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Subject: Hello, President Romney rss

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Obama is toast:

Fed foresees far weaker growth than it had earlier
WASHINGTON (AP) - The Federal Reserve sketched a bleaker outlook Wednesday for the economy, which it thinks will grow much more slowly and face higher unemployment than it had estimated in June. The Fed now predicts the economy will grow at a scant 1.6 percent to 1.7 percent for 2011.
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20111102/D9QOOJO81.html

Cain is going down in flames,
after just recently being tied with Romney in Iowa polls:

Cain mum on latest harassment twist
ALEXANDRIA, Va. (AP) - His presidential campaign in turmoil, Republican Herman Cain refused to say Wednesday whether he will ask his former employer - the National Restaurant Association - to terminate confidentiality restrictions on women who accused him of sexual harassment in the 1990s


Hello, President Romney.

Unless?:

Libertarian Party Tells Ron Paul to Come On Over
Rep. Ron Paul may not win the Republican nomination for president, but the prospect of him running as a third party candidate in the general election is not off the table, he says.
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2011/10/libertarian-par...

This would surely hand the election to Obama?


What do you think?

(I didn't say I liked Romney's politics, it just seems likely to me he will become the R nominee and the president.

 
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William Boykin
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Don't be so quick to count out Cain yet.

There has yet to be a SINGLE election- and that's what matters. Getting votes, from voters. Not straw polls. Not national polling. Not endorsements.

Winning elections.

Cain needs to beat Perry in New Hampshire, otherwise he's dead. Perry can lose to Romney in New Hampshire, but CAN NOT lose to Cain.

Darilian
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Eric "Shippy McShipperson" Mowrer
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Well, whoever wins, you can rest assured they won't be honest, have integrity, or accomplish what the country needs. They will get elected by telling the lies that people want to hear. Once they're in office, they will make decisions based on perpetuating those lies in order to be re-elected, because that's what the people still want the most right now: To be told that the problem is someone else's fault and can be solved in a way that won't require personal sacrifices or fairness.
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ejmowrer wrote:
Well, whoever wins, you can rest assured they won't be honest, have integrity, or accomplish what the country needs. They will get elected by telling the lies that people want to hear. Once they're in office, they will make decisions based on perpetuating those lies in order to be re-elected, because that's what the people still want the most right now: To be told that the problem is someone else's fault and can be solved in a way that won't require personal sacrifices or fairness.

I'm wondering if you are joking or cynical or just very perceptive?
 
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Eric "Shippy McShipperson" Mowrer
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tesuji wrote:
ejmowrer wrote:
Well, whoever wins, you can rest assured they won't be honest, have integrity, or accomplish what the country needs. They will get elected by telling the lies that people want to hear. Once they're in office, they will make decisions based on perpetuating those lies in order to be re-elected, because that's what the people still want the most right now: To be told that the problem is someone else's fault and can be solved in a way that won't require personal sacrifices or fairness.

I'm wondering if you are joking or cynical or just very perceptive?


I'm not joking. People who want to do the right thing are NOT electable right now.
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Darilian wrote:
Don't be so quick to count out Cain yet.

I never thought Cain had a chance before, and less now. From what I read, Republicans' number one goal is to kick out Obama. How can super conservative Cain win over independents in the general election?

Of course you are right, though. A lot can happen in a year, and the first R votes are still over a month away.

Just fun to speculate.
 
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Darilian wrote:
Don't be so quick to count out Cain yet.

There has yet to be a SINGLE election- and that's what matters. Getting votes, from voters. Not straw polls. Not national polling. Not endorsements.

Winning elections.


True. But let us remember: Cain's entire path to victory was more or less predicated on doing something that no candidate has ever done before (e.g. winning early states while barely campaigning in them, if indeed at all). The Cain victory scenario is a perfect storm model; if the storm isn't perfect, I simply don't think Cain wins.
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tesuji wrote:
How can super conservative Cain win over independents in the general election?


The prevailing Republican theory is that Cain won't have to win over independents, because he will get a heap of the traditionally Democratic black vote, on the basis that he is black and black people will only vote for other black people. Because they are black.
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ejmowrer wrote:
tesuji wrote:
ejmowrer wrote:
Well, whoever wins, you can rest assured they won't be honest, have integrity, or accomplish what the country needs. They will get elected by telling the lies that people want to hear. Once they're in office, they will make decisions based on perpetuating those lies in order to be re-elected, because that's what the people still want the most right now: To be told that the problem is someone else's fault and can be solved in a way that won't require personal sacrifices or fairness.

I'm wondering if you are joking or cynical or just very perceptive?


I'm not joking. People who want to do the right thing are NOT electable right now.

Thanks for the clarification.

I hope you're mistaken. It seems to me the real problem is that people are so divided over what "do the right thing" means, and aren't willing to listen to any opposing views.

How can you run a country without compromise? We need a peacemaker to coax us all back to common ground. I really liked that about Clinton.
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Cain's website:

"The massive debt caused by liberal policies" - Liberals like President Bush II and Reagan before him?

A lot of his other stuff is about cutting entitlement programs. Will most Blacks vote for that?

Will Blacks vote at all, is a good question. They turned out for Obama in high numbers, but how motivated will they be if it's Obama vs. Cain?

http://www.hermancain.com/the-issues
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tesuji wrote:
ejmowrer wrote:
tesuji wrote:
ejmowrer wrote:
Well, whoever wins, you can rest assured they won't be honest, have integrity, or accomplish what the country needs. They will get elected by telling the lies that people want to hear. Once they're in office, they will make decisions based on perpetuating those lies in order to be re-elected, because that's what the people still want the most right now: To be told that the problem is someone else's fault and can be solved in a way that won't require personal sacrifices or fairness.

I'm wondering if you are joking or cynical or just very perceptive?


I'm not joking. People who want to do the right thing are NOT electable right now.

Thanks for the clarification.

I hope you're mistaken. It seems to me the real problem is that people are so divided over what "do the right thing" means, and aren't willing to listen to any opposing views.

How can you run a country without compromise? We need a peacemaker to coax us all back to common ground. I really liked that about Clinton.


You can't run a country without compromise. Doing the right thing requires dialogue and understanding between opposing views, not "LA LA LA I'M NOT LISTENING!!!!"
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ejmowrer wrote:
tesuji wrote:
ejmowrer wrote:
tesuji wrote:
ejmowrer wrote:
Well, whoever wins, you can rest assured they won't be honest, have integrity, or accomplish what the country needs. They will get elected by telling the lies that people want to hear. Once they're in office, they will make decisions based on perpetuating those lies in order to be re-elected, because that's what the people still want the most right now: To be told that the problem is someone else's fault and can be solved in a way that won't require personal sacrifices or fairness.

I'm wondering if you are joking or cynical or just very perceptive?


I'm not joking. People who want to do the right thing are NOT electable right now.

Thanks for the clarification.

I hope you're mistaken. It seems to me the real problem is that people are so divided over what "do the right thing" means, and aren't willing to listen to any opposing views.

How can you run a country without compromise? We need a peacemaker to coax us all back to common ground. I really liked that about Clinton.


You can't run a country without compromise. Doing the right thing requires dialogue and understanding between opposing views, not "LA LA LA I'M NOT LISTENING!!!!"

For most of the people around me its more like "Be quiet, I can't hear what Beck is saying!"
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Romney will never be president until Americans stop caring about Kardashians. We care too much about the superficial and tangential.
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tesuji wrote:
Obama is toast:
Election day is 370 long days away.
And much like John Paul Jones, he has not yet begun to fight.



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mightygodking wrote:
tesuji wrote:
How can super conservative Cain win over independents in the general election?


The prevailing Republican theory is that Cain won't have to win over independents, because he will get a heap of the traditionally Democratic black vote, on the basis that he is black and black people will only vote for other black people. Because they are black.


Come on, MGK-
There is a BIT more to the GOP strategy than that.

They're also expecting that a 'Real' Conservative will enthuse the Tea Party base, and they're figuring that the Democrats will only show lackluster support for Obama in general.

They'll compound that by running an amazingly negative campaign- or they should. Negative campaigns are very effective at lowering the voter turnout of the other side, and this is going to an election where the side that marshalls their base the most effectively will win.

So there is a BIT more to the thinking than 'Cain is black, so he'll get black voters'. From what I've seen, the Cain camp only thinks they'd get a third of the Black vote anyway- and given that they're about 10% of the population, that's not enough.

Depress the Obama turnout, however, and that WILL be enough.

Darilian
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fightcitymayor wrote:
tesuji wrote:
Obama is toast:
Election day is 370 long days away.
And much like John Paul Jones, he has not yet begun to fight.

More like Custer, I think.

People vote per the economy, I think, especially when it's bad.
 
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Fresh news item this afternoon:

AP Exclusive: Third worker says Cain harassed her
WASHINGTON (AP) - A third former employee considered filing a workplace complaint against Herman Cain over what she deemed aggressive and unwanted behavior when she and Cain, now a Republican presidential candidate, worked together during the late 1990s.
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20111102/D9QORETG1.html

nuclear
 
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ejmowrer wrote:
Well, whoever wins, you can rest assured they won't be honest, have integrity, or accomplish what the country needs. They will get elected by telling the lies that people want to hear. Once they're in office, they will make decisions based on perpetuating those lies in order to be re-elected, because that's what the people still want the most right now: To be told that the problem is someone else's fault and can be solved in a way that won't require personal sacrifices or fairness.


Someone has their cranky-pants on.

Here, have some of this kool-aid.
 
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tesuji wrote:
Fresh news item this afternoon:

AP Exclusive: Third worker says Cain harassed her
WASHINGTON (AP) - A third former employee considered filing a workplace complaint against Herman Cain over what she deemed aggressive and unwanted behavior when she and Cain, now a Republican presidential candidate, worked together during the late 1990s.
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20111102/D9QORETG1.html

nuclear


Oh come on-
Remember the 1992 campaign, and all the rumors about Bill Clinton? Gennifer Flowers and all of that?

But it is interesting to see that the Democratic operatives are taking this seriously and doing some homework. (Though I wouldn't discount one of his primary opponents leaking this, also). This is an issue where the lack of experience of the Cain campaign might hurt them. If this was a traditional candidate, like Perry, they would have carefully vetted the candidate and prepared for this coming out. Here, it is very likely that Cain simply didn't think that this was an issue, and therefore might not have a good response against it.

Its the accusation that will hurt Cain's campaign. Its how he responds to it that could turn what might just be a week long disruption to a lingering wound.

Darilian
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Doesnt matter either way, BJ.

Cain might be as randy as Bill, or maybe he's a straight arrow. I don't know. What I do know is that it won't matter if he doesn't get on top of this. If he does, then it will go away. Clinton was able to win despite much more serious allegations of misconduct. Cain can win despite allegations of misconduct as well- IF he handles this properly.

Oh, and the Ginnifer Flowers scandal wasn't an accusation of rape. You're confusing that with the Paula Jones episode. Clinton and Flower's relationship was consensual.

Darilian

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Darilian wrote:
tesuji wrote:
Fresh news item this afternoon:

AP Exclusive: Third worker says Cain harassed her
WASHINGTON (AP) - A third former employee considered filing a workplace complaint against Herman Cain over what she deemed aggressive and unwanted behavior when she and Cain, now a Republican presidential candidate, worked together during the late 1990s.
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20111102/D9QORETG1.html

nuclear


Oh come on-
Remember the 1992 campaign, and all the rumors about Bill Clinton? Gennifer Flowers and all of that?

But it is interesting to see that the Democratic operatives are taking this seriously and doing some homework. (Though I wouldn't discount one of his primary opponents leaking this, also). This is an issue where the lack of experience of the Cain campaign might hurt them. If this was a traditional candidate, like Perry, they would have carefully vetted the candidate and prepared for this coming out. Here, it is very likely that Cain simply didn't think that this was an issue, and therefore might not have a good response against it.

Its the accusation that will hurt Cain's campaign. Its how he responds to it that could turn what might just be a week long disruption to a lingering wound.

Darilian


Pretty much everyone is operating the assumption that these leaks are the product of Rick Perry's camp. I'm surprised you of all people didn't know.
 
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traininthedistance wrote:
Darilian wrote:
tesuji wrote:
Fresh news item this afternoon:

AP Exclusive: Third worker says Cain harassed her
WASHINGTON (AP) - A third former employee considered filing a workplace complaint against Herman Cain over what she deemed aggressive and unwanted behavior when she and Cain, now a Republican presidential candidate, worked together during the late 1990s.
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20111102/D9QORETG1.html

nuclear


Oh come on-
Remember the 1992 campaign, and all the rumors about Bill Clinton? Gennifer Flowers and all of that?

But it is interesting to see that the Democratic operatives are taking this seriously and doing some homework. (Though I wouldn't discount one of his primary opponents leaking this, also). This is an issue where the lack of experience of the Cain campaign might hurt them. If this was a traditional candidate, like Perry, they would have carefully vetted the candidate and prepared for this coming out. Here, it is very likely that Cain simply didn't think that this was an issue, and therefore might not have a good response against it.

Its the accusation that will hurt Cain's campaign. Its how he responds to it that could turn what might just be a week long disruption to a lingering wound.

Darilian


Pretty much everyone is operating the assumption that these leaks are the product of Rick Perry's camp. I'm surprised you of all people didn't know.


Hearing a rumor and having actual knowledge are two different things.

You will note that in my post I said

Darilian, that cool guy wrote:

But it is interesting to see that the Democratic operatives are taking this seriously and doing some homework. (Though I wouldn't discount one of his primary opponents leaking this, also.)

As I said, I have no evidence, one way or the other. Just rumors at this moment. Capitol is full of them.


However, given the fact that I've made up my mind to support the Quixotic campaigns of Huntsman and Karger, I literally have no dog in this fight. When it comes to Cain and this current scandal, I watching purely for the joy and fun of it.

Darilian
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Darilian wrote:
Hearing a rumor and having actual knowledge are two different things.

You will note that in my post I said

Darilian, that cool guy wrote:

But it is interesting to see that the Democratic operatives are taking this seriously and doing some homework. (Though I wouldn't discount one of his primary opponents leaking this, also.)

As I said, I have no evidence, one way or the other. Just rumors at this moment. Capitol is full of them.


However, given the fact that I've made up my mind to support the Quixotic campaigns of Huntsman and Karger, I literally have no dog in this fight. When it comes to Cain and this current scandal, I watching purely for the joy and fun of it.

Darilian


The Cain camp seems to be pretty sure of it: http://2012.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/11/mark-block-rick-pe...
 
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traininthedistance wrote:
Darilian wrote:
Hearing a rumor and having actual knowledge are two different things.

You will note that in my post I said

Darilian, that cool guy wrote:

But it is interesting to see that the Democratic operatives are taking this seriously and doing some homework. (Though I wouldn't discount one of his primary opponents leaking this, also.)

As I said, I have no evidence, one way or the other. Just rumors at this moment. Capitol is full of them.


However, given the fact that I've made up my mind to support the Quixotic campaigns of Huntsman and Karger, I literally have no dog in this fight. When it comes to Cain and this current scandal, I watching purely for the joy and fun of it.

Darilian


The Cain camp seems to be pretty sure of it: http://2012.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/11/mark-block-rick-pe...


Yes, but their logic is "Look who is benefiting the most!"

Sure, if Cain goes down because of this, Perry wins the most. And most certainly, these accusations hurt Cain where he is weakest. He doesn't have a strong campaign staff, and these accusations increase the friction of campaigning- a friction that his staff, and he himself, aren't really well suited at overcoming. Cain's campaign is great at improvising- but a concerted attack like this? We'll see. So I definitely wouldn't be surprised to find out that Perry's campaign was behind this.

But suspicion isn't proof. Moreover, unless Cain can find some evidence that Perry violated some statute in getting this private data public- and REALLY DAMN QUICK, he's in trouble. Three women are now making accusations. While that also doesn't prove a damn thing- they could just be that, accusations- the sheer quantity of the accusations can take a life of their own, and just overrun Cain.

I'm certainly curious to see what Cain is going to do next. More Popcorn, PLEASE!



If this means that Perry AND Cain knock each other out, leaving room for a Huntsman candidacy at the Convention- ideally supported by Fred Karger- I'd be in heaven. The odds of this, however, are almost nil, so I'm reducing to just watching this knock out, drag out fight. Pure win for a political junkie like me.

Darilian
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bjlillo wrote:
Darilian wrote:
Oh come on-
Remember the 1992 campaign, and all the rumors about Bill Clinton? Gennifer Flowers and all of that?


Yeah, I do. Clinton was accused of rape, Cain is being accused of telling a woman she's the same height as his wife. Unless that's followed up with "the perfect height for sucking my nutsack," then I'm not sure how that hurts his campaign or is relevant.
Suddenly, I got a craving for dumplings.
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