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Subject: Order for refilling contracts rss

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Curt Carpenter
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I am about to play my first game, and had this question from the rules:
If there is more than one vacancy in the contract cards, and all decks are active, in which order do we refill the cards? Town->City->Metropolis? I think this only matters for the possibility of multiple events coming out. Or are all events structured such that the order of event resolution won't matter?

If this is explained in the rules (and it's not a moot question), please point out where, because I looked pretty carefully. laugh
 
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G. Gambill
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Hi! My take is to always fill from top down. Remember, you only refill the town deck with one card in the space directly opposite the town deck, and the same goes for the city deck if the metropolis deck is active as you describe. This is not explicitly stated in the rules, but Mr. Jensen has used this top down method in DS, and based on the railroad tracks, and based on the order in which the decks become active, I would always refill in order, Town, City, Metropolis. I could be wrong, but it feels right to me (and plays right as well).

Have fun! The game is wonderful, and full of twists, turns and stunning reversals of fortune! I played with Stormseeker75 last weekend, and he build a BEAUTIFUL residential neighborhood that was ridiculously high valued. I put a dump next to it! It felt awesome! Later, I plowed them all under, just for spite with my contractor card. This game is really in your face, interactive and fun, even with two!
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Joe
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We played it the opposite.. Refill such that the 1 AP space is filled, then the 2 AP space, then 3, etc.. all the way up to 6 AP.

This means in the Metropolis phase, you would flip cards from the Metropolis deck first until the first four spaces were filled. Only then (if necessary) would you flip from the City deck, and finally the Town deck.

I don't think it really matters all that much - random events are random events, and the order they come out is equally random.. However, it made more sense to me that you would be trying to fill the card row "from the bottom up" as it were, just like you would fill a glass.
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G. Gambill
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Hmmmmm....You may have a point. The game does ask you to slide cards from higher AP spots down to fill the lower AP spots first, so maybe you're right. I also agree it may not matter other than I've noticed that the buildings in the metropolis deck are more "powerful" in their effects than the ones in the city deck, and city more than town. So, that begs the question, are the events "leveled" as well? I'd have to look. Any thoughts Joe?
 
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Curt Carpenter
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I see two ways of logically interpreting the rules:
1) Town comes before City, which comes before Metropolis. Also "top down", so fill 5-4-3-2-1.
2) Clearly the 1-2-3 AP spaces get physically moved from bottom up (otherwise you'll be pushing cards onto spaces that already have cards). So you're physically putting a card into the 1AP space before dealing with the 2AP space, so "bottom up".

I think either interpretation is reasonable based on my reading of the rules. I'm just not sure from not having examined all the events and considered the combos available whether the event resolution order would even matter. I just like to preemptively answer any questions if possible.
 
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Joe
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However, looking back through the rules, it does explicitly state that you first flip the top card of the Town deck if it is face down (step 6), then you flip the top card of the City deck (step 7), and then the Metropolis deck (step 8).

But step 5 seems to leave some room for interpretation. It simply says to refill any empty contract boxes "one at a time" by drawing off the top of the nearest (and active) deck. The order is not specified.

The explicitness of steps 6 through 8 lead me to believe that earlier "weaker" payouts/events are intended to be resolved before later "stronger" ones, so this would possibly support a "top down" filling order.
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Curt Carpenter
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Agreed. Top down it is.
 
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G. Gambill
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Hi Curt. Look at 4, 5 and 6 on page 10 of the rules. It looks like you refill from the active deck first (so in your question, metro would fill first - see #5, and events revealed would resolve), then town if needed (see #6), then city (see#7), then if still needed metro (see#8) This is the part that confuses me a little. If the metro is the active deck, and I take a card from the 2 and 3 AP spaces during my turn, I would then do the following:

Leave the 1 AP card where it is.
Move face up card from the top of the metro deck to the 2 AP spot.
Flip top metro card. Resolve if event
If it is a contract,, do payout of wealth or prestige if indicated and move to 3AP spot.
Flip top metro card
If event, resolve and draw again.
If contract, do any payout and leave on top.
The city deck top card and card in the 4AP space remain where they are.
The town deck top card and card in the 5AP spots stay where they are.
If any of those had been taken, I would first refill town, then city. per the rules described above.

If I'm right, why the mention of metro again in #8? I'm hoping Mr. Jensen will chime in soon. He monitors these pretty closely.



curtc wrote:
I see two ways of logically interpreting the rules:
1) Town comes before City, which comes before Metropolis. Also "top down", so fill 5-4-3-2-1.
2) Clearly the 1-2-3 AP spaces get physically moved from bottom up (otherwise you'll be pushing cards onto spaces that already have cards). So you're physically putting a card into the 1AP space before dealing with the 2AP space, so "bottom up".

I think either interpretation is reasonable based on my reading of the rules. I'm just not sure from not having examined all the events and considered the combos available whether the event resolution order would even matter. I just like to preemptively answer any questions if possible.
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Allen Doum
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The back cover of the rules gives the order of filling cards, but describes them as "top down".

I believe that "top down" is the more logical order, but as long as the spaces are filled from the correct deck, there would only be one real difference. When the Airport or Sports Team events come up, top down would mean a Contract already drawn would remain, where bottom up might mean that it might be discarded.

For example, When the Airport is revealed, there might already be a card drawn for the 5AP space, witch would remain in that space. With bottom up, that card is more likely to be on a lower cost space, and would be discarded.
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Curt Carpenter
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ggambill wrote:
It looks like you refill from the active deck first (so in your question, metro would fill first ...

The rules say to flil the active decks, plural, not singluar. I don't see anything that says to start from the active deck, singular, nor do I see anywhere that there ever is the notion of asingle active deck, other than the Town deck before the airport shosw up.

So I still think top down.
 
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Allen Doum
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curtc wrote:
ggambill wrote:
It looks like you refill from the active deck first (so in your question, metro would fill first ...

The rules say to flil the active decks, plural, not singluar. I don't see anything that says to start from the active deck, singular, nor do I see anywhere that there ever is the notion of asingle active deck, other than the Town deck before the airport shosw up.

So I still think top down.

Correct. Just because the City Deck becomes Active, it doesn't mean that the Town Deck becomes Inactive. They would both be Active. The wording of using the "closest deck" refers to using the Town Deck to fill the 5AP space, the the City Deck to fill the rest of the spaces. When the Metropolis Deck becomes active, the City Deck fills the 4AP space, and the Metropolis Deck is used to fill the 3,2,and 1 AP spaces.

Look also on page 23 for what happens if either the Town or City Decks become empty.
 
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Chadwik
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Top down (Town -> City -> Metropolis); and then within each active deck's section, bottom up (1AP -> 2AP -> 3AP -> etc).

This is how we've always played, and how I tried to structure the sequence (though certain card effects can and will trump this basic procedure).
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Joe
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A hybrid process. I like it.
 
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