle.
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Neil Cook
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I'd agree with everything you were saying, if only you were right...
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Page 3 under heading "Location hex and location tile"
The second paragraph states "A player may seize only on location tile from a given location", yet the example alongside on the right of the page says "Please note: A player may only have two identical location tiles if they have built a settlement next to both identical locaton hexes of that game board section".

Which statement is correct?

I'm guessing that the first statement I quote should have something like "..per each settlement piece they play" on the end of it?

Can anyone confirm?
 
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Jeff Thornsen
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The "example" text regarding Castle scoring is poorly worded IMO. The word "only" should be removed, or placed earlier in the sentence, or there should be a comman/semicolon in there somewhere.

e.g.

"Players earn 3 gold only, even if they have built more than one settlement next to a castle hex"



Re: Locations. Each board has 2 identical locations and a Castle hex. If you have a settlement next to one of the locations, you get that location tile. If you have a settlement next to both locations, you will have 2 location tiles with the same ability.

The note is simply saying that the only way to get 2 identical location tiles, is to have settlements next to both of the location hexes on the board.

The point is that you can't build 3 settlements around the same location hex and take 3 location tiles. You just get 1 for that location, regardless of how many settlements you have there.
 
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Donald X.
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Pallet Ranger wrote:
Page 3 under heading "Location hex and location tile"
The second paragraph states "A player may seize only on location tile from a given location", yet the example alongside on the right of the page says "Please note: A player may only have two identical location tiles if they have built a settlement next to both identical locaton hexes of that game board section".

Which statement is correct?

Well they're both correct, although an "e" is missing from "on" in the one sentence.

When you play by a location on the board, you take an ability tile from it. You can only do this once per such space on the board; additional pieces by the same location get you nothing. However if you play by two copies of the same location, you can get two of those tiles.
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Paul Killer
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Let me verify it.
If L1 L2 L3 are the same kind of location.
I build a settlement next to L1, so I can get one L1 tile
If I build a settlement next to L2, I can get one L2 tile right?
but if I build a settlement next to L3, I can't get any tile cause a player may only have 2 identical location tiles?

Thanks
 
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Donald X.
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postbird wrote:
If L1 L2 L3 are the same kind of location.
I build a settlement next to L1, so I can get one L1 tile
If I build a settlement next to L2, I can get one L2 tile right?
but if I build a settlement next to L3, I can't get any tile cause a player may only have 2 identical location tiles?

You can't build a settlement next to L3, because there are at most two copies of each ability location on the board. There is never an L3. There are more castles, but you don't get abilities from them; you can score for every castle at the end of the game if you're adjacent to all of them.

Any particular physical location on the board can only grant you an ability once. As it happens there are two such physical locations for most abilities, so you'll be able to get two copies of those abilities, by being adjacent to both physical locations.
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Paul Oakley
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postbird wrote:
Let me verify it.
If L1 L2 L3 are the same kind of location.
I build a settlement next to L1, so I can get one L1 tile
If I build a settlement next to L2, I can get one L2 tile right?
but if I build a settlement next to L3, I can't get any tile cause a player may only have 2 identical location tiles?

Thanks


There are 2 location spaces on each board. These locations are of the same type. Each board has a different type of location space. Therefore, in any game, you will have 8 location spaces: 2 each of 4 types of location. Thus, the situation you described cannot occur.

Ninja'd by the designer ninja
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Paul Killer
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donaldx wrote:
postbird wrote:
If L1 L2 L3 are the same kind of location.
I build a settlement next to L1, so I can get one L1 tile
If I build a settlement next to L2, I can get one L2 tile right?
but if I build a settlement next to L3, I can't get any tile cause a player may only have 2 identical location tiles?

You can't build a settlement next to L3, because there are at most two copies of each ability location on the board. There is never an L3. There are more castles, but you don't get abilities from them; you can score for every castle at the end of the game if you're adjacent to all of them.

Any particular physical location on the board can only grant you an ability once. As it happens there are two such physical locations for most abilities, so you'll be able to get two copies of those abilities, by being adjacent to both physical locations.

ok...I totally got it!!!
It will be a fun game!!
Thanks
 
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Vince Lupo
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The rules state that you keep terrain cards "ON your hand" instead of "in your hand". Very awkward rule. :P
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Alan Kwan
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cagriggs wrote:
Players won't actually have a hand of cards but will simply draw a terrain card at the end of their turn and then play that single card on their next turn.


This is theoretically the same as drawing and playing a card (or rolling the dice, e.g. Monopoly or Runebound) at the beginning of your turn, which is a common mechanism in many games. Drawing earlier at the end of your previous turn is merely a practical improvement (adopted in some games, or not adopted in some games such as Carcassonne which badly needs it and is in fact practiced) for the sake of reducing Analysis Paralysis. (Really needed for this game because sometimes you have a free choice all over the board, and in late game you may have several extra actions to go with the card.)
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