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Subject: The most offensive theme ever? Some thoughts from a Christian gamer after play #1 rss

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Patar Absurdus the Shananigator
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Firstly there is nothing wrong with being offended by a theme and wanting to communicate that offense so that others can be aware of the potentially controversial theme. Some of the comments from the games defenders on other posts seem a bit patronizing and that's pretty uncool.

Having said that I played this for the first time and was not bothered by the theme at all. I think that the themes controversy was definitely over blown. It is far less thematic then Claustrophobia (IMO) and because of that I think that it is less likely to offend.

Honestly it felt only slightly more thematic then Dominion to me. It's easy to look pass the board art and the unpainted figures and see the strategy and the rules. I don't think that the different player powers increase the thematic elements in any major way either. That is in no way negative for me since theme has never been as important for me as long as a game isn't abstract and has at least painted on theme I am good.

Thematic gamers may disagree with me and I may be dead wrong from their perspective. I tend to like euro's. Perhaps I wouldn't know theme if it hit me square in the face with all the intense chaotic strength of Khorne the Chaos Power of War.

Either way... If you want my two cents, this games theme is not that offensive because after reading the flavor text and introducing the "Chaos Powers." Who your characters are and what they are supposedly doing to the land is lost to the very interesting strategic choices and well crafted mechanics of this masterfully designed game.
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Ed Bradley
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It's pantomime evil.
There's no need for anyone to take it too seriously
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Stephen Allen
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I've met people who are put off by the theme, but liked the game after playing it.

If I was to re-theme it, I would make make it an Election game. The four(five) gods would be political parties etc.
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Jordan Alexander
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some_guy wrote:
I've met people who are put off by the theme, but liked the game after playing it.

If I was to re-theme it, I would make make it an Election game. The four(five) gods would be political parties etc.


Wouldnt that be making the player more evil?
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Joel Schuster
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As for a christian theme, consider thinking of this as crusading and evangelizing campaign.

Cultists are missionary monks that you send to regions in order to force the locals convert to your religion.

Draconic laws and sanctions are issued in the form of chaos cards. Sent the inquisition (warriors) or your god himself (demon) if that is not enough.

Now you have your christian game

I wonder what is more evil, the original theme or the christian one whistle
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Andrew Hurp
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I think the best part of the theme is that anyone who is actually going to be offended by this theme is someone who I don't want to socialise with, or indeed, have anywhere near my family. Especially not spoiling this excellent game (my partners favourite).
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Jack Francisco
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It's pretend.
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Patar Absurdus the Shananigator
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"what you just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response, were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought.
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Fwing wrote:
It's pantomime evil.
There's no need for anyone to take it too seriously


I agree. It didn't bother me and I see why some would be bothered but just don't think it's too big of a deal. Everyone has to use their own judgement though.

Umbratus wrote:
As for a christian theme, consider thinking of this as crusading and evangelizing campaign.

Cultists are missionary monks that you send to regions in order to force the locals convert to your religion.

Draconic laws and sanctions are issued in the form of chaos cards. Sent the inquisition (warriors) or your god himself (demon) if that is not enough.

Now you have your christian game

I wonder what is more evil, the original theme or the christian one whistle


That wouldn't be a Christian theme that would be the same theme. Pagan deities vying For power in unpleasant ways isn't Christian at all it's pagan and is this theme exactly. Thinking that your theme idea would be a Christian theme is just plain silly. shake

Fabs wrote:
I think the best part of the theme is that anyone who is actually going to be offended by this theme is someone who I don't want to socialise with, or indeed, have anywhere near my family. Especially not spoiling this excellent game (my partners favourite).


Well that's unfortunate. You may miss out on some very nice relationships. Oh well, you'll never know...
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Thomas Lund
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Umbratus wrote:
As for a christian theme, consider thinking of this as crusading and evangelizing campaign.

..

I wonder what is more evil, the original theme or the christian one whistle


Thanks this made my day. Sometimes more religious types (of whatever religion) seem to forget their own past.

/T
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Frank Franco
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Is this a joke?
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Tiago Nunes
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Umbratus wrote:
As for a christian theme, consider thinking of this as crusading and evangelizing campaign.

Cultists are missionary monks that you send to regions in order to force the locals convert to your religion.

Draconic laws and sanctions are issued in the form of chaos cards. Sent the inquisition (warriors) or your god himself (demon) if that is not enough.

Now you have your christian game

I wonder what is more evil, the original theme or the christian one whistle


That was just awesome. And seeing as I get bombarded everyday by 2 or 3 different god worshipping religions this would't be far from the truth.
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Andrew Hurp
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Redward wrote:
Fabs wrote:
I think the best part of the theme is that anyone who is actually going to be offended by this theme is someone who I don't want to socialise with, or indeed, have anywhere near my family. Especially not spoiling this excellent game (my partners favourite).


Well that's unfortunate. You may miss out on some very nice relationships. Oh well, you'll never know...

Nope. Over 40 years experience of life has all confirmed to me that someone who can find something so trivial as genuinely obscene, would be an unrewarding relationship.
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Patar Absurdus the Shananigator
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ThomasLund wrote:
Umbratus wrote:
As for a christian theme, consider thinking of this as crusading and evangelizing campaign.

..

I wonder what is more evil, the original theme or the christian one whistle


Thanks this made my day. Sometimes more religious types (of whatever religion) seem to forget their own past.

/T


Anyone who would attempt to force conversion and use draconic laws and sanctions is not acting as a Christian follower of Christ but in their own interest. Some historical group who behaved in an evil manner may call themselves Christians but that doesn't mean that they have anything to do with my past.
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Pedro Pereira
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Redward wrote:
Firstly there is nothing wrong with being offended by a theme


If this were to be true, you wouldn't have to write it...

Redward wrote:
Some of the comments from the games defenders on other posts seem a bit patronizing and that's pretty uncool.


Apparently, a matter of religious perspective...
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Miljenko Murkovic
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Why do you think Christians are likely being offended by this game? I just can't understand connection you are making? Is there something in a Bible that is preventing you from playing bad character in a GAME?? Do you think you are a bad person if you pretend to be one in a GAME?? This is just sill to me... Do you think people that are offended are also offended by WWII games? Playing Hitler is also offensive, right? Or taking Assassin character in Citadels??
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miljenko wrote:
Why do you think Christians are likely being offended by this game? I just can't understand connection you are making? Is there something in a Bible that is preventing you from playing bad character in a GAME?? Do you think you are a bad person if you pretend to be one in a GAME?? This is just sill to me... Do you think people that are offended are also offended by WWII games? Playing Hitler is also offensive, right? Or taking Assassin character in Citadels??


I agree with you about why I couldn't imagine finding myself being offended by a game like this. It IS pretend. Still, you shouldn't have to look very long on BGG to find people offended by a game's theme. I think Redward was just making space for people who care not to play CitOW themselves because it MIGHT for them seem to trivialize an issue for them they might be sensitive about for whatever reason. He also suggests that it isn't cool if they try to force those sensitivities to be respected in the tastes of others. It's all about making space for others to exist here.

Personally, I like dark themes in games: Arkham Horror, Claustrophobia and CitOW. I also think your comparison to violence in other contexts is a useful one: why would one offended by these not also get offended by Axis and Allies? The only game element that gives me slight pause is the torture mechanic in Earth Reborn but I love the game so much I have to overlook my squeamishness about it.

The only point of Redward's I disagree with is his suggestion that the theme bleeds off (ahem). I find CitOW to be one of the most successful marriages of theme and mechanic ever. As you're playing each god, it FEELS like that particular god. Moreover, you are rewarded by acting thematically within the game (running away from Khorne, trying to stop the spread of Nurgle, etc.). The mechanics are both informed by the theme and generate it.
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Mark Bigney
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I am deeply offended every time I see someone type contraversy. When will my feelings be respected?
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Joel Schuster
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It is obvious why some Christians are bothered by this games theme.

Guilty conscience for being reminded of their evil past
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James
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Gyges wrote:
I am deeply offended every time I see someone type contraversy. When will my feelings be respected?


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Michael Jordal
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I think this needs moved to RSP ASAP
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Pedro Pereira
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Umbratus wrote:
Guilty conscience for being reminded of their evil past


Seems to be the only plausible explanation to this contraversy controversy.
 
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Pedro Pereira
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Brother Jim wrote:
I think his OP was actually refreshingly civil on this issue, don't you?


Feels more unrefreshingly redundant to me... but then again... no one asked for my opinion...
 
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David Tolin
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What an incredibly depressing thread... soblue
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On this topic particularly, in case any of you were wondering...

Geekdo Community Rules


Community Rules


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I believe the OP was specifically asking if people thought Chaos in the Old World theme would be offensive to someone with Christian sensativities, if this thread could keep the discussion to along these lines that would be a good idea and not use it as a venue for religion bashing.

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Richard Morris
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OK, well in what is, I hope, the right spirit, I will go back and delete my posts. Of course, that will only be effective if those that quote it, or any replies to it, do the same.
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