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Subject: Some Rules and Strat question rss

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Mike Romeo
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First, if I put Influence, I can't take out (or take off what should I say?) Influences from my opponent instead like in 1960: M o t President right? The only way to take out (off) opponent's influences are via realignement or coup right?

Second, If during a put influence action, I put an influence on an empty adjacent country, during the same action round (with the remaining influences), I cant put influence on a country solely adjacent to the newly aquired country? I have to wait for the NEXT action round rigth?

Third, to dominate a continent you need more battleground countries, more countries and at least one of each (non and battleground country) right? So I have 4 BG and 1 NON-BG and my opponent have 1 BG and 3 Non-BG I Dominate right? If it's equal (like 4 BG 1 non-Bg to 1 bg 4 non bg) Both have presence right?

For a control thougt, it is not specificated if a non-bg is required? only all BG and more then opponents (which I think is automatic since and don't think an opponent would have that much non-bg?) But I've only played once so what do I know! So what about a non-bg?

Also what are your strategies relating to non-bg countries???

And, I don't really get the purpose of headlines? When I reading the rules I though the first in headlines would go first for the whole turn (that would have been a nice mechanic) but USSR always play first right? For every action rounds? So what's with the headlines strategicly speaking? The only way for the US player to go first in the game?

What is so important with headlines?

At last, earlier I've read a post where this was written :
''Later on (turn 4 or 5??), after 4 hours investment, as the USSR last action, Ask Not What Your Country Can Do... was played. In my hand I had a USSR event and SouthEast Asia scoring. I was 1 VP ahead in SEA so I decided to keep the scoring card, discard the other card and draw another. I drew Central American Scoring! Looked in FAQ - game over!!!!''

and I just don't understand why the game would end? Because he HAD to keep a scoring card and could not?

Thank you!

 
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Mr. Stabs
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1) True. If you are placing influence, you're just adding, not taking away your opponent's influence.

2) True. You can only place influence based on board position at the beginning of a play.

3) True. More BGs, more total countries, and 1+ non-BGs. Both have presence.

4) I think so. It's a rare thing to have control without a BG, but I think if you have all the BGs you have control.
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Mr. Stabs
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Regarding the non-rule questions - headlines are a way to make interesting plays. The USSR can use it to have a 1-2 punch card combo since they go first. The US can use it to catch the USSR off-guard.

You can also only use events during the Headline, so there's that.

Regarding the scoring card post - he would have lost because he only had one action round left to play 2 scoring cards. Only one card could be played, and once the other was held, he would lose because of rule 8.something. The rule that says "You can't hold scoring cards ever."
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Mr. Stabs
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FreeHansje wrote:
Ziilch wrote:

SNIP!

You can also only use events during the Headline, so there's that.


SNIP!


Woa! I'm new to TS and dont have the rules handy tight now: I thought you can choose to use the operation point value OR the text?!?


Nope. I just double-checked the rules file on the game page to make sure. Headlines are event-only. You can play Scoring cards during the headline, and some events let you use operations (like ABM Treaty), but you can't play an event and use it for ops.

EDIT: It's section 4.5.C in the rules file.
 
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Jeff K
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FreeHansje wrote:
Ziilch wrote:

SNIP!

You can also only use events during the Headline, so there's that.


SNIP!


Woa! I'm new to TS and dont have the rules handy tight now: I thought you can choose to use the operation point value OR the text?!?


No. Only the event takes place, you can never choose to do Ops unless it specifically states it as part of the Event:

"Unless the headline event specifically refers to availability of
operations points, neither player receives operations points
from cards played during the headline phase."
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Sam Carroll
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Ziilch is correct with his answers.

KingAnus3 wrote:
Also what are your strategies relating to non-bg countries???

It depends on the country. Norway, for example, isn't much good to anyone. But some non-BGs are very important, if they give access to BGs or provide modifiers to realignments. For example, Nicaragua and Haiti could give the US positive modifiers for realigning the USSR out of Cuba. Burma is good to have in case of Indo-Pakistani War. Also remember that any countries adjacent to enemy superpowers give one point when their scoring card is played. So if the US can grab Afghanistan or Finland, they could get a good payback.

Quote:
And, I don't really get the purpose of headlines? When I reading the rules I though the first in headlines would go first for the whole turn (that would have been a nice mechanic) but USSR always play first right? For every action rounds? So what's with the headlines strategicly speaking? The only way for the US player to go first in the game?


It gives you a chance to what amounts to two actions in a row. For example, if the USSR plays a card giving them influence in Central America during the action rounds, the US might just coup or realign them out. But if they play it in the headline phase, they can spread out before the US gets a chance to respond. The US can also use it in a similar fashion, since they get the last action round in the previous turn then get to play a headline. Or the US might try playing a headline that the USSR will want to respond to in their first action round, so that they won't be able to make their first-round-coup as usual.

Quote:
At last, earlier I've read a post where this was written :
''Later on (turn 4 or 5??), after 4 hours investment, as the USSR last action, Ask Not What Your Country Can Do... was played. In my hand I had a USSR event and SouthEast Asia scoring. I was 1 VP ahead in SEA so I decided to keep the scoring card, discard the other card and draw another. I drew Central American Scoring! Looked in FAQ - game over!!!!''

and I just don't understand why the game would end? Because he HAD to keep a scoring card and could not?


Yup. See on the bottom of each scoring card where it says, "May not be held." It's rare that you could be forced to hold one - Ask Not is the only way that comes to mind, though there might be others. In this case, the player took a risk by keeping the scoring card and ditching the other, and it didn't work out.
 
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Jeff K
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spartax wrote:
It's rare that you could be forced to hold one - Ask Not is the only way that comes to mind, though there might be others.


I do not believe you can ever be forced to hold a scoring card, certainly not by an event:

"10.1.5 A player may not be forced to Hold a Scoring Card through
the effects of an Event(s)."
 
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Mr. Stabs
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Xookliba wrote:
spartax wrote:
It's rare that you could be forced to hold one - Ask Not is the only way that comes to mind, though there might be others.


I do not believe you can ever be forced to hold a scoring card, certainly not by an event:

"10.1.5 A player may not be forced to Hold a Scoring Card through
the effects of an Event(s)."


That rule is more in reference to situations like when you get Missile Envy played against you near the end of a round and have to play it and a scoring card as your last action. In that situation you would play the scoring card and then play ME as your first AR of the next turn.
 
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Jeff K
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Ziilch wrote:
Xookliba wrote:
spartax wrote:
It's rare that you could be forced to hold one - Ask Not is the only way that comes to mind, though there might be others.


I do not believe you can ever be forced to hold a scoring card, certainly not by an event:

"10.1.5 A player may not be forced to Hold a Scoring Card through
the effects of an Event(s)."


That rule is more in reference to situations like when you get Missile Envy played against you near the end of a round and have to play it and a scoring card as your last action. In that situation you would play the scoring card and then play ME as your first AR of the next turn.


Yes that is true, but rule 10.1.5 is much more broad and covers any situation where scoring cards are involved. See the FAQ:

"Q. There are a number of cards that require a player to play or discard particular cards. If this happens near the end of the turn, and that player
has scoring cards in his hand, it is possible that by obeying the event text, he would be forced to hold the scoring card, which would violate the
text on the scoring cards (and the rules).
A. The requirement that scoring cards must be played has precedence over other text."

Thus, some events may be ignored completely if they force a situation in which a player would otherwise be forced to hold a scoring card. too bad for the Event player, because it takes precedence over event text.
 
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Mr. Stabs
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That section of the FAQ is covering cards that require play/discard of cards. With Ask Not, the US player has the choice to gamble on picking up something better, which is why you can lose by holding scoring cards that way. I think that Ask Not is the only situation where this comes up.
 
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Mike Romeo
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Is there somewhere where this is explicitely written?
 
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check for the rules clarifications by Ananda or Jason, either here on the geek or on Consimworld.

Cheers, Haring
 
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Jack Smith
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KingAnus3 wrote:
Is there somewhere where this is explicitely written?


Well it is clear from the wording I think. Being forced to hold a card is not the same as choosing to hold it. In the example given the player got the card by choice (picking up a card from the deck) which was a mistake he made. He was not forced to do it. The Faq deals with situations where a player has no chance to avoid holding a scorecard, such as Missile Envy.

Op, another use for Headline is that some cards are clearly designed to be used then for optimum play, such as ones that give +1 Ops. Such cards are often powerful if played early but useless if played late (which a player can take advantage of if its the opponents card to get rid of it safely)

It also ensures an event is played even if you have all bad ones or forces a player to play an event before thy want to. This adds to the hard choices to be made. It also allows the US to get an event in before the USSR can coup down to a lower Defcon. As some events allows coups this can be very useful.
 
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I don't have all the rules section memorized, but I seem to remember that the HeadLine isn't technically Card-Play (as in the action rounds).

During the action rounds a player can choose between OPS or event for his OWN cards or combined card (red/white star).

He can choose for event first or OPS first when playing the Other powers event.

During the HL only event can be played, and no OPS.

Cheers, Haring
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Michael Kiefte
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I keep the rules on me at all times!

Haring wrote:
I don't have all the rules section memorized, but I seem to remember that the HeadLine isn't technically Card-Play (as in the action rounds).


4.5.C. (emphasis mine)

Quote:
C. Headline Phase: Each player secretly selects a card from
their hand. Once both players have made their choice, they reveal
their cards to each other simultaneously. These cards are called
‘Headline cards’ and their Events take place in this phase (and
if the event title has an asterisk, are removed from the game
normally)...

Scoring cards may be played during the Headline Phase...


Haring wrote:
During the action rounds a player can choose between OPS or event for his OWN cards or combined card (red/white star).


5.1:

Quote:
Cards may be played in one of two ways: as Events or Operations.


Haring wrote:
He can choose for event first or OPS first when playing the Other powers event.


5.2:

Quote:
Events Associated With Your Opponent: If a player plays
a card as an Operation, and the card’s Event is associated only
with his opponent, the Event still occurs (and the card, if it has
an asterisk after the Event title, is removed).
NOTE: When playing a card for operations and it triggers your
opponent’s event, your opponent implements the event text as if
they had played the card themselves.

The phasing player always decides whether the event is to take
place before or after the Operations are conducted.


Haring wrote:
During the HL only event can be played, and no OPS.


see above
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Jeff K
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FreeHansje wrote:
So, I believe as the phasing player I can choose how to play a card: as Operations, thus using it's Operation points OR as an Event, thus using the text.


Yes, that is the case during the Action Round when you are a phasing player. The Headline phase is simultaneous with no phasing player, before the Action Rounds begin. You are not the phasing player during the Headline Phase. Rule 4.5.C is quite clear.
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Eric Fletcher
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Ziilch wrote:

SNIP!

You can also only use events during the Headline, so there's that.


SNIP!



Note that what Ziilch originally wrote isn't quite what was meant. What was meant is: During the Headline, cards can only be played as events.
 
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Jack Smith
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The headline phase would be sort of pointless if it could be played for Ops as well (except for the ability to go first for the US and the no reveal until both selected) Also there would be no point having 6 action rounds instead of 7.

At the start you have 8 cards:

1 for headline
6 for Events/ops
1 left in hand

So you get 7 card plays from 8 cards (8 from 9 later) Of course the China card and certain events can change this a bit.
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