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Subject: Starcraft Invasions (Solitaire game) now available rss

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Eric Pietrocupo
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HI

The solitaire version of Starcraft is now complete and available. You will be able to download the package from BGG once the files gets accepted. While waiting, you can download them from my page here (get the latest version).

http://bgd.lariennalibrary.com/index.php?n=Variants.Variants...

I hope you enjoy the game and leave some feedback.

Have Fun!
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Joshua Love
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I'll have to check this out. Looks a lot more well planned than my AI. I got about half way into the rules and I don't think I have any questions about them yet, but probably will when I try them out.
Thanks for posting!
 
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James W
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Looking forward to this! Can you post again on this thread when the files are uploaded?
 
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Eric Pietrocupo
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The files are available on the link above, but if you absolutely want to take them from BGG, I can post agains once the files gets accepted.

I might make a minor change to "Spawn broodling" ability to make it destroy any ground unit because the unit list on the original card does not make sense (no common criteria) and has not been modified with the BW expansion.

The there might be a mini-update in the days to come.
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James W
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larienna wrote:

The files are available on the link above, but if you absolutely want to take them from BGG, I can post agains once the files gets accepted.


That would be great!

larienna wrote:

I might make a minor change to "Spawn broodling" ability to make it destroy any ground unit because the unit list on the original card does not make sense (no common criteria) and has not been modified with the BW expansion.

The there might be a mini-update in the days to come.


I do not have the card in front of me, but if it works like the game, then Spawn Broodling can only target units that have a 'Biological' component.

For example, it can kill Siege Tanks because of the driver inside, but not Archons or Reavers. The spell makes perfect sense.
 
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Eric Pietrocupo
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Quote:
I do not have the card in front of me, but if it works like the game, then Spawn Broodling can only target units that have a 'Biological' component.


In the original game, there is a separation between mechanical and biological units. Now if you also include, mechanical units with biological components, it sure makes things much more complicated.

Still, the card has not been updated, so medic and dark templar are not in the list (which are pretty biological to me). Dragoons are in the list, but not Reavers. So does that means the Dragoons are piloted but not Reavers? I really doubt that since dragoons seem pretty automated to me.

The original list was: All terran and Zerg ground unit + zealot, dragoon, and high templar. Since it mixes mechanical and bio unit, I could not find the common point between these units besides the fact they are ground units. But reavers and archons were not there

Else I might say that it destroy 1 ground biological unit. It would be easier this way and make more sense.

 
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Eric Pietrocupo
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The files has been accepted here:

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/filepage/75412/starcraft-invasi...

But like I said, expect a minor update today or tommorrow.
 
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Gumsch
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Dragoons are in the list, but not Reavers. So does that means the Dragoons are piloted but not Reavers? I really doubt that since dragoons seem pretty automated to me.


Actually dragoons are supposed to be a bit of a hybrid - according to the original computer game mechanics, they are targetable by both the 'spawn broodlings' ability AND the ghost's ability to stop machines. (They are recycled protoss warriors, whose remains were put into a machine.) Reavers, on the other hand, are completely mechanical and therefore can be stopped by ghosts. They are just robotic war machines. It also makes sense that archons can't be targeted by either ability, as they are pure energy.

The distinction between mechanic and biological units has always seemed to be a bit strained to me, though. After all, you can target siege tanks and goliaths with 'spawn broodling' ... the in-game reason being something like 'the queen's acid can bite through the hull and release the spores there to affect the crew'. Yet you can't target flying units, even purely biological ones like the mutalisks.

As a simple rule of thumb: every ground unit EXCEPT the reaver, archon and dark archon ought to be able to be the victim of 'spawn broodling'. According to the computer game, at least.

By the way: Thanks for your solo variant. I'll check it out immediately!
 
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James W
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Gumsch wrote:
Quote:
Dragoons are in the list, but not Reavers. So does that means the Dragoons are piloted but not Reavers? I really doubt that since dragoons seem pretty automated to me.


Actually dragoons are supposed to be a bit of a hybrid - according to the original computer game mechanics, they are targetable by both the 'spawn broodlings' ability AND the ghost's ability to stop machines. (They are recycled protoss warriors, whose remains were put into a machine.) Reavers, on the other hand, are completely mechanical and therefore can be stopped by ghosts. They are just robotic war machines. It also makes sense that archons can't be targeted by either ability, as they are pure energy.

The distinction between mechanic and biological units has always seemed to be a bit strained to me, though. After all, you can target siege tanks and goliaths with 'spawn broodling' ... the in-game reason being something like 'the queen's acid can bite through the hull and release the spores there to affect the crew'. Yet you can't target flying units, even purely biological ones like the mutalisks.

As a simple rule of thumb: every ground unit EXCEPT the reaver, archon and dark archon ought to be able to be the victim of 'spawn broodling'. According to the computer game, at least.

By the way: Thanks for your solo variant. I'll check it out immediately!


This, exactly.

Every Zerg unit is Biological so Spawn Broodling can target any Zerg ground unit.

Every Terran unit, regardless if it is Biological or Mechanical, has a 'Biological' component, such as a driver, except for Spider Mines. So Spawn Broodling can also target any Terran ground unit.

For the Protoss, the only units that do not have a Biological component include Probes, any unit created from the Robotics Facility (hence the name Robotics), Archons and Dark Archons (because they are made of pure energy) and Interceptors. In StarCraft II, Immortals break this formula because they are produced from the Robotics Facility and also contain a 'Biological' component.

Probes, Reavers, Observers, Shuttles and Interceptors have no 'Biological' component since they are purely mechanical objects.

Dragoons, however, contain the bodies of Protoss warriors who were crippled on the battlefield. Their minds control the movement of the Dragoon and this allows them to continue to give their lives for Aiur.

From this it is easy to see which Protoss units can be targeted by Spawn Broodling, namely any Protoss ground unit except Probes, Reavers, Archons and Dark Archons.

So the spell still makes sense. I still haven't looked at the card but if it was not updated for the Brood War expansion, then it should have been.
 
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James W
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larienna wrote:

Else I might say that it destroy 1 ground biological unit. It would be easier this way and make more sense.


Also, don't do this. If you change the spell so that it can only target Biological units instead of units with 'Biological' components, then you are eliminating one of the best tactical moves from the game.

There's nothing more satisfying than to fly in a control group of Queens and tearing up a fortified position of Siege Tanks in mere seconds with cloned Spawn Broodling spells.
 
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Eric Pietrocupo
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I have changed it for all ground units exceept Archon, Dark Archon and Reaver. (Probes are not a unit in the board game).
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James W
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I know. I only mentioned it for completeness.

Also, I don't think many people knew that Spawn Broodling could not target probes.
 
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Martin Plourde
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I will try this soon
 
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Eric Pietrocupo
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The 1.2 update is now available on my website:

http://bgd.lariennalibrary.com/index.php?n=Variants.Variants...

The files has been submitted on BGG, so the update should arrive soon.

The modifications are the queen like discussed in this thread, and some restriction when attacked by sacrifice units.

Enjoy!
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Victor Kostin
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Hi!
Will finally try this variant today.

The only thing I don't like in your dice system is that the possibility of a "1" die result is 17%. Which is too high for a natural fault. While in a two-dice system, the probability of getting (2 or 12) is just 5,4%. Which is much closer to standart "1" on a 20-sided dice.

Speaking about all the other aspects of the game I have to say you've made a really huge job and I can't avoid admiring you!
 
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Eric Pietrocupo
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I am happy to hear that somebody played and liked the variant.

As for the odds for rolling a 1, consider that even if there is 20 cards, the odds are not 1/20 chance not to draw a matching card. It is very complicated to evaluate the real odds since:

- Players draw multiple cards
- Some cards can be used for multiple unit types
- Used card takes some time before getting reshuffled.
- Attacker and defender change the nb of cards drawn
- Racial abilities change the cards drawn
- Event cards change the cards drawn

Unless you were very lucky and rolled a lot of 1, I don't think the game would be too easy.
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Mårten Cederholm
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One thing I cannot understand.
When you draw an Attack card, can the enemy units move to another planet?
 
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Eric Pietrocupo
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Quote:
One thing I cannot understand.
When you draw an Attack card, can the enemy units move to another planet?


NO, enemies attack only from an invasion point, or from territory to territory on same planet, but they never move from a planet to another.
 
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Mårten Cederholm
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So that means to get to ANOTHER planet they have to exceed invasion limit?
Basically if you are lucky then you can have 1-2 planets for "free"?

Also, you built on the active invasion point and on EVERY planet that the AI has units on?
So if I draw a building for Terran there will only be one marine on the active invasion point?

Also, it can take many turns before one of the AI factions even GET on a planet?

If a build comes up and a AI force can build at least ONE unit, will it still be made into an attack?
For example, zerg+zerg+hydralisk+queen is supposed to be built, but only hydralisk is available, what will happen?

If an attack gets made into a build because there are no units on the invasion point, do you still build where there is a base?

If I roll a 5 on marine, does it get 6/4 or 7/3?
 
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Eric Pietrocupo
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Quote:
So that means to get to ANOTHER planet they have to exceed invasion limit?


Yes, but there could be optional rules that once a planet is full, you are forces to move elsewhere

Quote:
Basically if you are lucky then you can have 1-2 planets for "free"?


Consider that you fight against 2 factions, so eventually, one of the faction is going to invade the third planet. That is what happened in the last game. Because invasion points beign occupied by ennemies restrict the possible invasion path, and eventually, only the 3rd planet will be available for invade. The only drawback is that you are going to lack of units. I might make unit tokens.

See my recent game session here where the AI owned us:

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/938206/starcraft-invasio...

Quote:
Also, you built on the active invasion point and on EVERY planet that the AI has units on?


In fact is on each planet where there is a base. When troops have landed on a planet, the next action will always make them build a base. Then they can do regular Build/attack/research actions.

Quote:
So if I draw a building for Terran there will only be one marine on the active invasion point?


Eh! NO, if Terran has an invasion point and a base on a planet, with no upgrade at all, then 3 marines are placed on the invasion point and 3 marines are placed on the base. so 6 marine total are played. Yes it multiplies fast.

Quote:
If a build comes up and a AI force can build at least ONE unit, will it still be made into an attack?


I think it's the opposite, if a AI has no unit to Attack, it get changed as a build. But that might be used as an optional rule to make the game harder.

Quote:
For example, zerg+zerg+hydralisk+queen is supposed to be built, but only hydralisk is available, what will happen?


First the order should by hydralisk, queen, zergling, zergling. When you are lacking of a certain type of units you should use the lower unit (no more queen, then zergling). But when you are lacking of the lowest unit (zergling), you still need to place some zergling. This is where you start to lack of units, but it should not happen often unless the AI is winning like in the game mentioned above. Simply use generic tokens and consider them as zergling.

Quote:
If an attack gets made into a build because there are no units on the invasion point, do you still build where there is a base?


If you convert the order, each base an invasion point will behave differently. If a base has unit it will attack. If an invasion point has unit while the other does not, one will attack and the other will build. So the order get swithched to a build only for the base invasion points that cannot attack.

Quote:
If I roll a 5 on marine, does it get 6/4 or 7/3?


"Stim pack" like "chitaneous plating" are effect that all ways work. They are there in case some special power or ability would cancel those card. But I don't think they are any.

I think It would be time to update the rules. I'll see what I can do later.



 
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Mårten Cederholm
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I knew I was making a lot of mistakes, it was simply to easy.
Appreciate the fast answer.

So every time where is a Build, whatever units that AI can build it was always build three?

I'm gonna move to game to so that I can always have this setup, when I learn the rules correctly I will gladly give you feedback that you MIGHT be able to use in some way .
 
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Eric Pietrocupo
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Quote:
So every time where is a Build, whatever units that AI can build it was always build three?


Yes, always a full set of unit of 3, +1 Zergling for zerg, but only 2 units for protoss.

Quote:
I will gladly give you feedback that you MIGHT be able to use in some way .


Of course, always useful to simplify or clarify rules.
 
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Mårten Cederholm
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Just one more questions before I go to sleep .

When an attack card comes there are four scenarios:
You as a player have;
1. No units/base
2. Units
3. Units+Base
4. Base

What happens:
1. Get's converted into Build, this affects every planet that the AI either has units/base and invasion point.
2. You randomly select an area, if your troops are in this you get attacked, otherwise not.
3. AI attacks base.
4. AI attacks base.

Thanks in advance


EDIT: If AI attacks from Invasion, wins but exceeds unit allowance. Will it go back to invasion point or to a free area within the planet?
 
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Eric Pietrocupo
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Quote:
EDIT: If AI attacks from Invasion, wins but exceeds unit allowance. Will it go back to invasion point or to a free area within the planet?


I think it move back unless there is free space on the planet. Not sure, would need to recheck the rules.

as for your scenarios:


1. No units waiting at the active invasion point: Convert as a build.
2. Units waiting on an invasion point: Attack a random location
3. Units landed on a planet: Build a base
4. Units and a base on a planet: Attack the player's base or random occupied territory.
5. Empty Base: Convert as a build.
 
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Oscar Korz
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larienna wrote:
Quote:
If I roll a 5 on marine, does it get 6/4 or 7/3?


"Stim pack" like "chitaneous plating" are effect that all ways work. They are there in case some special power or ability would cancel those card. But I don't think they are any.


I too found this confusing. I'm not aware of any ability that would cancel a technology non-reinforcement card. Therefore, I would suggest removing the lesser values, e.g. 6/4, form the sheet.

I really enjoyed these rules. I'm impressed with how well you managed to keep the feel of the game. Unfortunately, halfway through my first game I realized I was resolving Attack actions incorrectly in the AI's favor; so, I'll have to give this another shot. Zerg AI sure seem to overwhelm the board. surprise
 
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