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Colonial: Europe's Empires Overseas» Forums » General

Subject: Consolodated Updated Rules rss

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Scott Fisher
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Hello-

I have played one game and really enjoy it (so did my friends). Then, I looked on the web and found out that there are many modifications and rule changes. While I certainly appreciate living rules, I paid over $110 for a game that now seems to have a rulebook that is partially invalid.

Are there any plans to make a complete new rulebook, with all the latest edits included, available for folks who purchased the game? (Even in MS Word or whatever)

Again - love the game but need to have some form of complete rulebook to play (without pain and complaint from my game group).

Cheers,
Scott
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Scott Fisher
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Another thought is that another quick player aid, Like the one called "Colonial_Europe'sEmpireOverseasReferenceSheetV_1.6withModified1.1Rules(1)" could be developed that could help in the short term.
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Tony Kotler
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This is the link for the latest updated rules done by the designer:

http://files.boardgamegeek.com/file/download/83a2daeuq8/Colo...?

...and for an additional example as to how war is played there is this link approved by the designer:

http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/737475/resolving-war-1-2-rul...

It would be nice that when the second edition comes out, the first edition owners had the option to buy the new rulebook.
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Daniel Rocchi
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BlueDane wrote:


It would be nice that when the second edition comes out, the first edition owners had the option to be shipped the new rulebook.


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Christophe Pont
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The new rulebook, updated, is almost finished.

The more feedback I get on rules 502, the faster I can bless it and put it online !
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Jason Johns
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skirmishcampaigns wrote:
Hello-

I have played one game and really enjoy it (so did my friends). Then, I looked on the web and found out that there are many modifications and rule changes. While I certainly appreciate living rules, I paid over $110 for a game that now seems to have a rulebook that is partially invalid.

Are there any plans to make a complete new rulebook, with all the latest edits included, available for folks who purchased the game? (Even in MS Word or whatever)

Again - love the game but need to have some form of complete rulebook to play (without pain and complaint from my game group).

Cheers,
Scott



Scott, though I share your sentiment to some extent, it is not the world we live in. Games evolve now. Remember the days of questions by post to Avalon Hill or other game companies? FAQ and Errata consolidated into a magazine like the General?

There is some argument for better and more thorough playtesting, but not every company is big enough to do that. Also, the big number of games being put out precludes it.

So, it would be nice to have everything perfect when it comes out, but that just rarely happens.

Good luck.
Jason
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Jason Johns
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DarkCelt wrote:
BlueDane wrote:


It would be nice that when the second edition comes out, the first edition owners had the option to be shipped the new rulebook.




Who pays for that? How many copies of these new rules does the game designer make? What happens when the first errata comes out after v.2?
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Tony Kotler
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Like I said in my original post, I would be content to purchase the second edition rules. I would like the option to purchase it.
 
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Jim Marshall
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I own several games where (probably more due to their complexity and the number of relatively obscure situations that appear when it goes to a wide audience relative to what comes out in playtesting) a living rules or v2 ruleset appeared a few months after release.

I've also playtested for a couple of designers and I appreciate the amount of work it takes to put quality playtesting in place. You need to get people together to play it. watch what's going on, ask the right questions both before and during play, suggest improvements/alterations, and test the improvements in further plays. When you take al this into account it's tens if not hundreds of hours of effort across the designer and playtest group.

I've only playtested three games, but it's a lot of (unpaid) work in a hobby where there is not a lot of money going around.

As long as the updated rules are available online later I'm happy.

PS the one common thing shared by the games for which I've felt it worth printing updated rules is that they're great games, and worth the ink (Revolution: The Dutch Revolt 1568-1648, Combat Commander: Europe, Age of Napoleon spring to mind). While I've inly played Colonial solo to get the (current) rules, I'm hopeful it will fall into the same category.
 
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Steve Carey
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Christophe Pont wrote:
The new rulebook, updated, is almost finished.

The more feedback I get on rules 502, the faster I can bless it and put it online !


I can certainly wait Christophe as I'm hoping v2 will be the 'final' rules set; I don't think anyone wants to go through this process again (so please, take your time).

It would be helpful if the changed/clarified sections were denoted in some way so those familiar with the game can focus on those areas (thnx).
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Christophe Pont
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This thread is very interesting to me, as I am deep down in the decision making of the next step.

I am pleased to read some understanding opinions, as I had a feeling it would be impossible to do anything without geting stoned.

A new rule set available for purchase at the lowest possible price seems a good idea, although many people would be satisfied with printing them from BBG. Nonetheless, if I can, I'll print some extra rulebooks.

There won't be upgraded components available for purchase, as it is just about some enhanced graphics on the box and two types of cardboard markers.

Now if I manage to make a cheaper print, the price will be lower, for the benefit of some, and the frustration of others, but I can't keep a priced regarded as high just to please the buyers of the first print can I ?



Enough mind-boggling for now. Have a nice day.

And thanks for your interest.
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John Bradshaw
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Christophe Pont wrote:
There won't be upgraded components available for purchase, as it is just about some enhanced graphics on the box and two types of cardboard markers.


I'm so glad I've grown out of the terrible "Collector Mentality" I used to be afflicted with - otherwise I'd have to buy the second version as well!

Your efforts in supporting the game on here are greatly appreciated Christophe - I'm sure that printing the rules set from BGG will be fine for many of us.
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Kevin Corbett
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Just curious, what will the cardboard markers be used for?
 
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Scott Fisher
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Christophe,

First, thanks for a great game. I played again tonight with 5 folks and we had a blast. The mechanics and interwoven history are very clever and we appreciate how each action can effect the game.

I fully understand living rules and also post-printing edits having published three miniatures games and over 25 scenario books myself - one never gets EVERYTHING right the first printing (see our work at www.skirmishcampaigns.com).

To clarify, I was just asking for you to post the rulebook on the internet once they are updated rather than several official and unofficial errata. I would recommend looking at how GMT or Columbia Games puts their rule books online for download.

Anyway, thanks again for a great game - I think you really have a winner here.

Cheers,
Scott
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D Clevenger
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skirmishcampaigns wrote:


I played again tonight with 5 folks and we had a blast.


Scott,

Do the new rules for war work well? I had been playing with the revised version where if you eliminated a foe on land (where you both had disks) OR sea they must surrender. Now the rules require you to eliminate your foe on land AND sea (if I'm reading them right). This would seem to make war a very rare thing. What have you seen?
 
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Scott Fisher
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Hi - We just played if you eliminate one or the other then the war is over. I guess I didn't read the rules correctly or am reading the wrong version - another reason why we need an official NEW version of the rules rather than quickly written errata.
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CHAPEL
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Christophe Pont wrote:

I am pleased to read some understanding opinions, as I had a feeling it would be impossible to do anything without geting stoned.


I think the best thing you could have done was to leave it alone. Now that you have a living rule set, people are going to view the game as flawed.

And it wasn't flawed. Actually the rules were fine how they were. Of course you will always have "some" people who questions everything, that doesn't like this or that. But you are never going to satiate them all, all of the time.

But now I've heard from several different people who question if buying the game is a good idea if it's in such flux.

I'd tell the OP, there is nothing wrong with your game. Buy it, play it and enjoy it. And never read BGG threads again.

I'd tell the owners of Few Acres of Snow the same thing. For those who microanalyses everything that they ruin the whole experience because they found some corner case that most people will never hit.

Games are never perfect, but they don't have to be to enjoy them by "most" people.




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