Brian M
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Just curious after our games so far.

Playing a 3 hero game, it went something like this:

Turn 1: Heroes destroy the first spawning point and the monsters near it while monsters build up at the others.

Seems like this will be pretty normal; I don't see the first spawning point surviving past the first turn.

Turn 2: Heroes advance and monsters swarm in. We hit the 16 bit mark.

That seemed surprisingly early, but also seems likely to be the normal way things go.

Turn 3: Heroes close on the second spawn point and battle with the monsters.

Turn 4: Heroes destroy the second spawn point, and the boss arrives.

Again, I was a little surprised by how early the boss appeared.

Turn 5: Heroes work on mopping up the monsters and destroying the final spawn point.

Turns 6-10ish: Fighting the boss. This seemed to drag. Once the last spawn point was destroyed and the monsters were wiped out, the boss didn't pose much of a threat alone.

Does this seem like a typical game flow? While we had fun, it seemed a little odd - it went really fast at first, then slowed down a lot at the end.

Thanks for any opinions.
 
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Sochan

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Last game I played, it took about 3 turns for the first spawning point to be gone, but that was because we all rolled poorly.
 
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Joshua Harris
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Are you sure you are spawning enough guys for the consul? It's 4 skulls worth per spawn point, per turn PLUS any skulls you gained. AND you get to activate 4 skulls worth between each hero activation?

I am just curious because someone put up a series of videos demonstrating the game play, and got quite a few things wrong, that would lead to a situation that sounds similar to yours.
 
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Cornbread46 wrote:
Are you sure you are spawning enough guys for the consul?


I'm curious about this too.

Also, spawn placement is a huge factor in the beginning. When you're choosing dungeon tiles in preparation for the game, the Consul should choose tiles with tight areas where he or she can try to block the Heroes in -- and if the spawns are placed away from the open hallways where Heroes can enter the dungeons, it should take the heroes at least a couple turns to be able to even move within range of the spawn points most games.

Also, when monsters spawn far away from Heroes at the beginning, they should use run (lose action points, double movement speed) to get into the fray quickly. The Consul should try to spawn stronger monsters from the spawn nearest the Heroes so they have a better chance of surviving/activating before they get killed off.

Also, when the Boss is near to spawning, if the Consul has a large of pool of monsters off the board to spawn, he or she should try to withhold spawning the drakeling guys because they get to join the game for free during Timeout.

But in general, I think the 3-player game is weighted more to the Heroes while the 4 or 5 player game is weighted more to the Consul. There's some good Community based rules posted here for a 4-Player game: http://boardgamegeek.com/article/quote/8014328

Nuadha wrote:
For four hero games, I have found this to work very well:

4 boards, 4 treasures, 3 Kobold Warren spawning points and 1 Dragon spawning point. 1 Miniboss. Boss spawns on second time hitting 16 bit.

With three Kobold Warrens, player gets the number of Kobold figures you would get from having the two (or from one card) with +1 figure of each type. This allows the Consul to take the dragons still, but still get a bonus from taking a third kobold warren.



 
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Brian M
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Quote:
Last game I played, it took about 3 turns for the first spawning point to be gone, but that was because we all rolled poorly.

Lol. Yeah that can happen. Our first 3 player game we had a turn where we should have had the heroes destroy the second generator and had the boss appear, but the last point of damage didn't get done since the ember mage missed a spawn point (which had 1 health left) 3 times!

Quote:
Are you sure you are spawning enough guys for the consul? It's 4 skulls worth per spawn point, per turn PLUS any skulls you gained. AND you get to activate 4 skulls worth between each hero activation?

Yep, we're spawning 4 per spawn point and activating 4 between each hero activation - and all the rest at the end of the round. At some point in the mid game the Consul lost a few skulls since all the monsters were on the board anyway

Turns 3-5 seemed like the meat of the game; the heroes were really struggling while the Consul kept up a swarm of monsters. Once that second spawning point went down, things started swinging. It just seemed odd that the early game went so fast (16 bit on the second turn) and then the late game boss fight took so long

We did completely forget about the ability to run, which could have gotten more minions into the fight.

And we still have no idea what a room is. Grumble grumble.
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Mike M
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For us that mid point is where it all ends, really. The heroes can kill the first spawn in lightning speed but then it takes quite a while to get from there to the next spawn (Consuls always put the spawns well back as they should).

By the time they get to the second spawn we will be 16 bit due to all the swarms, the 3 hp on the first point, and dragon hatchlings with 2hp and 2 atks really pushing up the marker. The second spawn point will thus always have a miniboss on it which deals serious damage and makes killing that point take a while.

Usually around when that point falls the dragon comes out (the 8 HP from mini+point alone is a lot what is needed to push to dragon). Generally all the monsters are on the field already with the dragon. All monsters+double activating dragon due to spawn point+last spawn point behind piles of monsters = dead heroes. A double activating dragon can sprayx4 which basically means dead heroes in a large area of effect. It almost always will hit so 4 dmg plus fire burn on their start turn...GG. And that's not even including the regular monsters attacking.

Honestly if the Consul plays AT ALL intelligently I don't see how the heroes can win. At least 16 bit that is.

Note I do not have Candy. Maybe that would make it all better.
 
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Emil Vincent Alonzo
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First off:

dirksj wrote:

Note I do not have Candy. Maybe that would make it all better.


I like how candy seems to make things better =)!

jwreschnig wrote:
My experience so far is matching Mike's. We've not had a hero victory outside of the second "learning" game, in a total of five real 2 and 3 hero games, with 2, 3, and 4 players, and two different Consuls.


At first I wasnt going to agree, but the more that we've been playing and the less "lenient" ive been being as the Consul ive noticed its been getting harder and harder for the Heroes actually.

I think tho that this may lend to the types of characters that are being played... as ive noticed the best groups have had AoE and, although I hate admitting needing any one particular model for a group, the Paladin.

In fact, I think the ONLY time the heroes have won in the higher games was with a Pally & AoE in the group =/. In one game the Pally had the Burning Horn Relic and took over the AoE too!


I wouldnt say its impossible for the Heroes to win now, but it seems like without good crowd control or healing it become super hard for them.
 
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Edward Alexander
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Hero composition is a major thing. A berserker with a few loot items will generate plenty of potions if she is in position; In a game where we had Ranger (Remedy), Mage (Heal 1) and Paladin (Heal 3, remedy) there is no real "suppressing" of the heroes.

The thing to look for is control of the waves; Ranger/Druid will always earn you the spawn point/minions and let you get some runs to the next spawn location. With Remedy and Heals you don't have to be too conce- actually I tell you what:

Basically, if the heroes don't concern themselves too much with full slaughter when you get the large waves in, they will deny you early Rex/full spawns. My players have done their best when they focused fully on the spawns (down to 1) then mopped up the monsters afterwards to control the boss spawn. They generally want the miniboss for his Treasure card!

In 5 player, the team of:
Firemage, Hexcaster, Paladin, Berserker, Ranger have won thrice; they throw all their red dice on the berserker (who will happily use the starfire potion effect) to generate lots of potions from red dice whilst she does her potential 6 attacks a turn. Ranger will often snipe one of the spawn points solo due to her 7 move and 8 range (+burst if she needs initiative). The Hexcaster makes miniboss/boss trivial, but could easily be switched for the Rogue to make it even easier for the zerker/archer to get their jobs done. I have to say I absolutely hate that Berserker's ability to generate potions. But I love it too.
 
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Emil Vincent Alonzo
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Spiku wrote:
Hero composition is a major thing. A berserker with a few loot items will generate plenty of potions if she is in position; In a game where we had Ranger (Remedy), Mage (Heal 1) and Paladin (Heal 3, remedy) there is no real "suppressing" of the heroes.

The thing to look for is control of the waves; Ranger/Druid will always earn you the spawn point/minions and let you get some runs to the next spawn location. With Remedy and Heals you don't have to be too conce- actually I tell you what:

Basically, if the heroes don't concern themselves too much with full slaughter when you get the large waves in, they will deny you early Rex/full spawns. My players have done their best when they focused fully on the spawns (down to 1) then mopped up the monsters afterwards to control the boss spawn. They generally want the miniboss for his Treasure card!

In 5 player, the team of:
Firemage, Hexcaster, Paladin, Berserker, Ranger have won thrice; they throw all their red dice on the berserker (who will happily use the starfire potion effect) to generate lots of potions from red dice whilst she does her potential 6 attacks a turn. Ranger will often snipe one of the spawn points solo due to her 7 move and 8 range (+burst if she needs initiative). The Hexcaster makes miniboss/boss trivial, but could easily be switched for the Rogue to make it even easier for the zerker/archer to get their jobs done. I have to say I absolutely hate that Berserker's ability to generate potions. But I love it too.


Just to add to this... as much as I want to love the Hexcaster... a lucky loot/relic pull and you dont even need her! I posted a game in the "sessions" section of this forum where the Ranger got a card that caused "Immobile" and pretty much took the place of a long range lock down character!
 
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Mike M
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The trouble with the hexcaster is that she isnt nearly as effective as she seems. She is great for nerfing the dragon. She is ok for nerfing the dragonlings and flying drakes (though they still roll enough dice with knockdown that they are effective).

But otherwise she fails for two reasons:

a) She does damage with her status effect powers. Strange though it seems this really is a problem. If she didn't do damage she could nerf a model and then the heros could try to ignore that model for the rest of the game saving bumps on the track.

b) Mob. Removing the top roll from the priest and ogre is nice but with proper mobbing they roll so many dice it hardly matters. They are still going to hit. The priest is just as effective mobbing with piles of blue dice+aura as he is ranged attacking.

It's probably a bad choice to bring her in a 3man party since she really is only there for the boss and can't AE or heal. In a 5man you should be pulling so much treasure that you are likely to get some sort of decent status effect for a more effective AE hero.
 
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