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Subject: Cylon victory without revealing! rss

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Juan F T
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After a long time, I played BSG again, and it was quite fun.

First, I have to mention that we played a 4-player game, so this was the perfect time to try a new Sympathizer variant, proposed by MasterDinadan found here. I changed his proposal a little, and included an additional "Not a Cylon" card in the sleeper deck, in order to obtain a 50/50 chance for the Symp to end up as a cylon. Everyone loved the idea, and it seemed a lot more interesting than the original. It worked quite well, since everyone was in the dark after the Sleeper phase. Check that variant out, and give it a try! Highly recommended.

Second, this is the first game I find where the cylons are able to control the game without revealing! They could have won without revealing at all, but the game was taking too long, so they decided to reveal and doom humanity.

Here is the story:

1 newbie and 3 experienced players started the game: Zarek, Helo, Baltar and Lee Adama (me). I wanted to be a human player and try to win as a human, but after the first loyalty cards were dealt, I found the truth: I was the sympathizer (check the variant rules to understand why this happened). So, I was not sure for what team I was playing. I decided to help humans as much as I could. In the end, I was going to be accused of being a cylon anyway after the Sleeper phase, so I needed to show my "good intentions". Everything started working great. We controlled cylon attacks, plenty of resources, and nothing too strange. Except for one thing: After the first 4 turns, 2 players already knew 2 other player's loyalty cards. Helo learned that I was the symp, and Baltar looked at Helo's. Helo protected me saying "we are safe from now", but we were not sure about him. And for some reason, President Baltar was not playing his Quorum cards...

We got to the Sleeper phase. They all seemed too human. I was sure there was a cylon among us, but did not know who... And then I revealed as the Symp, was sent to the brig and looked at the remaining loyalty cards: No cylon from the start, so I was going to play for the cylons! Now I had to discover who was going to be the other cylon.

Then, Zarek argued that Baltar just did not use his Quorum cards, Baltar said they were not very good. Zarek proposed a new President: him! We all agreed (it seemed a good idea and a good argument), and he was elected. Baltar seemed to be the cylon, but we all suspected Zarek for that move...

And then, something happened: in a particular crisis, Helo used a lot of cards, and we failed terribly. I thought I found the cylon. Since I was in the brig, the only chance to cause a lot of damage was to use Executive Orders on Helo so he could reveal and strike (since I was in the Brig). But turn after turn, he used those actions to help the humans!! I did not get that. Why not to reveal??? Did I miss something during that crisis?

Then I was lost again. Who was the cylon? Helo was able to look at Zarek's loyalty card. We never knew what he saw, but I think he found the "Not a Cylon" card, since he never accused him. I was supposed to be a cylon, so no one helped me to get out of prison... Except for Zarek, the new president! He got me out of prison! Then it was obvious: He was the cylon. So they quickly sent him to the brig. And I decided to sent Baltar to the brig too.

So, with 1 human and the cylon Symp were free, and 1 cylon and 1 human in the brig, the NOT revealed cylon president acted: He gave me the Admiral title!! The 2 cylons, not revealed, had both titles. Total control over the fleet, with only 6 distance traveled. It was too powerful to let go, so I decided to send Helo (only human left) also to the brig.

It was only a matter of time with that situation, the humans were doomed. It took a little too long to get Zarek out of the brig, but we did. In the meantime, every resource was hit, and in the last turn, we both revealed, leaving the humans without resources and both players in the brig! It was like sending the fleet right into the yellow sun, with everyone inside!!


Still took too long to play (almost 4 hours). But a great game, specially since everyone agreed that this Sympathizer variant worked. No longer the player getting that card had to auto reveal in Sleeper phase. It was like playing in my own team. And I was so sure that there was a cylon from the start, that I helped the humans a lot at first... but finding the truth in the middle of the game was like a revelation. Totally changed the game, and we managed to control the fleet without even revealing. Very well played for the cylons!!! The newbie liked it so much he now wants the game.

Next time, we will try my new Exodus Expansion, and I hope I end up being human...

So say we all!!

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Mooseared Ferenczy
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Sounds awesome. I played a 5p game where something similar happened. I was playing Cally from Exodus and my friend was Batlar and we were the only people capable of drawing politics and engineering in the game. The rest of the crew was Cain, Kat and Helo. Baltar and I wound up controlling all three Exodus titles and plummeted their morale in a couple of turns. (We also managed to damage all the vipers and use ever player's OPG). Baltar and I never revealed, though I was considering doing it because I drop morale by 1 on a reveal.
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Filip Cam
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Great report!

I was trying to geekmail you this but it's not working so I put it here...


Hi Juan,

I'm trying to understand this thing you posted:
---
Also, I feel that in a 4-player game, the odds for the Symp to end up as a cylon are too high. 50/50 is better for me, so I tweaked the original setup and added 1 Not a Cylon card to the Sleeper deck.
---
Imo, the variant as it is has an almost exact 50% chance (1/7 + 1/6 + 1/5) of a cylon at the start, and hence also a 50% chance of the sympathizer becoming a cylon.

In any case, I don't see how adding an extra Not-a-cylon card to the sleeper deck would have any influence (the Sympathizer will just have to discard it before dealing that deck, or he risks being left with a cylon card).

Did I get something wrong?
 
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Juan F T
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Filip, thanks!

I also had to ask someone in that thread how he got some of the numbers he mentions. May be I also got it wrong, so I understand
 
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Filip Cam
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Your mail made it all clear, thx Great tweak of the variant which I'm adopting right away.
 
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Stanisław Krawczyk
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Could you please share the nefarious contents of the aforementioned mail here (or in a private message)? I'm also thinking about using this variant in my game and I've encountered exactly the same doubts as Filip Cam has. My impression is that in this version of the game, it is only the starting deck (the loyalty deck) that determines who is a cylon and who is not. Where am I wrong? Thanks a lot in advance! :-)
 
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Filip Cam
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Below is the mail.

Some day when I have lots of time I'm gonna put nice summaries of the USV and ASV in the files section.



Subject: [BGG] BSG variant
From: Hav0k
----------------------------------------------
Hi!

I hope you get this message, so please let me know if you do.

I will try to explain how I got my numbers:

In a 4 player game using that variant, you need a total of 9 cards (2 cylon, 1 symp, 6 human). Loyalty deck needs 4 cards, one of them is the Symp, so you have 3 unknown. Sleeper deck needs 5, one of them is a Cylon, so you have 4 unknown.

You are left with 1 cylon card that can end up in 7 possible slots (3 in loyalty deck + 4 in sleeper deck), and will determine the Symp loyalty.

3 of those slots correspond to the Loyalty deck, that is 3/7 = 43%, meaning the Symp will NOT be a cylon

4 correspond to the Sleeper deck, so 4/7 = 57% of having the second cylon card in the sleeper deck, and then the Symp will be a cylon.

If I change that and add a human card to the Sleeper deck, I reduce 1 possible slot for that cylon card, ending with 3 slots in the Loyalty deck, and 3 in the Sleeper deck, so a 50/50 chance.

Those this help?
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