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Subject: Similarities and differences compared to other Wallace games rss

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Madhujith Venkatakrishna
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Hi All,

I've been having this on my radar for quite sometime but unable to decide. I own Steam and Brass from Wallace and love it.

Just want to know how similar or different to these games are Automobile or what games by Wallace or by some other designer might be a better choice if you people recommend anything else.

Also was considering First Train to Nuremberg, so don't want to end up with too many same type of games with small differences in game play or experience.

Thanks,
Madhu
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Andrius is Lietuvos
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Hi Madhu,
Automobile is one of my favourites alongside with Brass and Steam as well.
One of the main differences between these games is that there is no map ir Automobile. Yet, competing for car models works really well. And if you compare the feeling of the game, all of those games has quite similar feel of industry-economy-manufacturing reality for me.
All in all, if you love Brass and Steam, I think you should get a copy of Automobile as well meeple
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Tony Hamen
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Wallace has split personalities. I happen to love Dr. Jekyl AND Mr. Hyde, but most people like one or the other. His games can be split into two categories: Economic Industry/Manufacturing and War/Euro hybrids. All of his games portray his cleverness in design, but these two styles of games play out very differently from one another.

If you like Brass and Steam, you will love Automobile. It belongs to the same category with Brass and Steam along with Age of Steam, Tinners' Trail, and Last Train to Wensleydale, Steel Driver, and London.

His other side is the genius behind Princes of the Renaissance, Perikles, Byzantium, Moongha Invaders, Empires of the Ancient World, Liberte, Way out West, Struggle of Empires, etc.

The really cool thing about both of his sides is that the designs almost always come equipped with a harsh economy, where money is tight and actions are tighter. Can you tell that I'm a Wallace fan yet?

As far as Automobile goes, it is a better choice than Last Train. LTTW is actually one of my favorite euro games and is probably my favorite train game of all time. Automobile is exceptional as well though, and it also can support 2-5 players (2p variant is very good), whereas LTTW only can do 3-4 (unless you buy LTTNuremburg). Automobile is less subtle in its design, and is a very bold and original game. I suggest you go for it! You won't be disappointed as long as you use poker chips and have very savvy salesman as opponents.
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Ken Dilloo
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+1 to all above. Get this game, it is fantastic.
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Francis K. Lalumiere
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gentlegiantglass wrote:
Wallace has split personalities. I happen to love Dr. Jekyl AND Mr. Hyde, but most people like one or the other. His games can be split into two categories: Economic Industry/Manufacturing and War/Euro hybrids. All of his games portray his cleverness in design, but these two styles of games play out very differently from one another.

If you like Brass and Steam, you will love Automobile. It belongs to the same category with Brass and Steam along with Age of Steam, Tinners' Trail, and Last Train to Wensleydale, Steel Driver, and London.

His other side is the genius behind Princes of the Renaissance, Perikles, Byzantium, Moongha Invaders, Empires of the Ancient World, Liberte, Way out West, Struggle of Empires, etc.

The really cool thing about both of his sides is that the designs almost always come equipped with a harsh economy, where money is tight and actions are tighter. Can you tell that I'm a Wallace fan yet?

As far as Automobile goes, it is a better choice than Last Train. LTTW is actually one of my favorite euro games and is probably my favorite train game of all time. Automobile is exceptional as well though, and it also can support 2-5 players (2p variant is very good), whereas LTTW only can do 3-4 (unless you buy LTTNuremburg). Automobile is less subtle in its design, and is a very bold and original game. I suggest you go for it! You won't be disappointed as long as you use poker chips and have very savvy salesman as opponents.

Extremely well put, Tony. Impressive eloquence.

Tell me, what two-player variant do you use?
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Snooze Fest
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Martin Wallace actually has three personalities ... don't forget the lighter side, with games like La Strada, Runebound (First Edition) and ...und tschüss!!
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Jim Temple
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I know your main question was about Automobile, but just FYI I'm a big Railroad Tycoon fan and First Train to Nurenburg is a VERY different game. Sadly, I've yet to play Steam or Age of Steam...I seem to be the only Wallace fan in my group...but from what I've read you can apply this to Steam as well.

Although in both games you're laying track and delivering goods, in First Train/Last Train I definitely feel like the underdog, selling off my track to the Big Guys just to stay in business, renting my trains and keeping track of the space available on what I rent to deliver the goods and passengers I want each turn. Very different from the empire-building feel I get with Railroad Tycoon.

By the way, I'm giving you thumbs for this thread because I'm in the same boat for Automobile.
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Tony Hamen
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weishaupt wrote:
Extremely well put, Tony. Impressive eloquence.

Tell me, what two-player variant do you use?


http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/710237/combined-2p-varia...


Also to the person who mentioned Wallace's third side involved with Runebound. That side we keeped locked in the basement when polite company are over. That side has shamed us and is chained to a radiator until it can learn how to behave. Seriously though, I played Runebound and said, "What Is This?!" I'm not a fan of fantasy as it is, but I was speechless. I couldn't feel any of his heart or soul anywhere in the design. La Strada actually wasn't too bad, just a bit bland. That one at least was quick unlike Runebound which took an eternity.

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Christopher Dearlove
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gentlegiantglass wrote:
His games can be split into two categories: Economic Industry/Manufacturing and War/Euro hybrids.


Does Runebound really fit in the same category as Perikles, which is what that would require? And what about La Strada and Toledo, where do they fit?
 
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Tony Hamen
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Dearlove wrote:
gentlegiantglass wrote:
His games can be split into two categories: Economic Industry/Manufacturing and War/Euro hybrids.


Does Runebound really fit in the same category as Perikles, which is what that would require? And what about La Strada and Toledo, where do they fit?


Look at my comment above please.
 
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Christopher Dearlove
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gentlegiantglass wrote:
Dearlove wrote:
gentlegiantglass wrote:
His games can be split into two categories: Economic Industry/Manufacturing and War/Euro hybrids.


Does Runebound really fit in the same category as Perikles, which is what that would require? And what about La Strada and Toledo, where do they fit?


Look at my comment above please.


Still leaves your original unedited comment missing the point. (I hadn't read as far as your later comment when I wrote mine.)

I haven't actually played Runebound. Martin once told me it wasn't my kind of game and I assumed he was right. But lots of games that people enjoy aren't my kind of game. Since this is an Automobile thread, I will note that is my kind of game.
 
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Snooze Fest
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I like 'em all! The economic games are my first choice, though. I also enjoy the weuros but it's much more difficult for me to get those to the table; and, of course, I'm terrible at them! But the light ones are good, too: only played ... und tschuss once or twice but that's a great filler! And Runebound, played with 2-players, is a nice mindless game in that genre. La Strada was OK but I haven't played that since we first got it. Still need to try Toledo, I guess.
 
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james napoli
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i'm a wallace fan, i immediate will research and seek all of his games.

unfortunately Automobile is one of his few games that really does not work for me.

it's very very dry, and i dont think the auto theme didnt come through to me, and ultimately half way through our first game i really just wanted it to be over. It's overly mathy, and in the game i played the player who won was the one who on his turn literally did the math of each player, hoorah for him.

Some games, you may have a bad outing, but are willing and open to try it again, this unfortunately for me is not one of them.

Last Train i think is a better option, it's not really similar to Steam, nor at all similar to Brass.

Sorry for the negative opinion, but i dont think is should be a blind buy for someone who likes Steam and Brass, as this is more a straight economic game opposed to Brass or Steam which have other mechanics around their economic roots.

Cheers
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James
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Tony Hamen
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darlok wrote:
i'm a wallace fan, i immediate will research and seek all of his games.

unfortunately Automobile is one of his few games that really does not work for me.

it's very very dry, and i dont think the auto theme didnt come through to me, and ultimately half way through our first game i really just wanted it to be over. It's overly mathy, and in the game i played the player who won was the one who on his turn literally did the math of each player, hoorah for him.

Some games, you may have a bad outing, but are willing and open to try it again, this unfortunately for me is not one of them.

Last Train i think is a better option, it's not really similar to Steam, nor at all similar to Brass.

Sorry for the negative opinion, but i dont think is should be a blind buy for someone who likes Steam and Brass, as this is more a straight economic game opposed to Brass or Steam which have other mechanics around their economic roots.

Cheers
-
James


I'm not sure you can be able to "do the math" in this game as there are too many unknowns. You are never sure what the total demand will be. You can only calculate based on a rough estimate on how many cars to make. I think instead of dry math this game, although harsh, really rewards a player who took a ballsy move and was able to move more cars than expected. I think the game more relies on a push your luck mechanic. You will never know how many cars will sell, how many distributors other players will put out, whether Howard will be used to sell one kind of car over the other, where you will be in turn order, how far ahead your opponents will be ahead of you on the factory line, how many cars they will produce, and what executive decisions they will put or where.

Being close to first in turn order and having and advanced factory helps that player control the amount of cars others will make, and the player closest to last can more accurately produce an amount of cars that won't put him way over limit. I think because of these unknowns and how shrewd other players can be, coupled with the fact that the game doesn't take long to play gives it a somewhat lighter feel as opposed to one that is cold calculation alone. Once you play Automobile enough times, I think the game relies more on getting into the head of other players than it is calculating the "right" number of cars to produce or where to buy factories. The only math I do in this game is figuring out what my costs are for my risks. I am riskier if I grabbed Chrysler, Sloan, or Howard, and I am more conservative when I grab the other three. Of course this all depends on the game state, but I actually play more with my gut than I do my head in this game. It is this reason that I actually feel like a car salesman and think the theme shines through pretty well. (My dad was a car salesman)

If you didn't like it though to each their own. You guys may have realized all of this anyways, I just wanted to express my opinion of how it feels to my girlfriend and I when we play.
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It's about as mathy as Power Grid, which is just fine by me but not fun for everyone. You can't look very far ahead with just math, But there's afair bit you can do and if others are doing it and you're not, you'll be at a significant disadvantage.
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Tadeu Zubaran
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AndriusLT wrote:
All in all, if you love Brass and Steam, I think you should get a copy of Automobile as well meeple


Yes sir!
This topic was very useful for me to decide to finally buy this game, thanks all
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