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Descent: The Road to Legend» Forums » Rules

Subject: multiple lieutenants rss

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David Robert
Belgium
Antwerp
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I can't seem to find anything in the rules about multiple lieutenants being allowed to be in the same spot or not. We have houseruled it not to be possible so far, since it seems too powerful, especially during the copper stages. What's the official ruling on it though? Can they be on the same spot? And if so, does that mean they can raze a city twice as fast? Or attack the party of heroes together?
 
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Heinrich Keller
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It is totally acceptable to stack up lts, however, certain limitations apply:
-Even though you can place multiple siege tokens in a turn, this does not give you more than a single siege roll per city per week.
-Multiple lts can reinforce the same dungeon, but this does not let them reinforce each other when fighting.
-Lt encounters are always fought one at a time. This goes both for heroes attacking lts and lts attacking heroes.
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mister mystery
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once this topic arose: when are heros allowed to attack them and when are lts allowed???

I do it an detailed question: my heros just ended a dungeon, two spaces away from tamalir.
1 If they stay at the dungeon, travel to tamalir, they can attack.

2 if they go to tamalir directly after the dungeon, they are not allowed. But what if they train next week, can they attack? I think now. But if they declare movement, they can stay in tamalir and only do a visit action, but can attack?

When are the lt's allowed to attack? If they are at the city, "end their movement which is 0"?
 
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Ed Rozmiarek
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Liberty Hill
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The answer to this is in the FAQ available from FFG.
 
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Heinrich Keller
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The faq corrects the original rules and therefore should read something like heroes doing a move action may choose to fight any lts encountered alone their way.

The faq also goes on to state that the "move to tamalir" option from ending or fleeing a dungeon doesn't count as a part of their movement action, so you don't get access to visit-options, you don't get to encounter lts who are in tamalir and you cannot purchase tamalir upgrades.

Choosing the train/recuperate action does not allow heroes the option of fighting lts (but lts may still attack them in the OL turn)
 
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Corbon Loughnan
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MisterMystery wrote:
once this topic arose: when are heros allowed to attack them and when are lts allowed???

I do it an detailed question: my heros just ended a dungeon, two spaces away from tamalir.
1 If they stay at the dungeon, travel to tamalir, they can attack.

2 if they go to tamalir directly after the dungeon, they are not allowed. But what if they train next week, can they attack? I think now. But if they declare movement, they can stay in tamalir and only do a visit action, but can attack?

When are the lt's allowed to attack? If they are at the city, "end their movement which is 0"?


RtL pg10
Move: When moving, a lieutenant moves its marker from its current location, along one trail (of any type), to a new location. He does not check for encounters. However, lieutenants cannot enter Legendary Areas or Secret Master Areas. If a lieutenant enters the party’s location he may (but does not have to) attack the party (see “Encounters Involving Lieutenants” on page 16).
RtL pg16
If a lieutenant ends its movement on the hero party’s current location, he can attack the heroes.
From this we see that a Lt can attack the party whenever it makes a move action and ends its movement on the parties location.
The first quote coud be read that the Lt cannot start in the heroes' location because he must 'enter' it, but that is just an unfortunate consequence of the sloppy language and editing used in the rules There is ample evidence that Lts can do a 'move action' of 'no movement' and then attack the heroes.
Note that Lts who can move along multiple trails for one reason or another, only enter a location at the end of their movement - locations are in between trails and if you move two trails, you don't enter the location in between them. The same will apply to heroes.

RtL pg10
If the heroes end their movement in the same area as a lieutenant, they may (but do not have to) attack that lieutenant (see “Encounters Involving Lieutenants” on page 16).

FAQ pg14
Q: What happens when there are multiple lieutenants in the same space as the hero party? If the heroes (or the overlord) choose to attack, are both lieutenants present at the same encounter?
A: Each lieutenant is an entire encounter unto himself. If the heroes choose to attack a lieutenant when there are two or more lieutenants in the same space, they must choose one to encounter. The overlord may attack the hero party with one lieutenant at a time. Only if the heroes are still in the same location at the end of the encounter (if the heroes win or the lieutenant flees, or if the space in question is Tamalir) can the next lieutenant attack.

This is unfortunately a confusing answer because the question is poorly laid out and contain multiple questions, only some of which were addressed.
The net effect is that each encounter between a Lt is separate and exclusive.
If it is the heroes turn and they end their movement in a location with multiple Lts they may choose to attack aeach Lt in turn (in any order they choose) and each encounter will be fought independently, as though there are no other Lts present (Lts do no reinforce or fortify each other). After each encounter is finished the heroes will refill their fatigue (but not wounds - athough dead heroes are fully recovered and rejoin the party) and redistribute their equipment and/or drink any potions they wish, then choose another Lt to fight - assuming they did not flee of course, as then they are returned to Tamalir and their week is finished (so no more encounters and no Visiting). After all encounters the heroes may Visit if they are in a city (see FAQ quote below).
If it is the OLs turn then each Lt may attack the heroes in sequence in the same way, each being a separate encounter with the heroes following the same procedure between fights.

FAQ pg15
Q: Can the heroes Visit buildings, purchase Tamalir upgrades, or fight lieutenants if the party marker is placed in Tamalir after ending/fleeing a dungeon?
A: No.
Q: If heroes are attacking a lieutenant in a town, can they "visit" the shops, etc. before encountering the lieutenant or only after battles have resolved?
A: Only after battles have ended.

Actually we already knew the first answer above, but some people ask questions because they want an out from the rues, so it ends up in the FAQ. The heroes can only enter a dungeon when they ended their movement there, so if they ended their movement in the dungeon and then ended up in Tamalir after fleeing or completeing the dungeon, they clearly can't attack any Lts at Tamalir (or any of the other things asked, which all require ending movent in Tamalir) as they didn't end their movement there, they ended their movement at the dungeon.
 
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Heinrich Keller
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FAQ pg 17.
Q: Must a lieutanant or the hero party end their movement
on the same location to attack eachother?
A: No.

This is the one answer that stands out in my list. Is this saying you don't have to end your movement before attacking, or just reiterating that you choose to attack at the end of your own movement, not both sides.
 
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Corbon Loughnan
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Grubsnik wrote:
FAQ pg 17.
Q: Must a lieutanant or the hero party end their movement
on the same location to attack eachother?
A: No.

This is the one answer that stands out in my list. Is this saying you don't have to end your movement before attacking, or just reiterating that you choose to attack at the end of your own movement, not both sides.


I think it is a mistake. I think the question and probably the answer were probably longer and more involved but got messed up during editing and moving stuff around. After all, this is one of the few things the rules are clear and explicit on.
 
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