Recommend
2 
 Thumb up
 Hide
13 Posts

Magic Realm» Forums » Rules

Subject: Quick Newbie questions rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Bren Mayhugh
United States
Bloomington
Indiana
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I know that there are a lot of messages for newbie questions, but I wanted to ask my questions in a separate message. I am playing the captain for the below questions. If there is anything wrong, let me know or anything I could/should have done differently, let me know.

1. I finished my turn on Ledges, Clearing #2 with a monseter roll of 5. The two chits are Stink M which places 1 3/L4 Spider (Heavy) in my clearing and patter 5 which places a 3/L4 Spider (Heavy) in clearing 5.

I'm not hidden so a battle occurs. I have no way to alert my weapon since all my fight counters are above or equal to 3. To that end, the most I can do damage-wise with my dagger is L* = M, which means I am unable to kill the spider. The only way out of this is to go two rounds of uneventful combat. The first round, I play Move M4* but the spider attacks the same direction of my manuever so I am hit, but my M helmet protects me and no damage occurs. I attack with Fight H6, but the incorrect direction. Is my weapon still unalerted? (I might have messed this up, it didn't occur to me until writing this that I might been able to alert my weapon after my miss). The second round, I play Move M5 and he undercuts me, but hits my M Shield for no damage. I play Fight M5, but again missing due to incorrect direction. End of combat and the day.

2. I finish my move on the Borderland tile (clearing 3), with a monster roll of 2. Turning the chits over, one is Vault 3 which is placed in my clearing (I will still have to discover it however) and Dank C. Do I place 2 3/M4 Serpents (Heavy) in my clearing? Since I am hidden, they don't attack, but would they block me at the beginning of my next turn before I get to do anything?

Thanks in advance for the answers!
-Bren
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Steve McKnight
United States
Needham
Massachusetts
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
1. I am assuming here that the Captain has his full original equipment which includes a Short Sword L*/L*. (I'm not sure what the reference is to a Dagger - all characters are assumed to have a Dagger of negligible weight and one sharpness star which they can use by playing a Fight chit without a weapon counter - there are no Dagger counters. Playing a Light or stronger Fight chit gives an overswing bonus to the Dagger and causes Medium harm - not enough to kill the Spider. Alerting does not change the Dagger.)

The Short Sword doesn't change when it is alerted (it is still Light with one sharpness star and no time number), so there is no advantage to the Captain alerting his Short Sword. If he swings it with a Medium or Heavy Fight chit against the unarmored Spider it does Light + one sharpness star + one level for a Fight chit that exceeds the weapon weight = Heavy harm. So the Captain can kill the Heavy Spider using his Short Sword and his Medium Fight chits.

The best tactic is to use a Move M4* to maneuver and then use a Fight M4* or Fight M5 to attack in the same direction with the Short Sword. If the Spider matches directions, the Captain will also hit and kill it with his Short Sword. If the Spider flips so that it could damage the Captain's armor, the Short Sword is longer than the Spider's tooth/claw attack and faster than the T6 attack on the Spider's dark side (on its L4 side, the Spider can't hurt the Captain through his armor.)

If for some reason the Captain had lost his Short Sword and was using his Dagger, then your analysis is correct except that alerting the Dagger will not change anything.

To answer your question about alerting weapons, weapons can be alerted in three different ways:
a. they can be alerted during an Alert phase during Daylight
b. they can be alerted during the Encounter Step of combat if the character can play a Fight chit faster than the move time of the fastest denizen (or Move chit from a charging character) on his sheet. The Fight chit played goes into the "Used this Round" box and cannot be used again in the same round. It also counts against his two-asterisk limit and can cause the character to fatigue a chit if it causes the total number of asterisks played in the round to exceed one asterisk.
c. if a weapon misses in a round of combat it automatically becomes alerted for the next round. (If a weapon hits during a round of combat it becomes unalerted for the next round.)


2. The two Heavy Serpents do come to your clearing because they are drawn by the Dank C yellow Warning chit. Monsters drawn by the yellow Warning chits come directly to your clearing, whereas monsters drawn by the red Sound chits or the gold Site chits go to the clearing number that is printed on the chit.

The two Heavy Serpents do not block you because you are hidden. On the next day, because blocking happens at the end of a phase, you have one phase to hide or move away before the Sepents block you. If you move away, you cannot be blocked by the Serpents. If hide successfully, they will also not block you, but if you fail to hide on the first phase of the next day, they will block you at the end of the phase and end your turn there.


 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Bren Mayhugh
United States
Bloomington
Indiana
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
mcknight wrote:
1. I am assuming here that the Captain has his full original equipment which includes a Short Sword L*/L*. (I'm not sure what the reference is to a Dagger - all characters are assumed to have a Dagger of negligible weight and one sharpness star which they can use by playing a Fight chit without a weapon counter - there are no Dagger counters. Playing a Light or stronger Fight chit gives an overswing bonus to the Dagger and causes Medium harm - not enough to kill the Spider. Alerting does not change the Dagger.)


I discovered my problem, I thought the unalerted side of my short sword was L and not L* which is why I didn't think I could kill the spider using it. I also forgot the rule that allowed you to alert a weapon after a miss. After your message, I went back and looked at the counter and you are right, I could have attacked with it and killed the spider. In another note, I thought I read in the rules that the dagger is L* no matter what chit is played with it, but I could be wrong there as well.

mcknight wrote:

2. The two Heavy Serpents do come to your clearing because they are drawn by the Dank C yellow Warning chit. Monsters drawn by the yellow Warning chits come directly to your clearing, whereas monsters drawn by the red Sound chits or the gold Site chits go to the clearing number that is printed on the chit.


For some reason, I got confused when I saw the serpents in the "Lost City" area of the appearance chart (but I wasn't confused when I pulled the spiders from the "lost castle" part of the chart).

mcknight wrote:

The two Heavy Serpents do not block you because you are hidden. On the next day, because blocking happens at the end of a phase, you have one phase to hide or move away before the Sepents block you. If you move away, you cannot be blocked by the Serpents. If hide successfully, they will also not block you, but if you fail to hide on the first phase of the next day, they will block you at the end of the phase and end your turn there.


Now I got to decide if I can defeat the serpents. Since I am hidden, I thought I read in the rules somewhere that I can 'surprise' a serpent attacking it (hoping to kill one) without either one having a chance to attack back. In the second round, I undercut the remaining one for the kill. Time to reread the section of assigning monsters.

Thanks for the answers!
-Bren
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Steve McKnight
United States
Needham
Massachusetts
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Quote:
I thought I read in the rules that the dagger is L* no matter what chit is played with it, but I could be wrong there as well.

That's correct. The dagger is negligible weight with one sharpness star, but any Fight chit will exceed its weight so it always gets an overswing bonus. The result is that it always attacks with L weight and one sharpness star.

Quote:
Since I am hidden, I thought I read in the rules somewhere that I can 'surprise' a serpent attacking it (hoping to kill one) without either one having a chance to attack back. In the second round, I undercut the remaining one for the kill. Time to reread the section of assigning monsters


Yes, if you are hidden you do get a "surprise attack" (otherwise known as a "sucker punch") in Round 1. Monsters are deployed in the Encounter Step, and if a character is hidden he will not get any monsters assigned to him. In the Melee Step, the character can select a target and become unhidden, but it is too late for the monsters to be reassigned. So a hidden character can attack monsters for one round without the monsters attacking back.

The problem with the Captain attacking the Serpents is that he can't kill a Heavy Serpent since serpents (along with Trolls and Dragons) are armored, and the Captain's Short Sword loses one of its sharpness stars.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Matt Becker
United States
Florissant
Missouri
flag msg tools
badge
Part savage, part savant, with a dash of satanic seasoning
Avatar
mbmbmbmb
Steve has provided some great answers to your questions. The only thing I can add is a fourth way to alert a weapon.

The Second Edition, rule 22.4/2a says:
"Special: He can play an attack even if he did not pick a target. If he plays an attack without a target, when he reveals his attack he can turn his active weapon counter either side up."

As an example, a character with a spear might do this if he can not alert the spear during the Encounter step. An unalerted spear does Negligible damage. Instead of hoping for a miss and alerting the spear that way, he can just not pick a target.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Steve McKnight
United States
Needham
Massachusetts
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Good catch, Matt! I knew there was a fourth way to alert a weapon, but it slipped my mind at the time.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Tomas Engström
Sweden
Umeå
N/A
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
mrb88 wrote:
Steve has provided some great answers to your questions. The only thing I can add is a fourth way to alert a weapon.

The Second Edition, rule 22.4/2a says:
"Special: He can play an attack even if he did not pick a target. If he plays an attack without a target, when he reveals his attack he can turn his active weapon counter either side up."

As an example, a character with a spear might do this if he can not alert the spear during the Encounter step. An unalerted spear does Negligible damage. Instead of hoping for a miss and alerting the spear that way, he can just not pick a target.

But if you decide not to pick a target in order to alert a weapon, you won't hit anything during that round of combat, right? I assume why one would rather alert a weapon this way instead of hoping for a miss is because this way you know for sure that during the next round of combat - your weapon will be alerted. When hoping for a miss, you might just as well end up hitting your target and not only have to go through another round of combat with an unalerted weapon - but the hit could even end up inflicting no damage, depending on how strong the weapon is.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Bren Mayhugh
United States
Bloomington
Indiana
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
mcknight wrote:

The problem with the Captain attacking the Serpents is that he can't kill a Heavy Serpent since serpents (along with Trolls and Dragons) are armored, and the Captain's Short Sword loses one of its sharpness stars.


Yes, after writing that message I realized that. So... I stayed hidden until the next day and moved away. After having NO luck (it's amazing how my luck gives me all the large monsters) finding anything useful, I decided to get a medium weapon and see how that would work. I trek for two days and manage to pick up a axe that does M* damage.

Two days after my big purchase (price x2 = 8), I stumble upon one heavy bat (3/L2). Here's the full combat. Since this was the first, anything that I did wrong, let me know.

Round 1: Since I have the longer weapon, I attack first, but since my axe is not alerted, I attack with an attack time of 5 and don't pick the correct direction and miss. I then can alert my axe. The bat undercuts me and hits my medium shield damaging it.

Round 2: Bat attacks first and undercuts me (and will do so until it 'changes tactics'), hitting my medium helmet, damaging it. I attack with Fight H6, but miss since I didn't pick the correct direction.

Round 3 through 6: Bat attacks first and undercuts me, hitting the rest of my armor damaging and then destroying all that I have. I attack, but miss everytime since I didn't pick the correct direction.

Round 7: Bat changed tactics becoming a (2/L3) on round 6. I play my Move 3** counter in Duck attempting to avoid attack (since with that counter, the bat doesn't undercut me and must pick my direction). Bat attacks first and attacks my direction hitting me. The captain is medium and the attack is medium so I am killed...

I guess it's time to reread the rules about what happens if I die!

-Bren
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Davido
United States
California
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
jygro wrote:
mcknight wrote:

The problem with the Captain attacking the Serpents is that he can't kill a Heavy Serpent since serpents (along with Trolls and Dragons) are armored, and the Captain's Short Sword loses one of its sharpness stars.

I guess it's time to reread the rules about what happens if I die!

-Bren


And the Captain's younger brother wanders into the Inn...
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Steve McKnight
United States
Needham
Massachusetts
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Yep, this sounds familiar. Bats are one of the toughest monsters in the game. Usually it's running into two or three Bats at once that is fatal, but, with bad luck in matching directions, even one Bat can ruin your whole game.

Your Sword Sword can kill the Bat as easily as the M* Ax, but neither is going to do you any good unless you match directions. While you are trying to match directions, you can be undercut and hit several times. If you have the M* Ax, it's much easier to battle the Tremendous Spider or virtually any other denizen except the armored T Troll, T Serpent, or T Dragon - and those can at least be run away from, which isn't an option with Bats.

Did you remember that each of those attacks that cause Medium harm will not only damage/destroy your armor but will also cause you to wound one chit? Not only can you run out of armor in a long tussle with Bats, but you start to run out of chits as well.

Remember also that an undercutting attack hits in the direction of the attack - not in the direction of your maneuver. So if you lose your breastplate, your shield can cover either Charge or Dodge, but you are vulnerable to being hit directly in the direction that the shield is not covering - no matter where your maneuver is played.

 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Bren Mayhugh
United States
Bloomington
Indiana
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
mcknight wrote:

Did you remember that each of those attacks that cause Medium harm will not only damage/destroy your armor but will also cause you to wound one chit? Not only can you run out of armor in a long tussle with Bats, but you start to run out of chits as well.


Oops. Nope I didn't do that. Man, there are a ton of rules to remember! So when I died in the 7th round, I only had 6 remaining chits to pick from.

mcknight wrote:

Remember also that an undercutting attack hits in the direction of the attack - not in the direction of your maneuver. So if you lose your breastplate, your shield can cover either Charge or Dodge, but you are vulnerable to being hit directly in the direction that the shield is not covering - no matter where your maneuver is played.


I remembered that. It was impressive that the bat decided to toy with me by destroying all of my armor first before going in and killing me. I guess the game wanted to add insult to injury by leaving only the M* Axe that I bought on the board, basically daring me to challenge the bat once more... Now if I could only remember if I need to search for abandoned items.

Thanks again! You have been an awesome help in helping me with this game. Perhaps it's time to read about hiring natives...
-Bren
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Vincent Lyon
United States
Unspecified
Unspecified
flag msg tools
ConraDargo wrote:
mrb88 wrote:
Steve has provided some great answers to your questions. The only thing I can add is a fourth way to alert a weapon.

The Second Edition, rule 22.4/2a says:
"Special: He can play an attack even if he did not pick a target. If he plays an attack without a target, when he reveals his attack he can turn his active weapon counter either side up."

As an example, a character with a spear might do this if he can not alert the spear during the Encounter step. An unalerted spear does Negligible damage. Instead of hoping for a miss and alerting the spear that way, he can just not pick a target.

But if you decide not to pick a target in order to alert a weapon, you won't hit anything during that round of combat, right? I assume why one would rather alert a weapon this way instead of hoping for a miss is because this way you know for sure that during the next round of combat - your weapon will be alerted. When hoping for a miss, you might just as well end up hitting your target and not only have to go through another round of combat with an unalerted weapon - but the hit could even end up inflicting no damage, depending on how strong the weapon is.
This is why the example of a spear was used. The spear, unalerted, does NO harm. No matter what fight you play, if you target a monster with an unalerted spear you will not hurt it. The same tactic may be smart if you are using a bow. Perhaps the Woodsgirl is somehow stuck in combat with a tremendous monster and cannot alert. She may try rolling on the missile table with an L weapon, but the best she can get is up 2 levels to H. On the other hand, if she picks no target, then next round she has an L** bow and can do at most L**** or T*, able to kill anything in the game.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Josh Luub
United States
San Jose
California
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I love this thread. This thread shows exactly why I both love and hate this game. But mostly it shows why I never play it.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.