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Subject: 3rd game-few more questions rss

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Subramanian Krishnamurthy
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We have won both games that we completed, so it seems like we are doing something wrong and making the game easy for us, though this time doom track was one away from awakening AO. So, just to make sure we are doing things right, few questions, mainly do with player turn/movement order-

1. When I have to evade/fight a monster, can a player whose turn is before me come and fight it instead of me? More so, when there is a gate guarding monster is it mandatory for the player who just got back from OW to fight it on the next round or can someone else whose turn is before me too fight it?

2. Can I use one of my "Any Phase" cards AFTER I draw an encounter card i.e for some reason, I forgot/didn't use a spell which gives me some protection from losses or gives me skill bonuses. Now after I draw the encounter card, can I try to cast my "any phase" spell card?

3. Suppose I started moving, but there is a monster in between and I failed some initial evade/horror/combat check. Now can I use one of my "any phase cards" to try and reduce further losses or do all these have to be used BEFORE combat begins?

4. Trading and movement - Suppose 2 people reach a location/street position with a monster on it while still having movements points left. Does the player who got there first have to immediately engage in evade/combat or can he get some items from 2nd player and then do evade/combat. Will it work other way around-can 2nd player get items from first player before he enters combat?

5. Flesh ward if successful, prevents any stamina loss from a source for the entire turn or only for the duration of one combat? If I lose a combat, do I have to successfully cast the flesh ward again or will it be valid throughout?


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brian
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subrak13 wrote:
We have won both games that we completed, so it seems like we are doing something wrong and making the game easy for us, though this time doom track was one away from awakening AO. So, just to make sure we are doing things right, few questions, mainly do with player turn/movement order-

1. When I have to evade/fight a monster, can a player whose turn is before me come and fight it instead of me? More so, when there is a gate guarding monster is it mandatory for the player who just got back from OW to fight it on the next round or can someone else whose turn is before me too fight it?

If someone is ahead of you in turn order, they can try to fight the monster first and clear your path. If you return during Phase 2 movement, you may ignore the monster for exactly one round to have chance to close the gate. But on the next turn you must deal with it.

However, a very common mistake if for players to realize once they enter combat, their movement is over, even if they are successful. This small rule error does make the game too easy.

Quote:
2. Can I use one of my "Any Phase" cards AFTER I draw an encounter card i.e for some reason, I forgot/didn't use a spell which gives me some protection from losses or gives me skill bonuses. Now after I draw the encounter card, can I try to cast my "any phase" spell card?

"Any phase" does not mean use at any time. You still have to use it when appropriate. Typically, these are combat spells that can only happen during combat. But since combat can occur during movement or either encounter phase, they just say "any phase" on them.

Also, once an encounter starts, it resolves completely. So you can't use any spells or anything unless they specifically say you can. Most spells don't "interrupt" though.

Quote:
3. Suppose I started moving, but there is a monster in between and I failed some initial evade/horror/combat check. Now can I use one of my "any phase cards" to try and reduce further losses or do all these have to be used BEFORE combat begins?

Depends on the card. If it is an evade type card, you can try to use it before you evade. If it is a combat card, use it during combat. Again, "any phase" means "any [applicable] phase."

Quote:
4. Trading and movement - Suppose 2 people reach a location/street position with a monster on it while still having movements points left. Does the player who got there first have to immediately engage in evade/combat or can he get some items from 2nd player and then do evade/combat. Will it work other way around-can 2nd player get items from first player before he enters combat?

Follow the phases. The earlier player in turn order has to move and resolve combat first. Players do NOT move at the same time. they only way this works is if the 2nd player was already at that location from a previous turn. Trading can be done before or after combat but not during. trading goes both ways and can be a donation.

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5. Flesh ward if successful, prevents any stamina loss from a source for the entire turn or only for the duration of one combat? If I lose a combat, do I have to successfully cast the flesh ward again or will it be valid throughout?

One round of combat. Note that it is also exhausted (whether you are successful in casting it or not) so unless you have multiple copies, this is also only good one time per turn.
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Subramanian Krishnamurthy
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Thanks once again. We were obviously making it too easy for ourselves by trading at intermediate points and using spells at any time. Anyway, I wanted to know couple of more things-

1. Does Mandy's re-roll work against the ancient one?

2. Do clue tokens work against ancient ones for additional rolls? Because clue tokens can only be used to get more rolls in case of failure. Here, when AO attacks, there is never really a failure, so does the rule still apply?

3. In the final battle, investigators start with whatever they have, and are not restored to full value, right?

4. For discarding half the cards, are skills also counted or is the rule same as for trading-only common items, unique items, and spells. Only difference is in former, we discard clue tokens, in latter money can be traded, correct?

5. If sister Mary is never LITAS. Does she also not lose half the cards or this rule applies only to her location?
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Subramanian Krishnamurthy
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sorry for the trouble but one final (hopefully) question-

1. You said Flesh Ward works for only one round of combat. But the card gives immunity against a source, while some other cards specifically say card works until end of combat. So we assumed it works for multiple combat rounds.
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Conor Hickey
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subrak13 wrote:
Thanks once again. We were obviously making it too easy for ourselves by trading at intermediate points and using spells at any time. Anyway, I wanted to know couple of more things-

1. Does Mandy's re-roll work against the ancient one?

2. Do clue tokens work against ancient ones for additional rolls? Because clue tokens can only be used to get more rolls in case of failure. Here, when AO attacks, there is never really a failure, so does the rule still apply?

3. In the final battle, investigators start with whatever they have, and are not restored to full value, right?

4. For discarding half the cards, are skills also counted or is the rule same as for trading-only common items, unique items, and spells. Only difference is in former, we discard clue tokens, in latter money can be traded, correct?

5. If sister Mary is never LITAS. Does she also not lose half the cards or this rule applies only to her location?


1. Yes it does, items or skills that don't work against Ancient Ones specify that e.g. Healing Stone,

2. Yes they do, you can also use clue tokens to get more successes, not just when you fail in the first place. For example, a common tactic is for each player to use all his Clue tokens on the 1st round of combat to do as much damage to the AO as possible - if you roll say, five dice against it and got a couple of successes you can then use all your clue tokens for extra rolls, and it's usually a good idea to do so in order to get them used before being devoured.

3. Yes you start as you are, if a final battle seems imminent, forget about sealing gates and start gearing up for it, and restoring stats etc.

4. When discarding half your items you count only Common Items, Unique Items and Spells. Count those and half, rounding down, that's what you need to discard.

Count Clue tokens seperately and discard half those, rounding down again i.e. if you had 5 tokens you'll discard 2 1/2, rounded down to 2.

Money is only discarded if you are arrested which I have found incredibly rare in the base game.

If you get an expansion for the game at some point I would recommend Dunwich Horror as the Injury/Madness cards it introduces replace the 'discarding half' mechanic which is one of the annoying things about the base game.

5. She does lose half her items, but she just goes direct to the Asylum or Hospital rather than losing a turn LiTaS. It also makes her immune to being devoured by Yog-Sothoth if she was to be LiTaS. But these two cases mean she's definitely one of the weakest investigators in the base game.

1b. Flesh Ward works in one round only - if you have a look at the card it says 'cast and exhaust' but also look at the bottom left corner, there are no hand symbols.

Combat spells like Wither that can be used from round to round in combat have a hand symbol on them denoting that the spell takes up one hand and will continue to do so each round you are using it, but Flesh Ward lacks that indicating that it is a 'one shot' use.


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brian
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Agree with Conner on all points. Also wanted to add that the FAQ that is out specifically states Flesh Ward can only be used in one round and does not protect from more rounds of combat from the same source.

Original / Dunwich FAQ: wrote:
Q: When exactly can Flesh Ward be cast?
A: When you are told to lose 1 or more points of
Stamina, you may cast Flesh Ward to prevent that loss.
For instance, this can work on the Stamina from a single
failed Combat check. This does not make the investigator
immune to further harm from that source, it only prevents
it one time.


Kingsport / Innsmouth FAQ: wrote:
Q: Can Flesh Ward protect an investigator from all damage
caused by a given monster during a whole combat?

A: No. (In combat, the “one source” of damage Flesh Ward
allows an investigator to ignore is the Stamina loss from a single
failed Combat check
, not all damage caused by a particular
monster for the duration of the combat.)
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Subramanian Krishnamurthy
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Thank you once again everyone. So, with the patrol wagon, do I have unrestricted movement? Can I thus also let trades happen between all players (if no one is engaged in combat or I am the 1st player) without them moving at all because I can travel to all their locations?

Does using a one-handed weapon/spell for horror check prevent me from using a 2 handed weapon/spell for the fight or are the 2 independent?

And finally, Chtulhu attacks is always on maximum sanity and stamina and not on existing sanity/stamina levels? Also, can we use Mandy's re-rolls on skill checks we do (say for casting spells) during final battle?

The final conclusion on trading is that it is barred only during combat and encounter resolution, correct? Before everyone draws an encounter card, it is possible to trade if they are in the same location?
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Bern Harkins
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subrak13 wrote:
Thank you once again everyone. So, with the patrol wagon, do I have unrestricted movement? Can I thus also let trades happen between all players (if no one is engaged in combat or I am the 1st player) without them moving at all because I can travel to all their locations?


No. Instead of ordinary movement, the Investigator with the Patrol Wagon may move their character from any one Location in Arkham to any other Location (streets are considered locations for this purpose). They do not enter any of the Locations in between, so no trading except in their starting or ending Locations.

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Does using a one-handed weapon/spell for horror check prevent me from using a 2 handed weapon/spell for the fight or are the 2 independent?

The hand used for help with the Horror Check is used up for the first round of the combat only; you may switch hand usage at the start of each later round.

Quote:
And finally, Chtulhu attacks is always on maximum sanity and stamina and not on existing sanity/stamina levels?


Correct.

Quote:
Also, can we use Mandy's re-rolls on skill checks we do (say for casting spells) during final battle?


Yes, Mandy's ability works on any skill check; just be careful of rolls, like Ithaqua's start of battle effect, that require successes but are no Skill Checks; Many cannot help with these.

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The final conclusion on trading is that it is barred only during combat and encounter resolution, correct? Before everyone draws an encounter card, it is possible to trade if they are in the same location?


Yes.
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brian
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subrak13 wrote:
And finally, Chtulhu attacks is always on maximum sanity and stamina and not on existing sanity/stamina levels? Also, can we use Mandy's re-rolls on skill checks we do (say for casting spells) during final battle?

Yes, but realize at some point you max sanity/stamina is going to be dropped to your current sanity/stamina so it will be a hit to both. If you are at 4 Stamina and your max drops to 3, so does your Current Stamina.
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Subramanian Krishnamurthy
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Thanks you all for the replies.

1. Can you please further clarify movement regarding patrol wagon? It asks us ignore normal movement and nowhere does it say I can't go to multiple locations. Actually, during regular movement (using movement points, not patrol wagon) if I have 4-5 movement points (or more), it is possible to go into the streets and come back to the same location I started in OR go to multiple locations if my movement points allow me to. So, why would a restriction of going ONLY to one location suddenly appear on the patrol wagon? My point is that can I not use any location as an intermediate location on the way to the "final" location.

2. So regarding combat, I can enter each round of combat with two different one-handed weapons/spells and the horror check counts as a separate round of combat? If I pass the horror check (using the CROSS which is one-handed), is it not necessary to carry it over to first fight round? You are saying I would have 2 hands free now, correct?

3. With regards to question 2 above, what if I have a card which says it lasts till end of combat- am I not forced to use it until I win or can I still change the card after a round? For example, I have 2 shrivelling cards, one of which I fail to cast. So technically at least for 1st round of combat I need to enter it with only one hand. Now suppose I lose first round, take damages. For the second round, can I use some one-handed other weapon and one shrivelling or any OTHER 2-handed weapon? And also, do I have to do a spell check for every round of combat, even if I had successfully cast a spell during one of the earlier rounds?

3. Then during the final battle, do I become insane or unconscious when either sanity/stamina become 0 and then do I have to discard half the cards before I continue on to my next attack? Or am I only devoured when both are zero and can continue to attack as if I am normal even if I had been reduced to 0 stamina OR sanity earlier?

Sorry for the repeated questions, but it seems like I understand and then when we play, some weird scenario comes up and we are no longer sure if we are allowed to do it, hence want to get everything crystal clear. Hope you understand
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brian
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subrak13 wrote:
Thanks you all for the replies.

1. Can you please further clarify movement regarding patrol wagon? It asks us ignore normal movement and nowhere does it say I can't go to multiple locations. Actually, during regular movement (using movement points, not patrol wagon) if I have 4-5 movement points (or more), it is possible to go into the streets and come back to the same location I started in OR go to multiple locations if my movement points allow me to. So, why would a restriction of going ONLY to one location suddenly appear on the patrol wagon? My point is that can I not use any location as an intermediate location on the way to the "final" location.

Patrol Wagon is a "teleport" of sorts. You can go from Point A to Point B and that takes up your entire movement. You do not literally travel across any locations so you cannot trade or engage with monsters except your start point and end point. If you want to stop along the way, fine, but you can't use the Wagon at all this turn.

Quote:
2. So regarding combat, I can enter each round of combat with two different one-handed weapons/spells and the horror check counts as a separate round of combat? If I pass the horror check (using the CROSS which is one-handed), is it not necessary to carry it over to first fight round? You are saying I would have 2 hands free now, correct?

I don't think there is anything that requires hands during the Horror check. there was one card in CotDP but I think it was revised to remove it.

The cross gives you the horror check just by having it, you don't commit hands to it until Combat. Your hands do free up between each round of combat. The exception is if you cast a spell. As long as you commit a hand to it, it is considered cast so you would have your remaining hands.

Quote:
3. With regards to question 2 above, what if I have a card which says it lasts till end of combat- am I not forced to use it until I win or can I still change the card after a round? For example, I have 2 shrivelling cards, one of which I fail to cast. So technically at least for 1st round of combat I need to enter it with only one hand. Now suppose I lose first round, take damages. For the second round, can I use some one-handed other weapon and one shrivelling or any OTHER 2-handed weapon? And also, do I have to do a spell check for every round of combat, even if I had successfully cast a spell during one of the earlier rounds?

For the 2nd round, both hands are freed up again. So you can use the 2nd Shriveling now and another 1-handed weapon/item/spell or use 2-handed ones.

Quote:
3. Then during the final battle, do I become insane or unconscious when either sanity/stamina become 0 and then do I have to discard half the cards before I continue on to my next attack? Or am I only devoured when both are zero and can continue to attack as if I am normal even if I had been reduced to 0 stamina OR sanity earlier?

No, if either gets to 0 you are devoured and removed from the game.
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Subramanian Krishnamurthy
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Damn, a couple of above are mentioned in the rule book itself but after reading the FAQ and the forums, it becomes unclear as to where each rule was published.

I think if I remember right, the Cross does require one hand but anyway hands get freed after each round of combat, so it does not matter. And there is a difference between regular game and final battle with regards to being devoured-in former you get devoured only if sanity AND stamina are 0, in latter it is OR, correct?

I am sorry but I don't understand the point A to point B teleport. Can you please address the 2nd half of the scenario I posted earlier? Specifically, during regular movement (forget patrol wagon for now) if I have a lot of movement points, is it not possible to go into the streets and come back to the same location I started in OR go to multiple locations? That is, even with REGULAR movement, there is nothing called a final destination-I can enter locations as intermediate locations if I have sufficient movement points, correct? If this assumption is wrong, then I have no issue. But if not, why would having the patrol wagon suddenly impose a restriction on what my final destination is?

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brian
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subrak13 wrote:
Damn, a couple of above are mentioned in the rule book itself but after reading the FAQ and the forums, it becomes unclear as to where each rule was published.

I think if I remember right, the Cross does require one hand but anyway hands get freed after each round of combat, so it does not matter. And there is a difference between regular game and final battle with regards to being devoured-in former you get devoured only if sanity AND stamina are 0, in latter it is OR, correct?

During the game you are only devoured if both Sanity and Stamina are 0 at the same time. You then get a new investigator. The rules change for the final battle. Only one needs to go to zero and you are out of the game.

Quote:
I am sorry but I don't understand the point A to point B teleport. Can you please address the 2nd half of the scenario I posted earlier? Specifically, during regular movement (forget patrol wagon for now) if I have a lot of movement points, is it not possible to go into the streets and come back to the same location I started in OR go to multiple locations? That is, even with REGULAR movement, there is nothing called a final destination-I can enter locations as intermediate locations if I have sufficient movement points, correct? If this assumption is wrong, then I have no issue. But if not, why would having the patrol wagon suddenly impose a restriction on what my final destination is?

If you are doing normal movement, you can move up to the number of movement points you have. This is equal to your Speed that you set during Upkeep.

You can move into and out of locations as many times as you want as long as you have points left over. Points can also be spent on reading tomes. Most times, movement limits you to a specific neighborhood or going from one neighborhood to an adjacent one. Your "final" destination is the place you end up at the end of the movement phase - either by choice (didn't spend all your movement points) or because you ran out of the points.

The Patrol Wagon works different. It does not give you unlimited movement as some like to project upon it. But it allow you to go anywhere once at the cost of giving up your movement points in their entirety. The disadvantage is that you don't "stop along the way" so you are only ever in 2 locations - your start point and your end point. So you can't trade with anyone unless they are in your start point or your end point.

The advantage is that you can go farther than you normally would. You can even go to other expansion boards. You also don't have to fight through any monsters to get there - except those in your start and end points.

So if you are in the Woods and want to go the Newspaper. Poof. You are there. But you don't go to any points in between this turn.
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Subramanian Krishnamurthy
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Thanks Brian for all the clarifications. This has been really helpful. I think all of the issues have now been cleared up (for now!!) Hopefully, I can move on to strategy questions soon. Thanks once again.
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Subramanian Krishnamurthy
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Nope, no finished yet . Here goes...I am trying to understand the reason for the following FAQ

Q: If an investigator is delayed in the Other Worlds and
draws an encounter that returns him to Arkham, is he still
delayed when he returns?
A: Yes. Returning to Arkham doesn’t affect the fact that
he is delayed.


If an investigator is delayed in OW, he simply places the marker on the side and during movement phase, just turns is upright. Now if he returns to Arkham via an OW encounter, why does it matter if his status is still delayed or not? Are some mythos cards based on the status (normal/delayed) of the investigator because I can't think of any other reason why this might be important.
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brian
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subrak13 wrote:
Nope, no finished yet . Here goes...I am trying to understand the reason for the following FAQ

Q: If an investigator is delayed in the Other Worlds and
draws an encounter that returns him to Arkham, is he still
delayed when he returns?
A: Yes. Returning to Arkham doesn’t affect the fact that
he is delayed.


If an investigator is delayed in OW, he simply places the marker on the side and during movement phase, just turns is upright. Now if he returns to Arkham via an OW encounter, why does it matter if his status is still delayed or not? Are some mythos cards based on the status (normal/delayed) of the investigator because I can't think of any other reason why this might be important.

Because if he is delayed at the time of the OW encounter and you stood him up (which is incorrect) then on the next movement phase he could actually move somewhere.

By following this clarification, he remains delayed. So when phase 2 comes around, he just stands up. He would have an Arkham encounter where he is at during phase 3, not necessarily where he wants to be.

This will most likely happen when you have an Encounter in Arkham that opens up a gate causing you to be delayed. You then have an OW encounter and it sends you back. Now you are stuck there for a turn as you are still delayed back in Arkham.
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Subramanian Krishnamurthy
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No, I didn't mean I was standing him up in the same turn. If he gets delayed because of gate opening during mythos phase, on the next movement phase he stands up and proceeds as normal with OW encounter etc. He is no longer delayed back in Arkham even he is sent back, correct?.

Anyway, seems like the FAQ is specifically addressed for the case when you are delayed because of gate opening in encounter phase and sent back to arkham in OW encounter. Seems very specific, don't see how else it is relevant. Might as well have stated the scenario explicitly in the FAQ Thanks once again.
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Austin Fleming
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You could be delayed because of an OW encounter, then be sent back to Arkham by a Mythos card. In this case, since you are still delayed, you would only be able to stand up on the next movement phase. It might make a difference if there is one or more monsters you cannot defeat on the gate, and you can't seal it or don't want to close it for some reason. You could not just sneak away, you would have to stay there for a turn.

An unusual circumstance, but it has happened in one of our games...shake
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brian
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subrak13 wrote:
No, I didn't mean I was standing him up in the same turn. If he gets delayed because of gate opening during mythos phase, on the next movement phase he stands up and proceeds as normal with OW encounter etc. He is no longer delayed back in Arkham even he is sent back, correct?.

Anyway, seems like the FAQ is specifically addressed for the case when you are delayed because of gate opening in encounter phase and sent back to arkham in OW encounter. Seems very specific, don't see how else it is relevant. Might as well have stated the scenario explicitly in the FAQ Thanks once again.

All it is stating is that you keep your relative position. Moving from the OW to Arkham doesn't allow you to stand up if you were delayed.
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Subramanian Krishnamurthy
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Retainers, bank loans, few uniqur items
1. Can a person get multiple retainer cards and bank loans? So, with multiple retainer cards, one can get multiple amount of money?

2.Flute of outer gods - Before using it, I have to make at least one horror check, right? Also, once I use it all other monsters are also defeated, without even having to make horror checks against the other monsters?

3. Related to above, if there are multiple monsters at a location, I have to make horror check with each one of them, right even if I have finished fighting the first one?

4. Enchanted jewellery - Just like Flesh ward, it can be used even during encounter resolution, right because it prevents stamina loss. Also, can I put 3 stamina on the card together to avoid losing 3 stamina or should it be one at a time?

5. Obsidian Statue- It is similar to Flesh Ward in the sense that it prevents Stamina/Sanity loss only for one round of combat, not for multiple rounds against one monster, correct?

6. Suppose I cast a spell successfully, but fail in the combat check. For next round, am I forced to use the spell (whether one-handed or 2-handed)? Or are my hands freed? Conversely, if I actually want to use the same spell, do I need to re-cast it or is it considered cast?
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brian
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subrak13 wrote:
1. Can a person get multiple retainer cards and bank loans? So, with multiple retainer cards, one can get multiple amount of money?

Only one each - which is why there are only 8 copies in the game (1 for each player up to the maximum of 8 players)

Quote:
2.Flute of outer gods - Before using it, I have to make at least one horror check, right? Also, once I use it all other monsters are also defeated, without even having to make horror checks against the other monsters?

There is some debate on whether you even need to make the horror check. But yes, one suffices and the rest are defeated after a successful combat check.

Quote:
3. Related to above, if there are multiple monsters at a location, I have to make horror check with each one of them, right even if I have finished fighting the first one?

Without the Flute, yes, each monster has it's own horror check (unless otherwise noted on the monster).

Quote:
4. Enchanted jewellery - Just like Flesh ward, it can be used even during encounter resolution, right because it prevents stamina loss. Also, can I put 3 stamina on the card together to avoid losing 3 stamina or should it be one at a time?

Correct. You can take all 3 at the same time. Basically, it is giving you +3 stamina temporarily.

Quote:
5. Obsidian Statue- It is similar to Flesh Ward in the sense that it prevents Stamina/Sanity loss only for one round of combat, not for multiple rounds against one monster, correct?

Correct. You can only use it once as it is discarded - so it won't carry over into multiple rounds.

Quote:
6. Suppose I cast a spell successfully, but fail in the combat check. For next round, am I forced to use the spell (whether one-handed or 2-handed)? Or are my hands freed? Conversely, if I actually want to use the same spell, do I need to re-cast it or is it considered cast?

Your choice. As long as you devote hands to it, you do not have to recast it (unless otherwise stated). But as soon as you "let go" then you can no longer use that spell. And since it is exhausted, the only way to cast it again is to have a 2n copy of it (or refresh it in upkeep at the start of the next turn).
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