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Band of Brothers: Screaming Eagles» Forums » Rules

Subject: Voluntary Removal of Decoys rss

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Christopher O
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The other night I had a situation in which the opponent wanted to move a squad into a stack which already contained a decoy and a squad and was topped (obviously) with a concealment counter.

The position of the hex was such that it was really the best hex to move into. The moving squad wanted to move into the hex, but the hex was already at its stacking limit.

[edited - I must have remembered incorrectly that the hex contained a suppressed squad - in that case, the decoy would've been removed. Sentence above has been edited to remove a reference to a suppressed unit]

I could not find in the rules any option or reference to voluntarily remove a decoy counter (maybe I just missed it?). Since the rules state to treat decoy markers as regular units, presumably they would technically count toward the two-squad stacking limit. However, in this situation, the player did not care a whit for the decoy and just wanted it out of the way so that he could move a squad in.

Since I'm a big believer in the spirit of the rules rather than the letter of the rules, I thought it best to simply let the player remove the decoy voluntarily to let the (real) moving squad enter the hex. He did so, and play continued.

Was that correct, or should concealment potentially work against a player (accidentally) in this manner?

(My money is on voluntary removal)
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Harald Torvatn
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The decoy could just have moved out.
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Christopher O
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Harald wrote:
The decoy could just have moved out.


Not without expending a Use of the Operations Range, presumably.
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Jim Krohn
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You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
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Voluntary removal is fine.

Just to be clear, if a stack was suppressed, the decoy would have been removed. I realize that it might not have been in the same hex as the suppressed unit.
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Christopher O
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Jim Krohn wrote:
Voluntary removal is fine.

Just to be clear, if a stack was suppressed, the decoy would have been removed. I realize that it might not have been in the same hex as the suppressed unit.


Is voluntary removal stated in the rules and I just missed it, or is that a ruling which will be noted later?
 
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Jim Krohn
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You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
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It is in the spirit of the rules as you said. I have already added a note to my marked up version.
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beresford dickens
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To what extent can Decoys be used to simulate Guns and/or Vehicles?

Can a Decoy be positioned to look like it has a firing arc?

Isn't it a bit of a give-away when you place an Op Fire marker on the Decoy and it only takes one action to do so?
 
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Jim Krohn
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Yes and yes.
 
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beresford dickens
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Quote:
Isn't it a bit of a give-away when you place an Op Fire marker on the Decoy and it only takes one action to do so?


It's a bit more complicated but how about a special rule that a player can place an Op Fire marker or a 'Used' marker on an Unused Concealed Gun or Vehicle (which has not moved this turn) at a cost of one action? This brings Decoys and deception back into play. For those who think this is too big a concession, delete 'an Op Fire marker or'.
 
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Jim Krohn
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I'll think about that. It's a good idea.
 
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Martí Cabré

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Or always allow overspending: spend 3 actions for marking OpFire a concealed unit, to disguise its real nature.
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Christopher O
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marticabre wrote:
Or always allow overspending: spend 3 actions for marking OpFire a concealed unit, to disguise its real nature.


I would definitely allow this as a house rule if it does not become official.

Overspending actions to preserve the deception quality of concealment seems to me to be in the spirit of the ruleset and also adds to the atmosphere of the game; in my view, a win-win.

One potential... drawback? Exploit? - a player could intentionally overspend 2-3 actions on a concealed squad to make it "look" like a gun or vehicle, inflating its threat.

To me, that's also in the spirit of the concealment rules, but some people might not like it.
 
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Chris McDonald
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While we're asking decoy questions - can you attempt to do 'impossible' things with a decoy, like rolling for assault fire? Or can you only move it or mark it op fire?
 
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Ilias Sellountos
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cfmcdonald wrote:
While we're asking decoy questions - can you attempt to do 'impossible' things with a decoy, like rolling for assault fire? Or can you only move it or mark it op fire?


I would assume the decoy cannot take any action that would be felt/seen/detected by an enemy unit if the decoy was a real unit.
 
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Jim Krohn
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Attempting a fire attack causes the unit to lose its concealed status which would remove the decoy.
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beresford dickens
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Rules say that a Concealed unit only loses Conceal status if it fires (last bullet of 15.0).

But it comes down to terminology again. Is a Decoy a 'Concealed unit'? The wording of 15.0 suggests not. I believe that the 'real' answer here should be that a Decoy cannot attempt an action that it would be unable to perform if the 'attempt' succeeded.
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Jim Krohn
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Correct.
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