Paul Sauberer
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http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2012/01/05/new-law-requires-phot...

That's got to be the only reason, right?
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Psauberer wrote:


What exactly does your subject have to do with the article you linked to?

Are you suggesting that minorities and the poor don't have government ID?
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Boaty McBoatface
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Psauberer wrote:


I was not aware that the right to clean drains was guaranteed under the constitution, which clause?
 
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Boaty McBoatface
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COMPNOR wrote:
Psauberer wrote:


What exactly does your subject have to do with the article you linked to?

Are you suggesting that minorities and the poor don't have government ID?


He is (I think) refering to this http://phoenix.about.com/od/citiestownsgovernment/a/voterid...., the claim was this would prevent minorities and the poor voting.
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slatersteven wrote:
COMPNOR wrote:
Psauberer wrote:


What exactly does your subject have to do with the article you linked to?

Are you suggesting that minorities and the poor don't have government ID?


He is (I think) refering to this http://phoenix.about.com/od/citiestownsgovernment/a/voterid...., the claim was this would prevent minorities and the poor voting.


So poor/minorities don't have ID with their address on it?
 
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Boaty McBoatface
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COMPNOR wrote:
slatersteven wrote:
COMPNOR wrote:
Psauberer wrote:


What exactly does your subject have to do with the article you linked to?

Are you suggesting that minorities and the poor don't have government ID?


He is (I think) refering to this http://phoenix.about.com/od/citiestownsgovernment/a/voterid...., the claim was this would prevent minorities and the poor voting.


So poor/minorities don't have ID with their address on it?


Irrelevant as their constitutional rights are not being ignored. Also there are non Caustic drain cleaners, so they are not being stoped from cleaning thier drains. However http://www4.uwm.edu/eti/2007/VoterID.htm seems to say that yes there are many people who might not have the required ID.
 
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Dan Schaeffer
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OK, the subject is a funny little dig, but ultimately, the story is about a classic legislative overreaction that results in a bad solution to a non-problem.
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Paul Sauberer
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slatersteven wrote:
COMPNOR wrote:
Psauberer wrote:


What exactly does your subject have to do with the article you linked to?

Are you suggesting that minorities and the poor don't have government ID?


He is (I think) refering to this http://phoenix.about.com/od/citiestownsgovernment/a/voterid...., the claim was this would prevent minorities and the poor voting.


So you think it's OK to write laws that deny things to minorities and the poor as long as what's being denied isn't a constitutional right?
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Rich Shipley
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COMPNOR wrote:
So poor/minorities don't have ID with their address on it?


They often don't have photo IDs that comply with the new voter laws. That's pretty much the point of the laws. It is possible to reform voting on a non-partisan basis (I think Rhode Island did), but most of these are just voter supression tactics.

edit: Whoops, I should have read the article first. This was just a dumb idea, possibly inspired by other dumb ideas. I ony have a photo ID because I drive, many people don't.
 
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Boaty McBoatface
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Psauberer wrote:
slatersteven wrote:
COMPNOR wrote:
Psauberer wrote:


What exactly does your subject have to do with the article you linked to?

Are you suggesting that minorities and the poor don't have government ID?


He is (I think) refering to this http://phoenix.about.com/od/citiestownsgovernment/a/voterid...., the claim was this would prevent minorities and the poor voting.


So you think it's OK to write laws that deny things to minorities and the poor as long as what's being denied isn't a constitutional right?


No I am saying that the two are not comparable, besides as I have pointed out they are not being stoped from cleaning thier drains, just from using one type of product. So in fact the point should be "Why do Illinois Democrats want minorities and the poor to not use caustic soda".
 
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Christopher Dearlove
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Golux13 wrote:
OK, the subject is a funny little dig, but ultimately, the story is about a classic legislative overreaction that results in a bad solution to a non-problem.


Politician's Syllogism:

Something must be done.
This is something.
Therefore it must be done.
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COMPNOR wrote:

So poor/minorities don't have ID with their address on it?


I don't know what the situation is like that side of the Atlantic, but over here the poor typically have to change address far more often than others. They may also find that the cost of new photo ID each time they move is a problem (they are poor!)

So requesting photo id with a current address may well discriminate against them.
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Psauberer wrote:

So you think it's OK to write laws that deny things to minorities and the poor as long as what's being denied isn't a constitutional right?


Absolutely that's okay. The number of pedophiles is dwarfed by the number of non-pedophiles. At least as far as we know.... Of course, the really rich ones will just buy their way out of trouble, so there you go, laws that deny things to not only minorities, but poor members of minorities. And all perfectly okay!
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Chad Ellis
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The OP makes a fair point. Some articles criticizing Republican pushes for requiring photo ID assume that the only possible reason is to reduce the number of Democratic voters (since it's well-established that a much larger percentage of people who don't have said IDs vote Democrat than Republican). If that were literally true then it would follow that the basis for this law was to target the same group.

I do think, though, that it's hard to believe that voter advantage isn't playing a significant role in these ID measures. As an example of another change, Florida has long allowed early voting on the Saturday and Sunday before election day. Now they have changed the law so that early voting is only allowed on the Saturday. Could the reason have anything to do with the fact that black churches rally their congregations to go vote during the service on the Sunday before election day?

Naw.

(Oh, and this law is absurd.)
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Chad Ellis
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COMPNOR wrote:
So poor/minorities don't have ID with their address on it?


Many don't. Not everyone needs a photo ID for their daily life and it's been thoroughly documented that the population of citizens who don't have a driver's license (or other state-issued photo ID) are much more likely to be poor, urban and...wait for it...vote for Democrats.
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Chad_Ellis wrote:
COMPNOR wrote:
So poor/minorities don't have ID with their address on it?


Many don't. Not everyone needs a photo ID for their daily life and it's been thoroughly documented that the population of citizens who don't have a driver's license (or other state-issued photo ID) are much more likely to be poor, urban and...wait for it...vote for Democrats.


Just and interesting FYI, I have a bad cold and my mother went into the store to get me some NyQuil and couldn't buy it because she didn't have her drivers license nor a state ID card on her. She had to come back out to the car to get her purse and go back in. (She had run in with just some cash)

So it is getting harder to live without one in many ways.
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Dan Schaeffer
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Meerkat wrote:
Chad_Ellis wrote:
COMPNOR wrote:
So poor/minorities don't have ID with their address on it?


Many don't. Not everyone needs a photo ID for their daily life and it's been thoroughly documented that the population of citizens who don't have a driver's license (or other state-issued photo ID) are much more likely to be poor, urban and...wait for it...vote for Democrats.


Just and interesting FYI, I have a bad cold and my mother went into the store to get me some NyQuil and couldn't buy it because she didn't have her drivers license nor a state ID card on her. She had to come back out to the car to get her purse and go back in. (She had run in with just some cash)

So it is getting harder to live without one in many ways.


That, by the way, is the result of another, similar law passed because some people did some bad thing with some cough suppressant once, so some politician decided the best way to prevent people from doing the bad thing was to make it much more burdensome for people with coughs to get legal, over-the-counter medicine.

Where are all the nanny-state complaints when some "tough-on-crime" legislator proves his testicular fortitude by pushing through these sorts of laws?
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Voter suppression is not a joke.

The Republican's Party are actively trying to take away the rights of *some people* that they do not agree with.

These are the same folks who in the last election ran on a 'jobs' platform, but instead of making jobs, they have legislated against workers by taking away their bargaining rights. Instead of making jobs, they have legislated against voter rights. And instead of making jobs, they have legislated against abortion rights.

It's the same story we have heard many times over: The Republican's Party will tell you one thing, and then do an entirely different thing.

Think about that, Republican's Party Voters, and if yer not too chickenshit about it, tell me why you continue to vote for those Complete Fucking Assholes.
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Paul W
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49xjohn wrote:
Think about that, Republican's Party Voters, and if yer not too chickenshit about it, tell me why you continue to vote for those Complete Fucking Assholes.


I'm happy to engage with anyone that's willing to make an honest attempt to see things from another's point of view.
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Ed Holzman
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Chad_Ellis wrote:
As an example of another change, Florida has long allowed early voting on the Saturday and Sunday before election day. Now they have changed the law so that early voting is only allowed on the Saturday. Could the reason have anything to do with the fact that black churches rally their congregations to go vote during the service on the Sunday before election day?

This is a misleading argument since Florida law allows early voting beginning 10 days before an election...see the link below to visit the Florida Division of Elections for more info.

http://election.dos.state.fl.us/voting/early.shtml

If you don't wish to leave here...

The Florida Division of Elections wrote:
How to Early Vote

Early voting begins 10 days before an election and ends on the 3rd day before any election in which there is a state or federal office race. Early voting may be held for a maximum of 12 hours, but no less than 6 hours, a day. The hours for each day for each early voting site during that period are set at the Supervisor’s discretion. Supervisors of Elections designate early voting sites 30 days prior to an election. Early voting is held in the main or branch office of the Supervisor of Elections. Supervisors may also designate any city hall or public library geographically located so that all voters in the county will have an equal opportunity to cast a vote. Please contact your Supervisor of Elections for dates, times and location. Voters who want to vote early should present the following at the early voting site:

a valid photo identification; and
a signature identification.


Those black congregations can certainly rally on Sunday the week before the election if they want their members to vote early on a Sunday. The Huffington Post really should do better research before resorting to the race card.

On a side note, I have utilized early voting for a long time in order to avoid the crowds on election day and I have seen a mixture of folks of all types at the early voting sites. But my anecdotal, first hand experience will shortly be pooh-poohed here.
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