GeekGold Bonus for All Supporters at year's end: 1000!
8,802 Supporters
$15 min for supporter badge & GeekGold bonus
19 Days Left

Support:

Recommend
2 
 Thumb up
 Hide
12 Posts

Byzantium» Forums » Rules

Subject: Fall of Constantinople too easy? rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Jim Cote
United States
Maine
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I just played this again after a very long break. At the end of round 2, we discovered how easily the player to go first in round 3 could win. Looking at the map now, I'm confused by how easily it seems Constantinople can fall. It makes me think I am not understanding something.

Round 1:

Player 1: Bulgars get 2 cubes (up to 9) and attack Adrianople. They take an average of 1 hit (down to 8) and capture the city.

Player 2: Bulgars get 2 cubes (up to 10) and attack Constantinople. They take an average of 2-3 hits (down to 7-8) and capture the city. Game over. Player 2 wins.

Please tell me I am missing something.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Scott Muldoon (silentdibs)
United States
Astoria
New York
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Every player who does not gain by having Constantinople fall should move to defend it.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jim Cote
United States
Maine
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
It seems unreasonable for every player to need to keep their Byz army within 1 space of Adrianople, or to be sure to get the Emperor cube AND have a large enough Levy to make a difference. I like that Constantinople is "distracting", but it seems overwhelmingly so.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jason Reid
United States
Brooklyn
New York
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Why would Player 1 do that? Under most circumstances, they shouldn't attack Adrianople unless they have a big Arab faction lead.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jim Cote
United States
Maine
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
That's my point. No one can make this attack unless they lead by more than 5 Arab points. But once someone does have this lead, the threat is there. So does the entire game revolve around watching the Arab point balance and the Byz armies near Adrianople?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Rick Goudeau
United States
Moody
Alabama
flag msg tools
Laissez les bons temps rouler
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
ekted wrote:

Player 2: Bulgars get 2 cubes (up to 10) and attack Constantinople. They take an average of 2-3 hits (down to 7-8) and capture the city. Game over. Player 2 wins.

Please tell me I am missing something.


I've found Constantinople a tough nut to crack.
It rolls 5 dice, but remember all hits are doubled. So the average hits are 4-6, which means you need a full scale Bulgar army and a fortunate roll to take the city.

If I'm trying to keep the Byzantines alive in this case, I find a Bulgar campaign in Greece can work wonders. If you take cities, great you get Arab points, and dead Bulgars can't take the Constantinople,
7 
 Thumb up
1.00
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jim Cote
United States
Maine
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
rajungamer wrote:
I've found Constantinople a tough nut to crack.
It rolls 5 dice, but remember all hits are doubled. So the average hits are 4-6, which means you need a full scale Bulgar army and a fortunate roll to take the city.

Thank you. That was what I missed. I remember it now from years ago.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Tony Hamen
United States
Austin
Texas
flag msg tools
badge
Music sucks now....
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I've yet to see players use the bulgars as aggressors towards Constantinople. I see them mostly as a way to destroy Byzantine cities for a few Arab points. I think between Byzantine levies, the royal levy (emperor if taking Constantinople) and the fact that Constantinople destroys 2 casualties per hit makes a Bulgar attack fairly difficult. This is why I haven't seen anyone try it.

That said, almost every game I have played CN fell due to a direct Arab attack. I blame inexperienced players though. This is where the cooperation comes in. You can NOT let someone get the Arab Fleet AND the Byzantine fleet. It is also up to the player in the lead to grab the emperor so that he can use his levies. IF players don't know this, or don't remember the game is over unfortunately. I do absolutely love this game though.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Scott Muldoon (silentdibs)
United States
Astoria
New York
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
In Republic of Rome, the players have to work together to keep Rome's enemies at bay, while still jockeying for position within the republic. Byzantium is no different.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ken Southerland
United States
Portland
Oregon
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
ekted wrote:
That's my point. No one can make this attack unless they lead by more than 5 Arab points. But once someone does have this lead, the threat is there. So does the entire game revolve around watching the Arab point balance and the Byz armies near Adrianople?


Why do they have to lead by 5 Arab points. They *receive* 5 Arab points right, so technically they could be behind by 4 Arab points, take the city and then win by one point. No?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Jason Reid
United States
Brooklyn
New York
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
crowmagnumb wrote:
ekted wrote:
That's my point. No one can make this attack unless they lead by more than 5 Arab points. But once someone does have this lead, the threat is there. So does the entire game revolve around watching the Arab point balance and the Byz armies near Adrianople?


Why do they have to lead by 5 Arab points. They *receive* 5 Arab points right, so technically they could be behind by 4 Arab points, take the city and then win by one point. No?


Once someone has more than a 5 Arab point lead, they can threaten Constantinople freely. To them, it no longer matters who pulls the trigger and makes it fall.

Before that point, it's dangerous to threaten Constantinople too much, since another player can often take advantage of it and then win due to the 5 Arab point bonus.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
B4cchus -
United Kingdom
London
flag msg tools
Avatar
mb
Adrianople would only be attacked if one player has a 5-point Arab lead over all the other players. If this is the case in multiplayer, he probably won anyway. It's much dicier for 2-player though, and might be too easy. Even with double hits, a 10-strength Bulgar army has even odds of taking the city. I guess it mostly makes keeping up on the Arab track more important that keeping up on Byzantine.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.