Recommend
4 
 Thumb up
 Hide
25 Posts

BoardGameGeek» Forums » Gaming Related » General Gaming

Subject: FLGS Markup - Universal? rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Christopher Watkins
United States
Amherst
Massachusetts
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Hi All,

Just was curious if FLGS markup was always present. I've made several observations on my local Hobby Shops. They almost always mark things at MSRP. I've seen their screens when they search for games via Alliance.

I've sometimes been dumbstruck at the prices they get from that distributor.

Overhead, expenses, blah blah blah. I'm fully aware of all of this. I've even gotten in long winded e-mails with FLGS owners.

I spent $1,500 on Board games in 2011. 90% of this was to Coolstuffinc, Boards and Bits, and Amazon.

The markup from distributors like Alliance ranges from 40-60 at local retailers. It drops to 20-30 at these big online retailers.

Are their FLGS's who have gone below MSRP in response to wanting my $1500. I'm not suggesting they get the same prices as online retailers, but within 5-10 bucks would detour me.

Anyone in Florida go to Coolstuffinc brick and mortar? Are the prices the same as the online site?

Just curious if maybe I'm in an odd location up here in the northeast.
2 
 Thumb up
0.02
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Paul DeStefano
United States
Long Island
New York
flag msg tools
designer
badge
It's a Zendrum. www.zendrum.com
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
A 40-60% markup is universal for smaller stores. Realize Macy's marks up women's clothing 800% and that salt costs the same per ton as 1 pound in the supermarket.

Many local stores do discount for being a regular either by club or casual recognition, and many stores go a few bucks under MSRP anyway.

But they need to pay that rent.
12 
 Thumb up
0.05
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Aaron Morgan
United States
Sacramento
California
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
SixtyWATZ wrote:
Are their FLGS's who have gone below MSRP in response to wanting my $1500. I'm not suggesting they get the same prices as online retailers, but within 5-10 bucks would detour me.


Mine gives a 10% discount off MSRP, so that makes up for the sales tax and cost of gas to get there. But their stock is incredible, and they cater to all parts of the hobby with a big focus on historical wargaming and model-building.
5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
M C
United States
Mount Dora
Florida
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
SixtyWATZ wrote:


Anyone in Florida go to Coolstuffinc brick and mortar? Are the prices the same as the online site?

Just curious if maybe I'm in an odd location up here in the northeast.


Yep, same prices at the brick and mortar store for CSI, nice knowledgeable folks working there, and plenty of tables to game one.

1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
jflartner
United States
Conshohocken
Pennsylvania
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
My FLGS is pretty great. HUGE selection, and really competitive prices. For most items, I can check the price on CSI, and add about $5-$10, depending. On a few occasions, the prices were actually cheaper than could be found at either CSI or Amazon.

(I think I'm getting a frequent buyer/volume purchase discounts from time to time, but he has never mentioned this explicitly...and when the price he writes on his receipt is less than the sticker, I don't complain)
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Christopher Watkins
United States
Amherst
Massachusetts
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
jobin13 wrote:
My FLGS is pretty great. HUGE selection, and really competitive prices. For most items, I can check the price on CSI, and add about $5-$10, depending. On a few occasions, the prices were actually cheaper than could be found at either CSI or Amazon.

(I think I'm getting a frequent buyer/volume purchase discounts from time to time, but he has never mentioned this explicitly...and when the price he writes on his receipt is less than the sticker, I don't complain)


That's awesome. I'd love to check this place out. Where is it located exactly?

Sorry I'm realizing this maybe should of gone in the retailers forum.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
jflartner
United States
Conshohocken
Pennsylvania
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
The Games Keep
929 S High Street
West Chester, PA
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Eigen
United Kingdom
Sheffield
South Yorkshire
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmb
I did a quick search of my FLGS's range, and picked out a big order, then picked the same order with an online store (it has all games about as cheap as any other online UK store).

FLGS: £280
Online: £230

(Games were Settlers, Carcassone, Quarriors, Endeavor, D&D - Ravenloft, Mage Knight, Agricola.)
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Freelance Police
United States
Palo Alto
California
flag msg tools
designer
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Well, I just wait for sales, check out the clearance racks, and subscribe to the FLGS newsletter.

Retail stores *ARE* inefficient. Name everything at the erstwhile Borders that aren't at Amazon, and there you go. I'll stick to my wacky notion that game stores are no longer a fit for the hobby *boardgaming* community. Retailers know the money's in CCGs, particularly Magic, and I don't blame them. Go support your FLMG (Friendly Local Meetup Group) instead.
4 
 Thumb up
0.02
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
mike
United States
columbus
Ohio
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
First off overhead is not blah, blah whatever, these are businesses not charity operations.

The owner has to pay rent, utilities, taxes, insurance for their location
The also have to pay for the appropriate licenses in their area
If they have employees, add payroll, insurance and benefits

So after all those expenses each month you also factor in your inventory. i.e. those games you want at a discount.

Well they have to determine how many of those games they need to sell each and everyday in order to pay the bills each month. Don't sell enough, to pay bills, then you're certainly not making any profit either and are not going to stay in business long.

You have to understand that any retailers not just game stores when they buy from wholesalers, distributors only get discounts if they are buying in volume.

Amazon and Walmart can buy in high volumes, therefore they can offer huge discounts and still make a profit.

I don't know how big your local game store is or what they specialize in, but one I go to is mainly a warhammer store, that's what they buy allot of, so they are able to offer decent prices. From other publishers they might buy a single copy of game so those are always retail price.

Now they do offer a discount if you spend so much throughout the year, but for the most part everything is a retail price.

The reality of collectibles/hobby stores is that they are not high volume stores so generally most items they are not making much on, so generally you'll see full retail price, unless of course they are willing to make a discount across the board and make it up in selling other items.

Just depends on the owner and what their overhead costs are, yes it does mattter it's called costs of doing business.
5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Patar Absurdus the Shananigator
United States
Carrollton
TX
flag msg tools
"what you just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response, were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought.
badge
Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
80sgamer wrote:
First off overhead is not blah, blah whatever, these are businesses not charity operations.

The owner has to pay rent, utilities, taxes, insurance for their location
The also have to pay for the appropriate licenses in their area
If they have employees, add payroll, insurance and benefits


That is why I don't feel bad buying online. I am not a charity and don't feel like paying into FLGS' as if they are charities. I don't want to pay their rent when I could just buy online...
5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
One Armed Bandit
Canada
Surrey
British Columbia
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
SixtyWATZ wrote:
Just was curious if FLGS markup was always present. I've made several observations on my local Hobby Shops. They almost always mark things at MSRP. I've seen their screens when they search for games via Alliance.

I've sometimes been dumbstruck at the prices they get from that distributor.

Overhead, expenses, blah blah blah. I'm fully aware of all of this. I've even gotten in long winded e-mails with FLGS owners.


Then you know why they mark up. Why are you complaining?

My FLGS has 2400 square feet of retail space. His rent alone is $5000 a month.

Big online stores can go cheaper because you know what? 2400 square feet in a WAREHOUSE only costs less than $1000. And they can pack 5 times as much stock into the same space, since they don't need displays, a counter, tables and all that stuff.

Here's the best part about your whole rant.
Who sets the MSRP? The publisher. Why do they set it at the level they do? Because they know that almost every store needs to sell at that level in order to not lose money.
And then you wonder if all retailers use the same price. shake
5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Ben Pinchback
United States
Leonard
Michigan
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Our Detroit area FLGS is generally somewhere between 8 to 20 bucks more than Amazon. I like having a FLGS to go to, so I buy about half my games there if not more.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Matt Riddle
United States
Oxford
Michigan
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I understand small business mark up . I am spilt pretty evenly between flgs, amazon, and funagin. I know that I will pay more at flgs. I am paying for "right now".
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Patar Absurdus the Shananigator
United States
Carrollton
TX
flag msg tools
"what you just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response, were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought.
badge
Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
tscook wrote:
1) Compared to shipping for one game (I hate having to order 2-3 online for free shipping), FLGSs are competitive.

2) I prefer browsing and talking to the owner, often getting recommendations and seeing games I wouldn't otherwise find in some massive database.


I am glad that FLGS' exist for those that enjoy them but between Amazon (with reduced prices, no taxes, and no shipping), online game stores (with the same for $100+ orders), and BGG (with rankings and plenty of written and video reviews) FLGS' loose their value for me...
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Simon W
England
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I'm really lucky, at my FLGS, the owner will look online to find competitive prices on Amazon and eBay and match it. Plus added to that is that the owner is a nice guy, and has even suggested games based on my collection I have on BGG.

Simon
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Patar Absurdus the Shananigator
United States
Carrollton
TX
flag msg tools
"what you just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response, were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought.
badge
Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
SDW740 wrote:
I'm really lucky, at my FLGS, the owner will look online to find competitive prices on Amazon and eBay and match it. Plus added to that is that the owner is a nice guy, and has even suggested games based on my collection I have on BGG.

Simon


I'd pay the taxes to go to that guys shop!
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Gary Bacchus
United States
Altamonte Springs
Florida
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
SixtyWATZ wrote:

Anyone in Florida go to Coolstuffinc brick and mortar? Are the prices the same as the online site?


I can assure you that Coolstuff's prices are exactly the same in their B&M storefront (discounting local sales tax, of course). In the case of boardgames, they have to be loss leaders for them as I don't think they could pay the bills at 25-30 points per sale. Not that they need any help getting foot traffic.

They own Magic in Orlando.

1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Gary Bacchus
United States
Altamonte Springs
Florida
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Sam and Max wrote:
Well, I just wait for sales, check out the clearance racks, and subscribe to the FLGS newsletter.

Retail stores *ARE* inefficient. Name everything at the erstwhile Borders that aren't at Amazon, and there you go. I'll stick to my wacky notion that game stores are no longer a fit for the hobby *boardgaming* community. Retailers know the money's in CCGs, particularly Magic, and I don't blame them. Go support your FLMG (Friendly Local Meetup Group) instead.


The only reason that CCGs are still viable in a B&M environment is because the publishers set strongly enforced price floors for their products. So, the B&M joints are protected. Rightfully so, because the marketing for CCGs is tailored around the B&M experience and has been for some time.

Then again, there are relatively few CCG publishers in comparison to the amount of boardgame publishers. It would be difficult to get all of the boardgame publishers on Earth to agree to such a scheme. Someone would break ranks, eventually.

If there was no price floor in place for CCGs (or minis for mini wargames), there would probably not be any more hobby stores.

I'm of the opinion that a price floor scheme would benefit the boardgaming community in the long term. Our hobby would benefit from some real support B&M stores rather than being a afterthought, but I've found that a lot of people here don't really like being supported if it means a penny out of their pocket.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
JEREMY WILHM
United States
EDMOND
Oklahoma
flag msg tools
badge
Insert clever phrase here.
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
First, it seems to me that most FLGS make their money from Magic and GW products, so they cater to those customers first. It would not suprise me at all if FLGS owners consider carrying board games as an extra service so they can charge MSRP or "Premium" prices. This way they don't need to sell a high volume to break even on their stock of board games, they can reach a broader customer base and maybe even turn some board gamers into Magic players and GW customers.

Second, FLGS's that continue to survive offer up extra services for their customers: open gaming space, demo events for upcoming releases, a game library so people can try before they buy, knowledgable staff that can answer your questions immediately instead of waiting for an e-mail reply, used games for sale at a discount (which is pretty much the only reason I visit my FLGS anymore), things that truly seperate them from the online stores.

However, I do agree with a previous post that FLGS as a whole do not fit with the hobby boardgaming community anymore. The online stores offer deeper discounts, BGG offers up more info on games that I'm interested in, and I can do all my shopping without leaving the house. If I had one of these great FLGS that offers discounts on board games, or treats it with the same interest as Magic, then I'd definitely shop at it on a regular basis. But since I will never be a Magic player or GW buyer, my visits and purchases from my FLGS are few.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Neil Blaiberg
United Kingdom
London
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I'm lucky enough to live near Leisure Games, an awesome shop in you're ever in the London area.

Sure, I could save money, time and petrol by using Amazon, but if everyone did that, a great shop would be no more.

And they really are a great bunch in there - sure it's cramped with hardly any room for gaming, but oh my word what stock range. Boardgames, Roleplaying games, Wargames, CCG's - you name it, they stock it. And they are always on hand with advice and recommendations, without being too picky.

Sorry, I'm sounding like an advert for them now, but I'm just trying to explain why I'd rather pay a few £'s more each time I buy a game and still have such a wonderful reasource nearby.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Matt Riddle
United States
Oxford
Michigan
flag msg tools
designer
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
jakal323 wrote:
Sam and Max wrote:
Well, I just wait for sales, check out the clearance racks, and subscribe to the FLGS newsletter.

Retail stores *ARE* inefficient. Name everything at the erstwhile Borders that aren't at Amazon, and there you go. I'll stick to my wacky notion that game stores are no longer a fit for the hobby *boardgaming* community. Retailers know the money's in CCGs, particularly Magic, and I don't blame them. Go support your FLMG (Friendly Local Meetup Group) instead.


The only reason that CCGs are still viable in a B&M environment is because the publishers set strongly enforced price floors for their products. So, the B&M joints are protected. Rightfully so, because the marketing for CCGs is tailored around the B&M experience and has been for some time.

Then again, there are relatively few CCG publishers in comparison to the amount of boardgame publishers. It would be difficult to get all of the boardgame publishers on Earth to agree to such a scheme. Someone would break ranks, eventually.

If there was no price floor in place for CCGs (or minis for mini wargames), there would probably not be any more hobby stores.

I'm of the opinion that a price floor scheme would benefit the boardgaming community in the long term. Our hobby would benefit from some real support B&M stores rather than being a afterthought, but I've found that a lot of people here don't really like being supported if it means a penny out of their pocket.
I agree in principle but a price floor is impossible for baked games as the market is competitive and varied. Sony can set floors on Ps3 because there is only one ps3. Same with magic. You have to agree to thier rules. If mayfair said you have charge Msrp or you can't sell our games then they would stock more queen and zman stuff. No too mention the distributor systems in place.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Gary Bacchus
United States
Altamonte Springs
Florida
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
riddlen wrote:
jakal323 wrote:
Sam and Max wrote:
Well, I just wait for sales, check out the clearance racks, and subscribe to the FLGS newsletter.

Retail stores *ARE* inefficient. Name everything at the erstwhile Borders that aren't at Amazon, and there you go. I'll stick to my wacky notion that game stores are no longer a fit for the hobby *boardgaming* community. Retailers know the money's in CCGs, particularly Magic, and I don't blame them. Go support your FLMG (Friendly Local Meetup Group) instead.


The only reason that CCGs are still viable in a B&M environment is because the publishers set strongly enforced price floors for their products. So, the B&M joints are protected. Rightfully so, because the marketing for CCGs is tailored around the B&M experience and has been for some time.

Then again, there are relatively few CCG publishers in comparison to the amount of boardgame publishers. It would be difficult to get all of the boardgame publishers on Earth to agree to such a scheme. Someone would break ranks, eventually.

If there was no price floor in place for CCGs (or minis for mini wargames), there would probably not be any more hobby stores.

I'm of the opinion that a price floor scheme would benefit the boardgaming community in the long term. Our hobby would benefit from some real support B&M stores rather than being a afterthought, but I've found that a lot of people here don't really like being supported if it means a penny out of their pocket.
I agree in principle but a price floor is impossible for baked games as the market is competitive and varied. Sony can set floors on Ps3 because there is only one ps3. Same with magic. You have to agree to thier rules. If mayfair said you have charge Msrp or you can't sell our games then they would stock more queen and zman stuff. No too mention the distributor systems in place.


Precisely, as I stated. There are a lot of publishers and not all of them would agree to a price floor. Mayfair did try setting a upper bounds on discounting their product, but it didn't work because no one else was doing it. If they all were doing it, we wouldn't notice.

The distribution system isn't a factor, really. It would actually be easier to enforce at that level because there are less distributors than stores.

I think the more telling thing is that this system, created by us mostly (we vote with our dollars after all), exists. Yet, we complain constantly about being second rate citizens in local game stores. We can't have our cake and eat it too.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
One Armed Bandit
Canada
Surrey
British Columbia
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
jakal323 wrote:
SixtyWATZ wrote:

Anyone in Florida go to Coolstuffinc brick and mortar? Are the prices the same as the online site?


I can assure you that Coolstuff's prices are exactly the same in their B&M storefront (discounting local sales tax, of course). In the case of boardgames, they have to be loss leaders for them as I don't think they could pay the bills at 25-30 points per sale. Not that they need any help getting foot traffic.

They own Magic in Orlando.


Here's the thing. With the amount of warehouse sales they do, the volume on that alone can subsidize their retail storefront.

Magic helps it a LOT as well.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.