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Subject: Obstacles, other props, terrain, and large monsters rss

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T. H.
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Hi all,

I recently get a bit confused when the rules and FAQ mention obstacles, props, and terrain - because they seem to be inconsistant.

According to the rules, all of these props are...

A: Obstacles:

from JitD: Pits, Rubble, Water.
from WoD: Lava, Mud.
from AoD: Fog, Corrupted, Altars.
from ToI: Ice, Monster Egg, Frozen Sarcophagus, Tree (see rule book and FAQ page 8 + 18)
from RtL: Sarcophagus, Table, Bed, Fountain, Throne, Bone Heap,Giant Mushrooms, Tree (see FAQ page 8 + 18).
from SoB: Not clearly defined, and no FAQ entry. Might be any of these (unlikely in brackets): (Anchor), Barrel, Cage, (Captains Wheel), (Cavern Entrance), (Forecastle), (Hold), Mast. Pipe Organ, (Railing), (Reef), (Rope), (Sandbar), (Scrub), Statue, (Water/both), Weapon Mount/both, (Whirlpool).

B: Traps:

from WoD: Scything Blades, Dart Fields, Boulders, Boulder Ramps.
from AoD: Crushing Walls.

C: Treasure:
Potions, Treasure Chest, Money Markers.

D: Others:
Glyphs, staircases, summoning circle.


And now the inconsistancies start...

- By the AoD rule book, Corrupted Terrain is an Obstacle. The FAQ (page 11) changes that; however, not as an Errata, but only in reference to trap cards.

- Page 15 of the FAQ lists these probs as obstacles relevant for the Crushing Block Trap Card: Boulder, Crushing Wall, Rubble, and Water.
However, Boulder and Crushing Wall are Traps, not objects, by rule book definition...
And why is this "clarification" only included in the RtL part of the FAQ, and not the Base Game part (Crushing Block is a JitD card)?
Going just by the OL card, all of the props defined under "A" above would prevent a "Crushing Block" to be played...

And now the FAQ brings along a new term: "Terrain".
This seems to include both Traps and Obstacles, as "hazardous terrain" names lava (by definition an obstacle) and scything blades (by definition a trap) as examples.
It also gives examples for "beneficial terrain": trees and elevated terrain. Now... trees are by definition obstacles. Most of the "elevated terrain" (beds, tables, etc.) are obstacles as well... does that make the "forecastle" (for example) an obstacle, too?

So if "Terrain" is basically both Obstacles and Traps...
... does that mean that large monsters can ignore rubble and "dungeon-" water (for example) as long as they don't completely occupy it?

Also... if the overlord can chose to have a large monster affected by terrain or not - does he have to stick with the decision without "cherry-picking"?
What I mean is this: Could he chose to ignore trees with regards to the movement penalty of trees, and at the same time benefit from the shadowcloak ability the tree provides?

Same goes for a hero with the acrobat ability. He can ignore obstacles like trees... but can he ignore the movement penalty, but benefit from shadowcloak?


Can somebody please sort this mess out for me?
And if you would be so kind to give me the source of your wisdom (page in a rule book or the FAQ), that would be appreciated.

Thanks a lot in advance!


Best Regards,

Timo

 
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Stephen Williams
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Today, you have begun to play Descent in earnest. Welcome, friend, and may God have mercy on your soul. shake
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T. H.
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It just came up last Sunday, when we played our new Road to Legend campaign. We had an encounter with spiders on some kind of frozen path from the ToI expansion.

Not sure about the definition for "hazardous terrain".
Would that be all kind of obstacles and traps that can damage (= wound token loss) heroes and monsters?
Or would any kind of "inflicted negative effect" qualify as "hazardous"?
I wasn't able to find a complete definition anywhere.

Also, I assume that "beneficial terrain" refers to all objects that give heroes/monsters a positive effect - like Shadowcloak, or range/damage bonus. But again, no complete definition to be found...

I think it's more or less obvious that not every kind of negative effect classifies as "hazardous" - movement penalties, for example. Otherwise, trees and elevated terrain would be both hazardous and beneficial.

But if a large monster can ignore the movement penalty of trees and elevated terrain - why shouldn't it be possible for it to ignore spaces like mud or ice?

The term "terrain" appears in the FAQ for the first time - and it isn't defined anywhere.
And the paragraph it appears in - which deals with movement of large monsters over terrain - could lead to the assumption that "terrain" refers to all kinds of obstacles and traps - which could suddenly suggest that large monsters can ignore the movement blocking effect of rubble, water (dungeon), boulders, and crushing walls!
Of course, that doesn't make much sense...

That large monsters can ignore pits is nothing new - you find it in the base game.
I assume the relevant paragraph in the FAQ was meant to expand on this and include all similiar effects.
But it doesn't do a very good job... especially as it doesn't clarify if large monsters can ignore the negative effcts and benefit from the positive effects of certain terrains at the same time.
My assumption is that they cannot do this - but the rules/FAQ give no clarification for this (unless I missed something).

Of course, my assumption is that large monsters cannot ignore the movement blocking effects of rubble, water (dungeon), boulders, and crushing walls,
The the above mentioned bit in the FAQ might suggest otherwise...
 
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Corbon Loughnan
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First, a note. This is a very messy area, made worse by several ambiguous or flawed FAQ answers. So my answers here are mostly about what I believe the rules and FAQ say, but often with a twist to make the 'bad' answers 'work' within the rest of the framework of the game.

In other words, much of my answering here is based on 'interpreting' the rules rather than just reading them (where possible I stick to strict 'reading' if I can, but this area is just too messed up).

Sworddancer wrote:
Hi all,

I recently get a bit confused when the rules and FAQ mention obstacles, props, and terrain - because they seem to be inconsistant.

According to the rules, all of these props are...

A: Obstacles:

from JitD: Pits, Rubble, Water.
from WoD: Lava, Mud.
from AoD: Fog, Corrupted, Altars.
from ToI: Ice, Monster Egg, Frozen Sarcophagus, Tree (see rule book and FAQ page 8 + 18)
from RtL: Sarcophagus, Table, Bed, Fountain, Throne, Bone Heap,Giant Mushrooms, Tree (see FAQ page 8 + 18).
from SoB: Not clearly defined, and no FAQ entry. Might be any of these (unlikely in brackets): (Anchor), Barrel, Cage, (Captains Wheel), (Cavern Entrance), (Forecastle), (Hold), Mast. Pipe Organ, (Railing), (Reef), (Rope), (Sandbar), (Scrub), Statue, (Water/both), Weapon Mount/both, (Whirlpool).

B: Traps:

from WoD: Scything Blades, Dart Fields, Boulders, Boulder Ramps.
from AoD: Crushing Walls.

C: Treasure:
Potions, Treasure Chest, Money Markers.

D: Others:
Glyphs, staircases, summoning circle.


And now the inconsistancies start...


Good job so far, and yes its a mess. We have a large section on this in the FAQ proposal document.

Quote:
- By the AoD rule book, Corrupted Terrain is an Obstacle. The FAQ (page 11) changes that; however, not as an Errata, but only in reference to trap cards.


I don't think the FAQ changes this. I think the FAQ answer here basically ignores the first question (it is after all perfectly clear in the basic rules) and only answers the second. But even if you consider the first sentence as answering the first question, it doesn;t stop Corrupted terrain being an obstacle, just that it is treated as empty space.
But basically this is semantic quibbling. As an obstacle it has no real effects that matter in terms of movement or LOS, which are the usual 'obstacle' issues.
FWIW I treat this answer as on

Quote:
- Page 15 of the FAQ lists these probs as obstacles relevant for the Crushing Block Trap Card: Boulder, Crushing Wall, Rubble, and Water.
However, Boulder and Crushing Wall are Traps, not objects, by rule book definition...
And why is this "clarification" only included in the RtL part of the FAQ, and not the Base Game part (Crushing Block is a JitD card)?
Going just by the OL card, all of the props defined under "A" above would prevent a "Crushing Block" to be played...


Again, we seem to have a FAQ answer that directly contradicts clear and explicit rules.
OTOH we know that the FAQ answers are often sloppy.
If you look at the answer closely, you will find that the 'list' is not really a list of 'obstacles' but a list of 'things-that-prevent-movement-so-you-can't-play-a-block-adjacent-to-them', which happen to be (sloppily and erroneously) called obstacles by the answer writer. Arguably in fact, you could take the answer to say that pits are not obstacles, since they should otherwise be included in the list.

So, what I take from this answer is that this list is a list of 'stuff' (terrain?) that you can't play a block beside, and in fact has nothing whatsoever to do with obstacles as such. Ignore the word obstacles (or replace it with 'stuff' or 'terrain', or simply assume it is used in the non-game context of the word) and the rule works perfectly well and fits exactly with the known, clear rules.
In short, its just a piece of sloppy writing that has slipped in when discussing something else and should not be taken to define anything as obstacles (or not obstacles).

Quote:
And now the FAQ brings along a new term: "Terrain".
This seems to include both Traps and Obstacles, as "hazardous terrain" names lava (by definition an obstacle) and scything blades (by definition a trap) as examples.


Certainly both obstacles and traps are included in terrain. But that is all we know. Are 'Others' (eg staircases? glyphs?) terrain? Some seem yes (staircases), some no (glyphs), some sometimes yes and sometimes no (encounter markers).

Quote:
It also gives examples for "beneficial terrain": trees and elevated terrain. Now... trees are by definition obstacles. Most of the "elevated terrain" (beds, tables, etc.) are obstacles as well... does that make the "forecastle" (for example) an obstacle, too?


Maybe, but not necessarily. Elevated terrain is a property of a subset of obstacles. Just because something else shares that property does not make it an obstacle as well.
IMO the Forecastle is not an obstacle because nothing says it is.

Quote:
So if "Terrain" is basically both Obstacles and Traps...
... does that mean that large monsters can ignore rubble and "dungeon-" water (for example) as long as they don't completely occupy it?


In these cases no.
The large monster rules says that when they enter terrain, they can ignore its effects in certain circumstances. But water (dungeon) and rubble have the property that they cannot be entered. Since the large monster can only ignore that property after it has been ignored...
Or in other words, the large monster cannot ignore the 'no enter' property, because it can only 'ignore' it after it has already broken it. Until it can ignore it it is still in operation preventing entry and thus preventing ignoring.

Quote:
Also... if the overlord can chose to have a large monster affected by terrain or not - does he have to stick with the decision without "cherry-picking"?
What I mean is this: Could he chose to ignore trees with regards to the movement penalty of trees, and at the same time benefit from the shadowcloak ability the tree provides?


It isn't entirely clear, but the rules don't prevent this.
Large monsters are heavily enough screwed already by movement and spawning disadvantages. It seems only fair to allow them to cherry pick, or at least to change their decision at various times.

Note also that the rule is presented as a guideline to whether large monsters should suffer multiple damaging effects (due to having to move through spaces several times) and also whether beneficial terrain affects them. The effect of the answer is that unless they are entirely in terrain they can choose whether or not they are affected.

Quote:
Same goes for a hero with the acrobat ability. He can ignore obstacles like trees... but can he ignore the movement penalty, but benefit from shadowcloak?


This is clearer as Acrobat only affects entry and movement through. So if an Acrobat sits on Lava, for a whole turn, he burns. If he stands in a tree, he gets shadowcloak even though he didn't pay the extra cost to enter the tree. If he is in a pit, he has reduced LOS, etc etc etc.
Fly is similar, applying only to moving through stuff and ignoring damage afflicting effect obstacles (but not effects from obstacles that do not inflict damage, such as bed/table elevation, tree shadowcloak, etc).

This is another reason to give large monsters the benefit of the doubt - acrobats and flyers basically get the best of both worlds, ignoring the bad but benefiting from the good, so it can be done, so why not large monsters?

Quote:
Can somebody please sort this mess out for me?
And if you would be so kind to give me the source of your wisdom (page in a rule book or the FAQ), that would be appreciated.

Thanks a lot in advance!


Best Regards,

Timo



Not really 'sort it out', but some light can be shined. In the end you have to make your own mind up in some cases.

I'll cost all relevent FAQ proposal entries in separate posts.
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Corbon Loughnan
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Note: IIRC correctly the background section, or most of it, is lifted straight from a post by Antistone on the FFG forum.

30. Large monsters and Terrain
Background:
The stated reason for changing the rules was that "When large monsters move, they can sometimes find themselves moving across hazardous terrain (lava, scything blades) twice as often as other figures," which betrays a misunderstanding of the original rules (lava never worked that way), so I think the motivations for changing these rules in the first place need to be re-examined.
Do people really feel strongly that large monsters shouldn't suffer extra damage when walking through scything blades and dart fields? It doesn't come up that often, and it seems thematically appropriate that they should.
Personally, I still suggest reverting to the original rules, or some slight variation on them:
Every terrain effect falls into one of two categories: either it applies when a figure occupies at least one square of that terrain, or it applies only when every square a figure occupies contains that terrain. Impassable terrain, as well as scything blades and dart fields, was in the first category, while pits, mud, lava, and ice were in the second. (You could also understand various abilities such as Aura, Grapple, Command, Black Curse, etc. as falling into the first category, further reducing the number of special cases needed in the rules.)
In addition, some terrain has effects that large monster may choose to be affected by even when only part of its spaces are in that terrain (eg trees), which creates a third category.
We suggest having impassable terrain separately addressed for addition clarity, even though it falls into the ‘if any spaces’ category.
That leads to thematic weirdness in a few special cases (such as an ogre that occupies one square each of pit, mud, lava, and ice, but isn't affected by any of them), but it's very easy to understand and apply, and it means less errata in the rulebook. A few terrain effects would need to be ruled into one category or the other, but that's not hard.
Suggestion:
Replace the red section of the current FAQ entry on Large monsters and Terrain (page 2) with the following:
Large monsters interact with terrain (obstacles, props and other space effects) in varying ways.

Impassable terrain (eg rubble, water) is still impassable. A large monster may not have any of its spaces occupying terrain of this type unless it is normally allowed to do so (eg, Soaring etc).
In all other cases, a monster that occupies more than one space of any type of terrain or effect only ever suffer these effects as though only one space is occupying that terrain or effect area regardless of how many spaces actually occupy it.
Some terrain types are ignored by a large monster unless ALL of its spaces occupy or move into that terrain type. The monster (Overlord) does not have a choice about whether these terrain types affect it or not – they are affected if all spaces are in such terrain, they are not affected if any spaces are not in such terrain.
Such terrain types include (up to Sea of Blood) Pits, Lava, Barrels, Bone Heaps, Ice, Mud, Water (Shallow) and Water (Deep). A large monster entirely in a mixture of Water (Shallow) and Water (Deep) spaces counts as entirely in Water (Shallow) spaces.
Some terrain types have voluntary affects on large monsters. In these cases the large monster may choose to be affected by the terrain/each effect of the terrain independently
(pick one) or not. The choice is made each time the monster moves/at the end of the monster’s movement/at any time (pick one) and can be changed at any such time/cannot be changed once made (pick one).
Example: A large monster entering a Tree space (costs 2MP to enter, gives Shadowcloak) is not required to pay the entry cost but may benefit from the Shadowcloak effect.
If all of a large monster’s spaces occupy the same sort of terrain of this type, then the monster is affected in all ways by that terrain without any choice.
Terrain of this type (up to Sea of Blood) includes Altars, Bed and Tables, Forecastle, Fountain, Frozen Sarcophagus, Mast, Pipe Organ, Sarcophagus, Throne, Tree and Weapon Mount (empty).
Some terrain types and effects have compulsory effects on large monsters even if only one space is occupied by the large monster.
Terrain and effects of this type (up to Sea of Blood) includes Aura, Corrupted Space, Dart Field, Fog, Giant Mushrooms, Reefs, Sandbars, Scything Blades and Whirlpool centre space.

Optional addition: Traps that have effects that trigger only on entering a space will only trigger when a large monster enters spaces of that type that it did not already occupy. Eg, an ogre moving through a 3x2 dart field will trigger the dart field three times – the fourth movement in the dart field is only rear-spaces-of-ogre entering dart field spaces already occupied by front-spaces-of-ogre.
OPTIONAL Oddbits: Option A-1: When a large monster attacks it must choose one space to attack from. Attack range, elevation and line of sight effects will be counted only from that space, although the large monster may benefit (or suffer) from non-terrain effects that affect it's other spaces during the attack (eg command).

OPTION A-2: A large monster may choose to count range and other effects from any of its spaces as long as one of its spaces has LOS to the target. The space used for counting range and other effects need not have LOS to the target.
Explanatory diagram
EHEE E= empty space, H = hero space, R = rubble space, T = Troll
EERE The troll can see (has LOS to) the hero with it’s bottom left space. But not with any
EETT space within ‘Reach Range’.
EETT If the Troll cannot attack, choose option A-1. If the Troll can attack, choose option A-2

Comments:
Impassable terrain rules are clear from other ruling made previously.
Pits, Lava, Ice, Mud all have in their base rules wording that requires a large monster to be entirely in them to be affected.
Barrels and Bone Heaps all have only 'entry' effects (for monsters) so under existing rules large monsters want to and can avoid all effects easily.
Water (Deep/Shallow) I arbitrarily placed there as it seemed to work best. That could easily be changed.
The voluntary effects types seemed automatic choices to me, interested if anyone would differ.
The large monster attacks option part solves a minor incongruity.

 
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Corbon Loughnan
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4. Terrain
Background:
As in RtL, the new props in SoB are not actually defined. It is important to fully define props due to interactions with cards or abilities that affect obstacles (like Fly, Acrobat), large monster movement and similar. The rules have existing classifications as 'Obstacles', 'Traps' and 'other props' (as well as 'Treasure'), which generally work well.

It is also important to get a definition for 'terrain' - this term is used several times but has no definition at all!
Does 'Terrain' include all props? (Tables?)
Just obstacles? (Fog? Scything Blades, which are not obstacles but are explicitly referred to as damaging terrain examples in the FAQ?)
Just props which do not (normally) move? (Rolling Boulders?)
Only naturally occurring props (Throne?)
Ship stuff (cannon mounts? masts?)
Only stuff printed on the map pieces (trees, mud, water, but not the same props as tokens laid over the map?)
Does it include ‘space location defined effects’ like the bog (spaces adjacent to water) in RtLs Marshy Valley? What about ‘global’ effects that are not defined by space location, like Blanket of Snow?
Just about any easy definition I can think of has a problem or uncertainty somewhere. But it is probably better to have a definition with some minor problems, than not have a definition at all!
The following new props from SoB are undefined:
Anchor, Barrel, Cage, Captains Wheel, Cavern Entrance, Forecastle, Hold, Mast, Pipe Organ, Railing, Reef, Rope, Sandbar, Scrub, Statue, Water (Deep), Water (Shallow), Weapon Mount (empty), Weapon Mount (with Cannon), Whirlpool
My Guess is that Anchor, Rope and Captains Wheel might not be obstacles since they have no discernible effects of obstacle type (they do not affect movement or have effects upon figures occupying them in any way at all).
Forecastle is likely just a prop since it too has no discernible effects of obstacle type, even though it counts as elevated terrain (a subtle difference).
Railing is unlikely to be an obstacle because it is not a space type - it fits between the spaces like a wall really.
Scrub might not be an obstacle because again, it has no effect on figures entering it or occupying it - its effect is on the attacks of figures not in the scrub itself (this is different from the shadowcloak given by trees, for example, because the trees give the shadowcloak to the figure in them rather than affecting the attacks of another figure directly). Further, if Scrub is an obstacle it makes spawning extremely difficult on island levels.
The Cavern Entrance is probably not an obstacle because it is analogous to a portal space - similarly the Hold. The skull spaces may or may not be obstacles (probably not) - in at least one island level they are impassable, though usually they have no effect.
Everything else (Barrel, Cage, Mast, Statue, Pipe Organ, Reef, Sandbar, Water (both), Weapon mount (both) and Whirlpool) seem likely to be obstacles.
The main reason for this coming up is the ability to ignore the effects of obstacles - fly, mostly (there is no acrobat), but also large monsters!

Thematically, probably only the cage is dubious as being 'ignorable' for flyers. Since it blocks movement*, I don't think it is an issue with large monsters.
As an interesting aside, since a cage blocks movement can a (small) figure move around inside the cage? Perhaps the cage actually needs new rules entirely and 'blocks movement' is insufficient. Perhaps ...
"Figures may not enter or exit the cage prop unless they fulfill scenario rules. Figures inside a cage may move around inside the cage freely. The cage is not an obstacle." ... which would solve all potential cage movement issues 'thematically', and reasonably, I think.
The Whirlpool should almost certainly count as water spaces of some type but technically does not, currently. RAW a non-swimming figure may move onto or through the outer spaces without paying any extra costs.
Questions and Answers:
Q1: What new props in SoB qualify as obstacles?
A1: X, Y and Z are obstacles. A, B and C are not obstacles. Maybe add explanations for some that are not obstacles?
Q2: Can small figures move inside a cage since it blocks movement?
A1: No. Since the cage blocks movement figures in a cage may not move at all.
A2: Yes, small figures may move inside the cage, but may not enter or exit the cage.
A3: Figures may not enter or exit the cage prop unless they fulfill scenario rules. Figures (of any size) inside a cage may move around inside the cage freely. The cage is not an obstacle.

Please note that answer 3 is much preferable to answer 2 because it completely defines the cage and solves several issues while being fundamentally the same - unless the cage is an obstacle which fly-ers (and Soar-ers) can ignore.
Q3: What does the term 'terrain' include?
A1: 'Terrain' includes all obstacles, traps and other props.
A2: 'Terrain' includes all obstacles and other props. It does not include traps.
A3: 'Terrain' includes all obstacles, traps and other props except; ..... (list exceptions)
A4: ‘Terrain’ includes any space type that has any effect outside of ‘normal, empty’ spaces. It does not include Treasure but may include obstacles, trap props, other props and even spaces without a prop which have a special effect (like Bog spaces in the RtL location Marshy Valley). It can be represented by a marker or token, drawn directly onto a tile or even represented only by definition (like Bog being all spaces adjacent to water). It can also/does not (pick one) include global effects that are not tied to specific spaces (like Blanket of Snow from RtL location Snowy Woods).
A5: Something else?

Note to A4: Possible Terrain effects from RtL locations: Below Freezing (all water spaces are treated as ice spaces); Bog (1 extra MP to enter any space adjacent to water); Raging River (any figure ending its turn adjacent to water suffers 1 wound); Thorns (all figures entering a tree space suffer 1 wound).
Additional Note: There are four encounter rules in SoB that affect non-swimming figures or figures in the water (Jagged Coral, Deadly Currents, Howling Winds, Hungry Maelstrom) – clearly Soarers shouldn´t be affected (well, probably by the Howling Winds…), but by RAW they would be. Probably better to spell out a special question for Soarers?
Q4: What are the outer spaces of the whirlpool prop counted as?
A1: The 8 outer spaces of the whirlpool prop count as normal terrain with no movement or other effects except damaging ships. Ships can still move through the whirlpool (being damaged) even though it is not Water (deep)/(shallow)
A2: The 8 outer spaces of the whirlpool prop count as Water (shallow) but still damage ships and move non-swimming figures. Figures moved by the whirlpool do/do not (delete one) pay entry costs for the spaces they are moved into or through. They do still die if they enter the centre space though!
A3: The 8 outer spaces of the whirlpool prop count as Water (deep) but still damage ships and move non-swimming figures. Figures moved by the whirlpool do/do not (delete one) pay entry costs for the spaces they are moved into or through. They do still die if they enter the centre space though!

Note: If the answer was A1, figures on these spaces would not be considered “in the water” and thus not be affected by the Whirlpool or subject to shark attacks anymore!
 
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Corbon Loughnan
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57. Crushing Block

Background:
The current FAQ entry on crushing block contains an error which confuses and misleads many people. It also needs updating to include Tomb of Ice and Sea of Blood props.

Q: Which map items count as obstacles for the Crushing
Block trap card?
A: Crushing Block may never be played in a space
adjacent to a pit or any token (or built-in map element)
that blocks movement. The reason for this is to prevent
the Overlord from sealing a hallway completely and
preventing the heroes from ever progressing. This is a
list of all relevant obstacles, current through the Road to
Legend: Boulder, Crushing Wall, Rubble, Water. (Villagers
are figures, not map elements.)


The use of the term emboldened, “obstacles”, causes great confusion because several of the props listed there are not in fact obstacles (Crushing Wall and Boulders are both Traps).

In addition, the reason given does not make sense for pits, which confuses some people.

Suggestion:
Revise the existing FAQ entry (pg15) to the following:

Q: Which map items count as obstacles for the Crushing Block trap card?
A: Crushing Block may never be played in a space adjacent to a pit or any token (or built-in map element) that blocks movement. The reason for this is to prevent the Overlord from sealing a hallway completely and preventing the heroes from ever progressing, and to avoid the heroes being pushed into pits that cause instant death in some scenarios. All pits are included to keep things simpler. This is a list of all relevant props, current through the Sea of Blood: Boulder, Cage
(maybe?), Crushing Wall, Monster Egg (maybe?), Rubble, Statue, Water. (Villagers are figures, not map elements.)

Note: Weapon Mount (w/ cannon) could also be included. I left it off the list because there are provisionally no empty spaces beside weapon mounts.
Obviously, delete the ‘maybe’s after deciding whether or not include that prop…
 
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Corbon Loughnan
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28. Is scrub empty?
Background:
Scrub covers most of the Island map in SoB. It has no movement related affect, just a range related effect.
Can space traps be played on scrub spaces? Spiked Pits would seem very logical and thematic. Crushing blocks less so, but no more or less that on the non-scrub island spaces like sand (explanations range from meteor strikes and aircraft 'waste'(!) to off-map catapults or - more likely - tree-related trap effects (trip a wire and a line to a bent tree releases, flinging a boulder or releasing a swinging tree trunk etc)).
Question:
Q. Are 'scrub' spaces counted as empty for any purposes? Can 'space' traps be played on scrub spaces? Can a Leaping figure (or a teleporting Thorn) end its movement on a scrub space? Can a normal figure end its movement on a scrub space? Can a monster be spawned on a Scrub space?
A1. Scrub spaces may be treated like Corrupted Terrain. Scrub is treated as an empty space for the purposes of playing traps and spawning monsters. Once a trap has been played on it and left a token, it no longer counts as scrub.
A2. Scrub spaces are not empty for any purpose. They have scrub in them! Therefore you cannot play space traps in them, or finish a Leap Move* on them, or spawn monsters on them.
A3. Scrub spaces are treated as empty for the purposes of any movement (including Leaping and Thorn teleporting) or spawning, but not for playing traps or spawning. Of course, if a figure or other token (like a villager for example) is also in the space then it is not 'empty'. (delete “or spawning’ from one sentence).
A4. some other combination...

* See also the Leap question.
Comment: There is a SoB encounter which states that the starting monsters may also be placed in shrub spaces. This sounds like it may be not allowed usually
 
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T. H.
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Wow... reading through all of this is quite a task!
No wonder the FAQ update is still not published (if it ever will be...).

Disregarding what is written above, I thought about something simple like this to clarify things easily:

Definition Terrain:
"Terrain" is defined as all Obstacles and Traps that do not block movement.

Errata Crushing Block:
The crushing block cannot be played next to a pit and any movement-blocking obstacle and/or trap (both). It may be played on any terrain.

Regarding large monsters, I understand the motivation behind the suggestions listed in the FAQ proposal - but I find them way too complicated and confusing. I can see a lot of players re-reading this paragraph all the time to make sure they do it right.
Instead, I find that with the definition of terrain given above, the answer currently given in the FAQ is far more intuitive - with just one little addition: Allow large monsters (and other figures that can ignore obstacles) to "cherry-pick". They can ignore negative effects and use positive effects at the same time.
 
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