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Dungeons & Dragons: The Legend of Drizzt Board Game» Forums » General

Subject: power differences between the games? rss

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evil bob
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I own the first two games and they have been quite fun. I just got the Drizzt game and haven't tried it yet but after looking over the heroes (hooray, more than 5!) they seem to be much stronger than the heroes in the other games. Several of them have the ability to attack twice every round, which seems pretty huge. Others have +9 or +10 to hit at-will attacks, which don't have any additional abilities but still seem very strong. A curious number of the new heroes can also heal themselves every round as well. And while they technically have the same number of powers, the "assigned" powers seem better with the new heroes - not to mention their static character bonuses. (Moving a monster all the way across the board each time they draw one seems incredible as a standard power.) On the whole, they seem much more powerful. What do others think about this?

Additionally, I would say that Wrath of A. seemed to have tougher monsters, traps, and encounters, but better treasure than Ravenloft. This seemed to balance out nicely, and was interesting when played together: you wanted Ravenloft monsters but Wrath of A. treasure. I haven't gotten into the treasure or encounters of Drizzt yet.

How do others feel about the relative power levels of the different games? Are Drizzt heroes really that much better than the other games? (Would you ever play Ravenloft's ranger over Drizzt?) Are there any variant rules someone can recommend about boosting the older heroes?
 
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Vayda
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LoD heroes are beasts, no doubt about it.
They play more fair if you keep out of phase powers off the table.
 
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Michael
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In my opinion, there are some Heroes in LoD which are stronger than those of previous games but certainly not all of them. As for choosing Allisa over Drizzt, I wouldn't. But that's cause I really like Drizzt as a character in the books. A friend of mine prefers Allisa as she is more predictable with her reliable Careful Attack and not as complex.

As for other classes, our group favors Arjhan and Vistra over Bruenor (Fighters) and Tarak over Regis (Rogues). The most commonly chosen Heroes so far have been Arjhan, Vistra, Drizzt and Thorgrim (in that order). It is especially interesting to play with new players that have no sense of what Heroes constitute the new and old guys. I just hand them the 18 Hero Cards an let them choose. After getting the hang of the game, they still favour many of the old guys.
And even those older Heroes have the ability to attack twice (Vistra), to attack with the highest bonus of all Heroes (Allisa, Vistra), to heal themselves or even others (Thorgrim, Quinn) or deal 2 points of damage with an At-Will attack (Allisa, Kat in many situations, Tarak if lucky, Thorgrim against Undead).

I'll write down a detailed evaluation at some point as I've been playing quite a bit ,recorded every game so far and will do some statistics on the 83 multiplayer and 106 solo games played until now.
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Michael
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Quote from Vaya: LoD heroes are beasts, no doubt about it.
They play more fair if you keep out of phase powers off the table.

I keep reading this but don't see it that dramatically. There are only three Heroes with Stances that let them attack in any Villain Phase (four if you count Athrogate's Snort). Drizzt is the only one that can feel imbalanced due to the double attack of Last Blood and Guenhwyvar as well as the integrated mobility.
But the others? I wonder if people forget that it costs an attack to place the Stance Token on the card. In Catti-brie's case, the Stance is no more than a delayed attack. It's sweet as you get to explore and have one more monster to select - but at the same time you forgo your potential healing (Battle Trance), attack bonus (forgot the name of the power) or additional damage (Heartseeker Stance) you'd be able to apply with those other stances. There are so many 2 HP monsters, and you often want the 1 HP healing over a delayed attack! Bruenor doesn't even avoid the monster's attack and additionally pays for it with a minus 2 to his AC, so that the Stance is hardly overpowered.

I find those Stances super useful in the very first round due to the absence of Monsters. As soon as you have Monsters on the board, however, you often cannot afford not to attack during your Hero Phase.
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Rauli Kettunen
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I have CR and now LoD, skipped WoA. After seeing the heroes in action twice each (well, Regis only once so far), I feel like LoD needed CR's Encounter deck to balance off the heroes. LoD has plenty of Encounters that do nothing, are very situational or just don't hurt you right now, whereas CR's Encounters were ouch, ouch, double ouch, not much in terms of breathing easy when you drew those, whereas in LoD, I'm at worst ambivalent as to drawing them.
 
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Ron
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I'm new to the game (have only played one CR solo quest) - after reading your comments, I wonder, would it be wise to shuffle all the components together? Or would that lead into chaos and unbalanced games?
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Frank The Tank
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it actually helps balance the games out when you shuffle the 3 games together. Makes for a more varied treasure pile, monsters, etc so if one thing is weak or strong the chances of getting it is much smaller then with just the single game.
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Freelance Police
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PzVIE wrote:
I'm new to the game (have only played one CR solo quest) - after reading your comments, I wonder, would it be wise to shuffle all the components together? Or would that lead into chaos and unbalanced games?


It would lead to unnecessary fiddliness. More monsters dilutes the threat of them, since it's less likely two players will "control" the same monster type. You'd have a bigger bucket of monsters to sift through to find the right one to put on the board. Same with the condition and various encounter tokens.

OTOH, If you only play at home and when you've played through all the games, go for it. I'm pretty tempted to tweak monster decks to make them more thematic to each set (Kobolds working for a vampire?? Seriously???).
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Brian M
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Quote:
(Kobolds working for a vampire?? Seriously???)

I don't know why people get so bent out of shape about the kobolds. Dracula had Renfield, and most of the "throw all the supernatural monsters into one big spooky place" have followed the trend with some kind of mortal servants. Castlevania had hunchbacks, Van Helsing had the Dwerkin (sp?). Ravenloft apparently has kobolds.

Makes sense to; somebody needs to build all those traps and kobolds are good at it. They may not be of much interest to a vampire as food, and don't mind that said vamp is chowing down on the local humans, so everyone can get along happily.
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evil bob
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Thanks for all the responses. Having played only one game of LoD so far, my initial impression is that while the heroes tend to be better than the older heroes, the monsters are also tougher - thus requiring better heroes. I noticed that many of the new heroes may have spectacular at-wills, but their utilities are occasionally lackluster. It doesn't balance it completely, but it helps. It's also curious that the newest game doesn't have any "healer" roles. Instead, most of the characters can heal themselves - sometimes using at-will attacks (like Drizzt's shielding at-will). Having a lack of a dedicated healer makes me feel like it's more about individuals trying to shine as opposed to a group working toward a common goal, and the addition of "competition" and "PvP" scenarios tends to reinforce this position.

Zwerg wrote:
I wonder if people forget that it costs an attack to place the Stance Token on the card.

I thought most stances said that you can place a token on them at the start of your hero phase. Since most of them are utility cards, I didn't realize you had to use your attack to trigger them? Is that right? Even if that's true, using only one stance can still be very powerful (especially the archer's stances).

Also, sorry: I've never read the books and don't know any of the character names; describing their classes is more useful to me, if that's easy enough.
 
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evil bob
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Answering my own question: a few stances require an attack action to activate - pretty much just the weird "can ignore villain's turn" cards and Drizzt calling his pet - but almost all the rest do not. In particular, the archer's amazingly powerful stances only require moving a stance token at the start of your hero phase (so each turn she can either heal one on a hit, get +4 to hit and move monsters, or do +1 damage on any given turn - assuming she had 3 utility powers, anyway).


Following up on my original question, here is my general impression of the various power levels of the game. Anyone who has played all three please add your own thoughts and comments as well; we haven't played all three extensively so our impressions are somewhat limited in scope.

Charaters: LoD >> WoA = CR
Monsters: LoD > WoA > CR
Encounters*: WoA > CR > LoD
Treasure: WoA > LoD >> CR

*My one exception is the traps; I think those may be more like LoD = WoA > CR.

Other thoughts? As I said before, WoA seems to have stronger encounters but better treasure to compensate. LoD seems to have better heroes but also better monsters.


PzVIE wrote:
I'm new to the game (have only played one CR solo quest) - after reading your comments, I wonder, would it be wise to shuffle all the components together? Or would that lead into chaos and unbalanced games?

I have typically played this way (although I've not had a chance to mix LoD with the rest) and I like it. As mentioned, you are technically decreasing the difficulty slightly thanks to the very odd "all monsters that are the same activate at once" rule - since you shouldn't have as many "same monster" situations come up as often. However, you also have many more >2 XP monsters in the pile, so it's also more possible that you could get a string of very difficult monsters in a row. (Or, a string of very weak ones.)

Also as mentioned, it seems like it would balance the game out - but in practice it can make the game very "swingy." For example, if you got several WoA treasures in a row followed by several CR monsters, you'd probably think the game was getting easy. But if you just got a few CR treasures and some WoA encounters and monsters, you'll find the difficulty suddenly much higher. Also, as mentioned above, the chance to get several 1 XP monsters in a row or several >2 XP monsters in a row can swing the tide pretty heavily.

WoD presents its own unique challenges to mixing the game together which I'm not sure how best to handle yet. For one, the heroes tend to be stronger. For two, the tiles have a lot of specific effects - like volcanic vents - that are not on other tiles. The LoD encounters sometimes reference these effects (or, like the Mark of Lolth curses, other LoD encounter cards) and having these tiles and encounters more spread out would make these (already slightly weaker) encounters much less troublesome.

Edit: Also, and I didn't notice this until recently, but the tiles from LoD specifically say "Cavern Tile" on the back, while the other two games say "Dungeon Tile" on the back - thus making it clear which game pile you'd be drawing from. It's almost like WotC specifically tried to keep these tiles from being mixed with the others, as every other type of tile has the same back and they had to go out of their way to change this one. (And it's not like the front of the tiles are that difficult to tell apart, or that the "underdark" world couldn't be described as a dungeon...)

A few ways to balance this might be: all non-LoD heroes could start with an extra utility power (or, if that's too strong, all LoD could start with one fewer). You might also want to avoid mixing the tiles and encounters from the Drizzt game with the other two games - although I really love some of the ideas they started having with the Drizzt tiles, like the -4 AC tiles and the Secret Cave: special events that are caused by the tiles, and not just encounters.

There are no "official" rules that I've seen about mixing the games, but maybe some exist?
 
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